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Battlestar Galactica: Exodus Expansion» Forums » Rules

Subject: Unofficial FAQ discussion rss

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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
BTW, as I'm adding these to the Wiki... What were you trying to ask with the viper question? I don't recall any way to ACTIVATE a MANNED viper, and the question about when viper pilots could land was already in the FAQ...
 
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
K, added the questions that were questions (no offense, but Ellen Tigh taking the CAG is not a real question--it doesn't SAY she can take the CAG and there's no general rule that says "abilities which refer to the Admiral also refer to the CAG" so I don't see that was ever in doubt).

I paraphrased heavily, trying to simplify both Q&A down to their core essentials.
 
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ackmondual
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
GerryRailBaron wrote:
ackmondual wrote:

Q: The Lion's Head Nebula destination card says to start the jump prep track 2 spaces forward from the start. The rulebook states to reset the jump prep track when the battle of the Ionian Nebula takes place, so this effectively negates the advantage of that destination card?
A: The Lion's Head Nebula Destination Card states "After the Reset Jump Preparation Track step of this jump, advance the Jump Preparation track by 2." The Reset Jump Preparation Track step (although technically skipped as per the instructions of setting up the Battle of the Ionian Nebula) takes place after the Kobol Instructions step, during which players resolve the Crossroads Phase.


I still need my rulesbooks to comprehend this. Can anyone make this a simple:
a) Yes, the Lion's Head benefit is ignored, start at Start
or
b) Yes, the Lion's Head benefit applies, advance the Jump Track by 2.

Gerry
Thank goodnes! I thought I would be the only one. Yeah, I needed to compare those passages in the rulebooks side-by-side to help me get this. I was gonna reask that, but being a boardgamer with some pride, I figured I should try to make sense of that first. That, and someone said that Tim/FFG have some new game out, so he'll likely be swamped with that. The turnaround rate was 1 week from the time I asked the questions, so not that bad really given all that I asked.

BTW, it should be "A"


selwyth wrote:
Wtf that's one crappily-worded answer!

a) IGNORE the Lion's Head benefit.

When you reach the Lion's Head destination, it says to jump prep +2.

But later on in the Battle of Ionian Nebula, it says to reset the jump track.

Et Voila!

Think of it this way: both New Caprica and Ionian Nebula destinations want to give a climactic final space battle in the end instead of the rinse-and-repeat Kobol. There's no way you're shortchanging that battle through Lion's Head or Legendary Discovery. This wasn't an issue in New Caprica at all since neither of those cards can shorten the climactic final battle.


Actually, reread the card, because that's what everyone was saying and I don't think that's why Lion's Head Nebula gets nerfed. That, or the wording is being very subtle. That destination card says...
Lose 4 fuel. After resetting the jump track, advance it 2 spaces towards the end.

Page 13 in base game rulebook...
Quote:
Jumping the Fleet
In Battlestar Galactica, moving ships at faster-than-light
(FTL) speed is referred to as “jumping.” Whenever the fleet
jumps, the Admiral draws Destination Cards to determine
where the fleet jumps to. To choose the destination, the
Admiral performs the following steps:
1. Remove Ships: Remove all ships from the game board
(see “Jumping During Combat” on page 25).
2. Choose Destination: The Admiral draws two cards from
the Destination deck, chooses one, and places the other
on the bottom of the deck.
3. Follow Instructions: The Admiral places the chosen card
faceup next to the Kobol Objective Card and follows any
instructions on the Destination Card.
4. Kobol Instructions: If the previous step causes the total
distance on Destination Cards placed adjacent to the
Kobol Objective Card to equal or exceed four or eight for
the first time, then follow the instructions on the Kobol
Objective Card (see page 14).
5. Reset Jump Preparation Track: Move the fleet token to
the start space of the Jump Preparation track.


So you draw Lion's Head Nebula (LHN) destination card on step 3. It's telling you that after you reset the jump prep track (which will occur in step #5 here.) you move up the jump prep token +2 away from the start, so it's a duration type effect. That's why it works the way it should with when you get to 8+ distance with Kobol or any other normal jump.

.

For IN,
page 19 Exo rulebook...
Quote:
C. Move the fleet marker to the start space of the Jump
Preparation track. Note that this replaces the Reset Jump
Preparation Track step of “Jumping the Fleet.”


LHN tells you to move the jump prep marker +2 from the start after "resetting the jump track", but since that's been replaced with simply moving the fleet marker back, the duration effect of LHN never kicks in.

At least that's how I think I'm finally understand all of this shake

.

Now that you mention it, yeah... the wording is the same with the basegame rulebook, so if LHN was picked and that takes you to 7 distance, I do believe you start off the NC phase with the jump prep marker 2 away from the start. Can be a nice boon for the cylons if the humans needed more time to prep civvy ships. devil

Page 7 of Peg rulebook
Quote:
New Caprica Setup
...
7. Reset Fleet Marker: Place the fleet marker on the “Start”
space of the Jump Preparation track.
 
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
No, for NC, you resolve the jump fully, then start with the directions on Page 13 of the Pegasus rulebook, so you still reset. That and "reset fleet marker" is not the same step as "Reset Jump preparation" and this game is VERY literal.
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ackmondual
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
InfoCynic wrote:
K, added the questions that were questions (no offense, but Ellen Tigh taking the CAG is not a real question--it doesn't SAY she can take the CAG and there's no general rule that says "abilities which refer to the Admiral also refer to the CAG" so I don't see that was ever in doubt).


CAG getting brigged works just like the admiral getting brigged. I figure there could've been a connection they missed.

While many of our guesses about rules have gone the way we expected, everyone here has been wrong about something. Even you. However, some more than others.

InfoCynic wrote:
BTW, as I'm adding these to the Wiki... What were you trying to ask with the viper question? I don't recall any way to ACTIVATE a MANNED viper, and the question about when viper pilots could land was already in the FAQ...
I didn't see it in the UFAQ at the time I sent it.

As for the other thing, I suppose I could be confusing the terminology, but a "viper activation" should be the same thing regardless of whether or not it's manned or unmanned. The only distinctions come from certain cases, like how Command location says 2 UNmanned viper activations (so you can't move a viper that Apollo or Kat is in via Command), while manned viper activations have to come from actions that a character manning those vipers have. IIRC, the rulebook mentions them as generic viper activations as well. The question was originally if someone XO-ed you while you were in a viper, can you shoot, then move back to Galactica from those 2 actions.
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
Well, I guess I never linked in my mind "viper activations" with "things you can do while piloting a viper"

Viper activate:
Launch
Move adj sector*
Attack in same sector

Pilot move:
Move adj sector*
Discard to land

Pilot action:
Move adj sector*
Attack in same sector
(any other normally legal action such as from a skill card, title, character sheet)

*1 or 2 sectors with Mark VIIs

If you don't try to connect them, there's less room for confusion.
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ackmondual
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
InfoCynic wrote:
No, for NC, you resolve the jump fully, then start with the directions on Page 13 of the Pegasus rulebook, so you still reset. That and "reset fleet marker" is not the same step as "Reset Jump preparation" and this game is VERY literal.


It's getting "too literal" for my tastes. Well, having folks like you who are good at this stuff, more "hazzah!"'s to BGG.


To all.... As a fun excercise, here's how the wordings all compare vs LHN meeple

Lose 4 fuel. After resetting the jump track, advance it 2 spaces towards the end.

base game (generic + Kobol)
Reset Jump Preparation Track: Move the fleet token to
the start space of the Jump Preparation track.

Pegasus (reaching New Caprica)
Reset Fleet Marker: Place the fleet marker on the “Start”
space of the Jump Preparation track.

Exodus (reaching Ionian Nebula)
Move the fleet marker to the start space of the Jump
Preparation track. Note that this replaces the Reset Jump
Preparation Track step of “Jumping the Fleet.”

EDIT: Added... you still use the base game steps for normal jumps in the expansions. It's only when you hit those distances where the differences come in.
 
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ackmondual
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
InfoCynic wrote:
Well, I guess I never linked in my mind "viper activations" with "things you can do while piloting a viper"

Viper activate:
Launch
Move adj sector*
Attack in same sector

Pilot move:
Move adj sector*
Discard to land

Pilot action:
Move adj sector*
Attack in same sector
(any other normally legal action such as from a skill card, title, character sheet)

*1 or 2 sectors with Mark VIIs

If you don't try to connect them, there's less room for confusion.
I gotta admit... I'm not sure if "viper activation" is the same thing as "activating a viper" (the base game rulebook does NOT use the former term), but as I'm a bit over my head here, I'm gonna say they're close enough

As for your suggestion, not a bad one, but still... Too late One person who first played with Exodus + CFB also always thought that "viper activation" only related to "manned viper activation", so when he read in the rulebook that...
Quote:
Viper Activation
When any player activates a viper, he now has the option to
escort a civilian ship to safety instead of moving or attacking
with it.
When a player uses a viper activation to escort a
civilian ship, he chooses one civilian ship in the viper’s space
area and shuffles the civilian ship back into the pile of unused
civilian ships.


He went much of that game thinking that only a manned viper can escort a civvy. It didn't matter for that game, but this kind of thing is good to know for future games.
 
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Joseph Cochran
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
InfoCynic wrote:
Well, I guess I never linked in my mind "viper activations" with "things you can do while piloting a viper"


Actually, it's:

Viper activate:
Launch if not in space
Move adj sector*
Attack in same sector
Escort civilian ship**

Pilot move:
Move adj sector*
Discard to land

Pilot action:
Activate his own Viper (see above)
(any other normally legal action such as from a skill card, title, character sheet)

*1 or 2 sectors with Mark VIIs
** When playing with CFB option

Edit: added "if not in space"
 
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
True, I forgot escort.

But you shouldn't try to recurse from Pilot action to Viper activate, because by your logic, I could launch as an action while already piloting a viper.

Viper activate:
Launch
Move adj sector*
Attack in same sector
Escort civilian ship**

Pilot move:
Move adj sector*
Discard to land

Pilot action:
Move adj sector*
Attack in same sector
Escort civilian ship**
Any other normally legal action such as from a skill card, title, character sheet

*1 or 2 sectors with Mark VIIs
** When playing with CFB option
 
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
ackmondual: wrote:
As for your suggestion, not a bad one, but still... Too late One person who first played with Exodus + CFB also always thought that "viper activation" only related to "manned viper activation", so when he read in the rulebook that...(snip)

He went much of that game thinking that only a manned viper can escort a civvy. It didn't matter for that game, but this kind of thing is good to know for future games.


I have an otherwise very good player in my group who tried playing Apollo in her second Exodus game and it took halfway through the game before she understood that escorting civvies wasn't just a CAG action (but that did explain to her why it wasn't on the card). Her head was constantly spinning from the stunts we were pulling:
Me: "I XO Tigh in Command"
Tigh: "I activate Command. A: Launch a viper in Sector 5."
Apollo: "OK, I'll go out on it."
Rest of humans: "No don't, trust us."
Apollo: {quizzical look}
Tigh: "B: Launch another viper in Sector 5."
Apollo: "Now can I go?"
Us: "Yes, go. Don't forget your CAG action, too."
So Apollo would wind up using his bonus action to take the CAG action to activate the unmanned viper (which is why he waits for the second launch) and then takes his real action, and then Tigh still has an entire action remaining, which might be to activate Command again.

It's a little overwhelming sometimes.
 
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Joseph Cochran
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
InfoCynic wrote:
True, I forgot escort.

But you shouldn't try to recurse from Pilot action to Viper activate, because by your logic, I could launch as an action while already piloting a viper.


No more than an unmanned viper can launch when it's already in space. If you want to change the "Launch" to "Launch if not in space", that's fine. But it seems obvious that since your Viper is already in space it cannot launch. By including it as an option in "Viper activate", you yourself are already making the assumption that invalidates recursion anyway.
 
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
I suppose, but there's NEVER a time when a Piloted Viper can launch, so it doesn't make sense to put it on the list at all. I can see it your way though.
 
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ackmondual
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
Update from Tim....

I spotted that people online are misinterpreting and mis-paraphrasing
the answer I gave in response to your question about the Lion's Head
Nebula.

"The Lion's Head Nebula Destination Card states "After the Reset Jump
Preparation Track step of this jump, advance the Jump Preparation
track by 2." The Reset Jump Preparation Track step (although
technically skipped as per the instructions of setting up the Battle
of the Ionian Nebula) takes place after the Kobol Instructions step,
during which players resolve the Crossroads Phase."

To take the steps of the jump in order:
1. Remove Ships: Remove all ships from the game board. If using the
Cylon Fleet option, use the rules specified in that section for
removing ships.
2. Choose Destination: The Admiral draws two cards from the
Destination deck, chooses one, and places the other on the bottom of
the deck. It would be at this point the Lion's Head Nebula card is
selected.
3. Follow Instructions: The instructions on the Lion's Head
Destination card tell players to "Lose 4 fuel. After the Reset Jump
Preparation Track step of this jump, advance the Jump Preparation
track by 2." Right now, players lose 4 fuel. They do not advance the
Jump Preparation track by 2 until after the Reset Jump Preparation
Track step.
4. Kobol Instructions: If this is when players have reached 8 distance
using the Ionian Nebula Objective, they resolve the Crossroads Phase
in full, including setting up the Battle of the Ionian Nebula, drawing
and resolving Crossroads Cards, and resolving "The Trial/Boxing the
Line." During the set up of the Battle of the Ionian Nebula, players
are instructed to return the fleet marker to the start space of the
Jump Preparation track in place of the Reset Jump Preparation Track
step.
5. Reset Jump Preparation Track: When players have just resolved the
Crossroads Phase, this step has been replaced by the set up of the
Battle of the Ionian Nebula and is skipped.

After the Reset Jump Preparation Track: Players advance the Jump
Preparation track by 2, even if the Reset Jump Preparation Track step
was skipped.

The Lion Nebula's advance to the Jump Preparation track always occurs
after the track has been reset, even when the Crossroad Phase is
resolved.

Hope that clears it up.

Thanks,

Tim Uren
Associate Producer




Thanks Tim!
~ackmondual
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David F
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
Tim Uren wrote:

......................................................................................................


*I fell asleep*

Quote:
....................................................................................................The Lion Nebula's advance to the Jump Preparation track always occurs
after the track has been reset, even when the Crossroad Phase is
resolved.


Hope that clears it up.
Yes, finally got it!
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
Mmkay. I can't imagine how anyone could have misinterpreted that other answer!

I think I'll update the wiki later to just say "yes and it's complicated" with a link here.
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
I updated the wiki for LHN and did some spring cleaning on it. Gone is the lengthy catch-all for General Rules other than a few questions that really are general. New are sections for Loyalty Card questions (amazingly enough with at least one question per game) and the section for Expansion Modules, which replaces the "Game board locations" section (some questions in the latter section were moved to other more relevant areas, like Sabotage vs discarding Treachery to move).

No questions were harmed in the process of this edit.
 
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Jonas T
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
InfoCynic wrote:
I have an otherwise very good player in my group who tried playing Apollo in her second Exodus game and it took halfway through the game before she understood that escorting civvies wasn't just a CAG action (but that did explain to her why it wasn't on the card). Her head was constantly spinning from the stunts we were pulling:
Me: "I XO Tigh in Command"
Tigh: "I activate Command. A: Launch a viper in Sector 5."
Apollo: "OK, I'll go out on it."
Rest of humans: "No don't, trust us."
Apollo: {quizzical look}
Tigh: "B: Launch another viper in Sector 5."
Apollo: "Now can I go?"
Us: "Yes, go. Don't forget your CAG action, too."
So Apollo would wind up using his bonus action to take the CAG action to activate the unmanned viper (which is why he waits for the second launch) and then takes his real action, and then Tigh still has an entire action remaining, which might be to activate Command again.

It's a little overwhelming sometimes.


Why not let Apollo launch on first viper, use his Cag action to launch the 2nd viper and have Tigh fiddle with that one ? I can't see why you persuaded Apollo to not launch
 
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Carl Bussema
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Re: Rules Answers (plus two errata)
I suppose it works either way now that you mention it. We hadn't really thought of using the CAG action to activate and launch a viper. In this case we were looking to evac a civvie in 5 as memory serves, so it would have worked either way (assuming we trust both Apollo and Tigh).
 
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Carl Bussema
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Battlestar Galactica: Exodus Expansion » Forums » Rules
Re: Unofficial FAQ discussion
When choosing actions at the basestar bridge, "you choose both actions at the same time and then resolve them one at a time." (Tim)
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ackmondual
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InfoCynic wrote:
When choosing actions at the basestar bridge, "you choose both actions at the same time and then resolve them one at a time." (Tim)
WOW! wow I can see that changing some decisions for some. Are there any others besides the ones below?

--putting out a civvy ship, but only if the track Pursuit track goes up
--putting out 3 raiders (on CFB), but only if the track Pursuit track goes up
--putting out 1 basestar (on CFB), but only if the track Pursuit track goes up
--If damaging Gal. succeeds, put out a civvy ship.
 
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Tables
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Got two questions:

What do you do with the "Medal of Distinction" Crisis if not using the CF module? It's not a CAG chooses, so the rules don't cover who places the Civvies

When a game effect allows someone to look at anyone's loyalty cards, OR the current player at e.g. one of the President or Admiral's loyalty cards when the current player is one of those titles, can they look at their own loyalty cards randomly? If yes then do final 5 effects resolve as normal?

I have a strange suspicion I know what the answer to #2 is (and it's no, don't be silly) but it'd be good to get a solid ruling on it.
 
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Todd Warnken
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I Eat Tables wrote:
Got two questions:

What do you do with the "Medal of Distinction" Crisis if not using the CF module? It's not a CAG chooses, so the rules don't cover who places the Civvies

When a game effect allows someone to look at anyone's loyalty cards, OR the current player at e.g. one of the President or Admiral's loyalty cards when the current player is one of those titles, can they look at their own loyalty cards randomly? If yes then do final 5 effects resolve as normal?

I have a strange suspicion I know what the answer to #2 is (and it's no, don't be silly) but it'd be good to get a solid ruling on it.


All of the final five cards say the effect happens when another player examines the card. Looking at your own card cannot cause the consequence.
 
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Carl Bussema
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I already submitted the loyalty cards question, just waiting now.

In the meantime, here's two fresh onesfrom Tim:

preventative policy DOES work for personal goals
Once the final jump has happened at end of game, loss of morale will not cause Dee to be executed

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David F
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If State of Emergency is played and a Cylon uses Caprica to play a Crisis Card, is the crisis and/or jump icon resolved immediately or at the end of the turn?

The Cavil OPG ruling says jump icon end of turn, but it might not make any sense anymore.

I've asked FFG but still no response.

This has already happened in two PBF games (144, 158).
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