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Twilight Imperium (Third Edition): Shattered Empire» Forums » Rules

Subject: High Alert token rss

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Bruce X
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If a player places the token in one of his systems, but all of his ships and planets in that system are destroyed/conquered, does the token go away? Or, rather, does it remain in that system (thus allowing the player to move anther fleet in on his turn and benefit from the token)?
 
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Ryan Hanson
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It would remain in the system.

The Warfare SC says:
Quote:
Place the High Alert token in a system.

So it would seem that the token is associated with a system rather than a fleet.

The rules on page 16 further explain how the system is placed on high alert:
Quote:
The new Warfare Strategy Card allows the active player to place one of his or her systems on “High Alert,” which is indicated with the High Alert token. All the players ships that are in the system on High Alert receive +1 movement and +1 to rolls during Space Combat.

And regarding the removal of the token:
Quote:
The token is removed at the start of the Status
Phase.

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Bruce X
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I did read all of those and that is the way that we played it; I would just like a clarification from the designer (because it doesn't seem to make sense).
 
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Dan
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If you don't mind my asking, without the Warfare I ability to remove a command counter from a system, how did you intent to move more ships there to use the high alert token?
 
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Richard Young
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The token would remain active in the system for potential use by any other player activating the system for whatever purpose. Depending on the specific circumstances, that could conceivably also include the original owner...
 
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Ryan Hanson
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ermd wrote:
I did read all of those and that is the way that we played it; I would just like a clarification from the designer (because it doesn't seem to make sense).

Seems clear to me. What specifically doesn’t make sense to you?


ytter wrote:
If you don't mind my asking, without the Warfare I ability to remove a command counter from a system, how did you intent to move more ships there to use the high alert token?

There is not necessarily a Command Counter in the system. Take this for example: Player A plays the Warfare SC and places the High Alert token in a system. Then Player B activates the system, moves ships into the system, and destroys all of Player A’s ships. The High Alert token would remain in that system. And, Player A has yet to activate the system. Because placing the High Alert token in a system does not activate the system. Later, on Player A’s next turn, he could activate the system that contains the High Alert token and move ships into the system to battle with Player B.


Bubslug wrote:
The token would remain active in the system for potential use by any other player activating the system for whatever purpose. Depending on the specific circumstances, that could conceivably also include the original owner...

Sorry, but this is completely wrong. The High Alert token only gives its benefits to the player that placed it.






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Bruce X
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It does not make any sense for anyone to get the benefit once the original player has been totally eliminated from the system.
I think that the rules should specifically address this case.
In the case in question, the original owner of the system and planet therein played the Warfare Strategy card and placed the high alert token in the system. It was then immediately invaded with loss of all of the original owner's ships and the planet was also invaded, thus totally wiping out all of the original owner's presence in the system. Since the High Alert token can only be placed in a system in which the owner has presence in the first place, it makes more sense to me that it be removed if the owning player is completely wiped out there.
The owning player of course never activated the system, so he activated it on his next turn, moved in ships and the combat resulted in total annihilation of both fleets...but the +1 modifier did make a difference in this instance
 
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Lyn Lee Fox
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Quote:
Since the High Alert token can only be placed in a system in which the owner has presence in the first place, it makes more sense to me that it be removed if the owning player is completely wiped out there.

If you read the actual text on the Warfare II Strategy Card, you'll find it makes no restriction at all about the system having to be one that you control. As I see it, this is enforced further by the fact that the description in the rulebook never mentions control of the system specifically. I think the fact that it says it "allows the active player to place one of his or her systems on High Alert", is most likely written how it is because there is never a reason you'd need to place the High Alert token on a system you don't control, not because you are not allowed to do so.

So... you can go ahead and place that Supernova on High Alert, but it's not going to benefit you to do so. ^^
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Stefan Hensel
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I got another question concerning High Alert.

Does the movement-bonus only count for the Ships that are in the system in HA -> this would mean they can leave the system with 2 movement.

ANd/or does it count for ships moving into the system in HA as well? -> this would mean that the player using HA might move into the system from 2 systems away (with units that have 1 movement).

I hope you understand what I mean And thx for yer help in advance
 
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Shawn
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Gordazul wrote:
I got another question concerning High Alert.

Does the movement-bonus only count for the Ships that are in the system in HA -> this would mean they can leave the system with 2 movement.

ANd/or does it count for ships moving into the system in HA as well? -> this would mean that the player using HA might move into the system from 2 systems away (with units that have 1 movement).

I hope you understand what I mean And thx for yer help in advance


The text on the card reads

"..Your ships in the system with the token gain +1 movement and + 1 on all combat rolls...."

This would lead me to the conclusion that ships moving into a system with high alert get no bonus until they are in the system. If you choose to move ships out you can move the token with them.

The way the card is worded makes me think that if you were to move some ships out of the system and leave behind the HA token those ships that moved(and left behind the token) would loose ALL their +1s(movement AND combat). UNLESS the player decides to move the HA token along WITH the ships thus preserving the bonuses of the token.

Anyone else think this is the case?

 
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Dan
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boris317 wrote:
The way the card is worded makes me think that if you were to move some ships out of the system and leave behind the HA token those ships that moved(and left behind the token) would loose ALL their +1s(movement AND combat). UNLESS the player decides to move the HA token along WITH the ships thus preserving the bonuses of the token.

Anyone else think this is the case?


That's what I would think. The bonus only applies to the ships currently in the system with a high alert token.
 
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Martin DeOlden
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You may move out of the system without taking the High Alert token with you and the ships that left have the +1 movement for their move. Once they have reached their destination they will no longer have +1 combat or movement as they are no longer with the High alert token. All ship that leave the system whether or not they take the token with them or not get the +1 movement. Only the ships that are with the token get the +1 combat bonus. From the new TI3 FAQ below

(2.1) Q: With the Warfare II High alert token, do ships which
start in the system of the token, but do not move with the token,
get the +1 movement bonus?
A: Yes.
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Steve Fowler
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I activate a sector with a tactical action, my token activated fleet moves to the activated sector and later in the round, some game effect removes the activation token off the fleet under the High Alert Token (HAT). Is the HAT able to move a second (or more) time?
When I read the text on the Strategy Card,it appears to me, no, the HAT could not move again.
I think I'll be in the minority here.
 
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Scott Lewis
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Fargofootball wrote:
I activate a sector with a tactical action, my token activated fleet moves to the activated sector and later in the round, some game effect removes the activation token off the fleet under the High Alert Token (HAT). Is the HAT able to move a second (or more) time?
When I read the text on the Strategy Card,it appears to me, no, the HAT could not move again.
I think I'll be in the minority here.

Yes, it can move again. The "this system" may change, but it's referring to the system containing the HAT. There's nothing that indicates that once it's moved, it can't move again.

Which part of the text leads you to believe you couldn't move it again?
 
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Steve Fowler
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After searching the errata (see below), I would agree it can move again. The errata is written in the way it should have been on the SC.






Q: With the Warfare II High alert token, do ships which start
in the system of the token, but do not move with the token, get
the +1 movement bonus?
A: Yes. At the start of an activation, all ships in a system with
the high alert token gain +1 movement for that activation. This
bonus is regardless of whether or not you decide to move the
token with the ships.
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Scott Lewis
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I disagree that the "errata" you describe was even an errata or necessary. The original text said:

"High Alert: Place the High Alert token in a system. Your ships in the system with the token gain +1 movement and +1 on all combat rolls. If you move any ships from this system, you may move the token with them. Remove the token from the board at the start of the next Status Phase."

The question would be, what is "this system"? Based on the context of the previous sentence, it seems clear to me that "this system" is "the system with the token", and not necessarily only the system you placed it in initially, since then "this" would be referring to something two sentences away, skipping the intervening sentence.
 
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Steve Fowler
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The errata rids the text of "Clintonian" double speak, which plagues the whole rules as written.

The errata also clearly shows "at the start of an activation" (notice no "the") the token goes into effect and it could be subject to more than one activation.

Hand me the gun (only one)
hand me a gun (one of many)
hand me that gun (one specific)

all mean something different.

 
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Scott Lewis
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Twilight Imperium (Third Edition): Shattered Empire » Forums » Rules
Re: High Alert token
Fargofootball wrote:
The errata rids the text of "Clintonian" double speak, which plagues the whole rules as written.

The errata also clearly shows "at the start of an activation" (notice no "the") the token goes into effect and it could be subject to more than one activation.

Hand me the gun (only one)
hand me a gun (one of many)
hand me that gun (one specific)

all mean something different.


They do indeed, but I don't see how that analogy relates to Warfare II. The only potentially confusing word is "this" for "this system", and "this" can be inferred from the most recent system discussed - in this case, the system containing the HAT.

The FAQ clarifies the meaning, but I don't see any rules that were changed in that clarification.
 
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