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Twilight Imperium (Third Edition): Shattered Empire» Forums » Rules

Subject: Destroying a SD after combat... rss

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K S
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Do the following qualify for the 2VP PO " I destroyed a SD after combat this turn":

1) No spacebattle only planetary landing of GF on an opponents planet with only a SD?
2) No spacebattle only planetary landing of GF on an opponents planet with only a SD and a PDS?

Vanilla rulebook page 17 under "Invasion combat":
After the active player has landed one or more GF's during the Planetary Landings step....an Invasion Combat must be fought if the destination planet holds any Ground Force units .
 
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Scott Lewis
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I would say yes to both. I think the intent is that you destroyed the space dock after an invasion (as opposed to via cards, etc).
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K S
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Thank you for answering Sigma, and I do see your point but:

The intention might as well be that you need to defeat a force before you destroy the SD?
If you need to invade the planet, then a desruction by AC "Star of Death" after a spacebattle would not make you qualify for the objective?!

I agree that you of course can't use Local Unrest and Secret Industrial Agent...but wouldn't the wording be after invasion, if the intentions are as you describe?

Found this, that might back up your point of view:
Rulebook p.35 under "Agent":
If an Agent is part of a successful invasion combat(by landing on an enemy planet with GF) the active player may replace any SD and PDS....etc

And this happens even if there is no enemy GF on the planet and thereby no combat...

Still I would like to hear if anyone ever tried to get an official ruling on this.
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Scott Lewis
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The only way you are going to get an official ruling is to ask Corey Most of the folks who were frequent users of the ti3wiki forums don't really visit BGG much.

Personally, I think requiring combat to destroy the SD in this case is splitting hairs WAY too finely - something that I've never seen to be the case in TI3.
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K S
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Allright I'll do that. How/ where do I contact him...at FFG, but where exactly?

Thx
 
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Scott Lewis
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On the FFG pages, at the bottom is a "Rules Questions" link (it's kind of tiny). It will take you to a page that will let you submit your question, and Corey will answer when he can (sometimes it can take a couple weeks).
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Hector Flores
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sigmazero13 wrote:
I would say yes to both. I think the intent is that you destroyed the space dock after an invasion (as opposed to via cards, etc).


Just wanted to chime in and agree with Sigma here.
 
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K S
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sigmazero13 wrote:
On the FFG pages, at the bottom is a "Rules Questions" link (it's kind of tiny). It will take you to a page that will let you submit your question, and Corey will answer when he can (sometimes it can take a couple weeks).

Thx again.
Question sent. I'll post the answer here when I recieve it.
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K S
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Answer from Corey:

Hello Kristobal,

In order to fulfil this card, you must fight a ground combat against enemy units. Therefore #1, #2, and the star of death do NOT complete this objective.

Think that settles it :-)
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Scott Lewis
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Well, that's that.

I don't know that I like that answer, though. I don't like the objectives that have such ticky-tack exceptions.
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Łukasz K
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Well, it doesn't seem to be an exception.
According to the rules there were no combat, therefore the "after combat this turn" part of the objective evaluates to false. On the other hand, it should say 'Invasion Combat' in the objective text.
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Scott Lewis
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And that's the exception I was talking about. I'm not saying I don't see the point, but it turns this objective into a "You only score the points if this AND that AND the other thing but not those and that".

IE, the point is to destroy a space dock; adding the arbitrary "after combat only" just makes it... well, arbitrary. It means you score nothing for taking over an unprotected space dock, simply because the opponent decided to abandon it.

I don't like it because it means an opponent could prevent it by intentionally removing their ground forces from the planet. With Transfabrication, this becomes even more of a problem. If they saw the writing on the wall, they could simply scuttle all the GFs for the sole purpose of denying you the objective. (Which, by the way, was the reason that the FAQ changed that you can't scuttle units during the Status Phase until AFTER objectives, to prevent people from doing this for the Blockade objective).
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Łukasz K
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I think I can see your point. The objective feels unnatural. Additionally it seems to be overly complicated.
Anyway, I think it's not that bad after all
 
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K S
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I like the ruling to the point where you have to defeat units before you destroy the SD, but I still have a major problem:
This ruling means that if you win a spacebattle before you land troops to destroy the SD you don't qualify for the PO. The ruling makes it possible to clear the planet but keep spaceships in the system and furthermore continue to produce spaceships, and still the opponent can't get 2VP for destroying your dock.
I'm certain my group of players will agree to houserule that the exact wording of the card will count: Destroy a SD after combat: meaning defeat units before destruction.
 
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Hani Zaccarelli
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Maplewood
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I think I'm just going to set fire to that objective card, it's a waste of a perfectly good protector sleeve.
 
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Scott Lewis
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Twilight Imperium (Third Edition): Shattered Empire » Forums » Rules
Re: Destroying a SD after combat...
But if you use sleeves, then you can just write your own objective, put it in the sleeve with that card, and then when you shuffle you can still keep it secret!
 
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