It is a truth universally acknowledged that an American male in possession of his critical faculties must deride all films about romantic love.
The term "chick flick," narrowly construed, refers only to a film that appeals to female viewers but not to males. But more often than not in practice, the term "chick flick" means a love story - a film detailing the twists and turns of dating, engagements, marriage, and/or other emotional/physical entanglements.
Speaking as an American male, I’d like to say that I am not averse to films about male-female relationships -- even though it’s true that, yes, I loathe the vast majority of films described as "chick flicks."
It’s not the subject matter that I abhor; rather, it’s the way that it’s treated in those films. I dislike films that expect me to believe in two characters’ mutual adoration simply because violins well up when they gaze at one another. I dislike films that try to get me to buy into climactic scenes without developing a relationship enough to give those scenes any meaning. I dislike films in which the characters seem to have no guiding purposes in their lives other than contemplating who is involved with whom. I dislike films that treat something as complex and torturous as adult love as worthy of nothing more than the most trite directorial clichés. I dislike films that brazenly sweep aside every complication of real life for the purpose of facilitating the main characters’ convenient union. Personally, I’ve had what I imagine is a pretty typical romantic lifetime ranging from glorious, cherished moments to tragic, heartbreaking disappointments, and I resent it when romantic involvement on film seems so much more banal and trivial even than the real-world experience of a typical guy.
Thus, there are plenty of "chick flicks" I find infuriatingly awful. "Pretty Woman" -- dreck. "The English Patient" -- oh, please. "Sleepless in Seattle" -- ecch. "Jerry Maguire" -- OK at isolated moments, but not at all because of the romance. And these aren’t even the worst offenders. . . there’s "Waitress" (don’t get me started) or that shameless collection of every cinematic banality ever concocted, the criminally cheesy "Love, Actually," the recollection of which still causes me to clench with rage years after having seen it.
As it happens, the other day I was engaged in a conversation about films, in which I was put on the spot: so which films do I consider to be great love stories? That’s actually quite a good question. So here goes.
It takes a lot more guts to praise such films than it does to condemn them. So, come on, you overwhelmingly male BGG denizens. It’s time to step up to the plate and to confess to the cinematic love stories that you like. And, for the benefit of the group, explain what makes them great. (Obviously, I’m hoping that our female BGGers will comment as well.)
Okay, yes, the special effects are primarily camera tricks from most horror movies, and Keanu Reeves was horribly miscast as Jonathan Harker. That being said, both Gary Oldman's Dracula and Winona Rider's Mina Harker have moments so touching together, and some so sensual, that you totally forget that Dracula is a hideous, murdering machine. The whole premise is that of Van Helsing's desire to catch the evil Count, and it really takes a while to get there, but the love story beneath all the death and despair is one that really grabs hold. For Dracula to see the reincarnation of his lost love, and to win her over is done really well.
At its heart, it truly is a great love story, and not some typical monster movie.
First, let me get the obvious out of the way: I'm not a guy. But I'm also not a girlie-girl, and typically don't go for chick-flicks.
That said, I can also be sentimental. I think this Pixar film, showing romance between two star-crossed robots, is a beautiful depiction of love. When we see that all WALL-E really wants is someone to hold hands with, and share a life with . . . what could be more human? A kids' flick that isn't necessarily for the kids.
Yes, I enjoyed this one as well. It touched on a whole slew of themes that smaller kids won't understand, but the whole love story between the two is really well done.
Really enjoyed that one as well, the green aesop was a little heavy-handed, but I caught myself rooting for those two robots and their love.
And come on, any woman that can disintegrate a small trading fleet in seconds is bound to be awesome, even if she's a small Mac inspired robot.
Funny story about the movie, test screenings apparently revealed that the viewers were quite aware that the humans inherited a completely worthless death world (and a dead one at that) with absolutely none of the necessary skills to survive in such an environment. To fix this, the drawn epilogue was added to show the happy ending after the ending.
The *worst* chick flick I ever got dragged to in my life. I had an inkling what I was in for, but I didn't really appreciate how completely devoid this movie was of anything even remotely interesting to a guy until I actually sat through it.
But, it was redeemed by one of the best guy moments ever. Near the tear jerking climax of the movie, the GF was sobbing away with her head on my chest. There were about 8 other couples in the theater, and I'm quite positive that *every* woman was sobbing. I had my arm around the GF...leaned back in the seat...there was a couple one row back, and about 8 seats down. I casually looked over...his significant other was in exactly the same mode as mine. I leaned my head back..made eye contact with the guy. I kinda nodded...he nodded back..and at exactly the same moment, we both sorta shook our heads in "what the **** are we doing here" moment. I startled chuckling, and caught a wicked 'bow to the ribs, and heard a commotion from where he was sitting, so I'm sure he got it too. Almost made the whole ordeal worthwhile.
So, I guess you're not a C.S. Lewis fan, then? As an avid fan, I found the movie very entertaining, even if it was not completely historically accurate.
This movie was really about a man, The Dude, who's love, his rug, was besmirched by Woo.
This movie was about Walter, who loves both bowling and his faith. It also tackles the issues that arise when those two loves come in conflict (spoiler alert: he doesn't roll on Shabbos).
This movie was about da Jesus, who loves winning and trash talk and small children.
Finally, this movie is about Donnie and his love for coming into the middle of a conversation.
I guess that does qualify, what d'you think? (And I believe the story of the film itself really does, too)
The film almost seems too farcical, but I guess if Annie Hall is on this Geeklist, so then should When Harry Met Sally, which is essentially the same sort of movie.
The movie was far too over the top with Spectacle! Spectacle! for me to care about the characters. I was too busy peeling myself off the back wall of the movie theater.
However, the director's other "red curtain" movie, Strictly Ballroom, is a bit closer to the mark.
From below:
HilkMAN wrote:
I had to take breaks from Moulin Rouge repeatedly (didn't watch it in the theater, fortunately), because it was so nervous. Couldn't even tell the side characters apart as the camera never rested on them. Moulin Rouge was almost a great movie, but too stressful to watch for me.
Yes! Nervous and stressful and almost oppressive in its presentation.
Damn you, James Cameron and go to hell, Michael Bay.
Now now, those guys enriched our lives with more explosions than I can count (OK, I can only count to, like... 3 or something, but still, I suspect it was more than 3)
The trailers were enough to keep me away. I may be the only American in the world that hasn't seen it, and won't.
Nope. Here's at least one more...
Not even to see the gratuitous nude scene thrown in just to keep all the bored-to-death husbands/boyfriends from walking out of the theater halfway through this flick...
Okay, I'll own it. I liked Titanic. Oddly, though, I thought it would have been better on a ship that actually made it to its destination. The sinking of the ship was (from a storytelling perspective) a little too convenient a resolution to the problems they created for the three main characters in the first half of the film.
In the TV series based on this movie, our hero was apparently in love with, and loved by, the female persona avatar of the city's central computer system. Robot-love deluxe!
Oh crud, I know that I will be publicly humiliated for this, but I like Pride and Prejudice. However, it's not the love story in particular that I like. I just like the movie as a whole. Btw, the version I like is the six hour one, and not the disgusting Keira Knightley one.
Whew! Glad I got that off my chest. Now I am prepared for the legions of smilies sure to descend upon me.
Man, a lot of hate for Keira Knightley in this thread. Maybe it is because of overexposure.
The miniseries is obviously the better production, but I didn't think her movie was bad at all. It was a decent way to cover all the bases in a couple of hours, which is really all I can take for Jane Austen.
I really disliked Knightley right up until this movie actually. I was expecting it to be terrible but it blew me away, and I thought she was great in it. I loved Atonement too - Joe Wright is the man as far as I'm concerned.
I do like the BBC version too, even though I'm really not a big Austen fan.
One of my favourite chick-flicks. A period piece in which husbands and wives learn to love each other again and everyone refreshes their love of life.
Four English women, bored with their dreary existences, get together to rent a castle in Italy for the month of April. There they learn about love, life and themselves.
It's not for everyone, but if you don't mind the slow, dreamy pacing it's like the happiest of greeting cards. It's all about renewal and how life is better if you just take a vacation once in a while. Also, the scenery is gorgeous.
Favorite line: "I promised myself the first thing to happen in this place would be a kiss."
I get all warm and fuzzy just thinking about this film.
This is my wife's favorite; watches at least once a year. I don't watch every time, but I do enjoy it also.
Now if only she would watch Mr. Majestyk with me, one of my favorite romances. I get a tear every time Bronson and Nancy Chavez stand together looking at the shot of watermelons and Bronson makes a fist and she reaches over and holds his hand.
A Matter of Life and Death, by Powell and Pressburger.
Peter and June strike up a conversation as he stares death in the face from his burning Lancaster. The opening scene is a mini film in itself and the best opening to any I know.
The rest of the film is his attempt to keep them together once the conveying angel (who missed him in the fog!) arrives to take him to his appointment with heaven.
At the height of the Risorgimento, the Italian Contessa Livia Serpieri (Alida Valli) risks all for the dashing Austrian Leutnant Franz Mahler (Farley Grainger). Her treasonable infatuation leads inevitably to a tragic outcome. I was first entranced by this magnificent film when I was about sixteen (and I am older than Coffin Dodger), when it was part of a BBC season of foreign-language films shown at the Witching Hour. Consequently, doomed love affairs (and Italian actresses ) have always been a favourite subject. See also: ‘Double Indemnity’ (Billy Wilder 1944) & ‘ Letter From An Unknown Woman’ (Max Ophuls 1948). No drippy Chick-Flicks these. However, I did quite like ‘Addicted To Love’ and ‘Green Card’ and so I am not entirely immune to the lighter flights of fancy.
Sam: But I think, Mr. Frodo, I do understand. I know now. Folk in those stories had lots of chances of turning back, only they didn't. They kept going. Because they were holding on to something.
Frodo: What are we holding on to Sam?
Sam: That there's some good in this world, Mr. Frodo... and it's worth fighting for.
---
This love of which you speak, it's the true love of friendship, not the homo-erotic one, right?
An amazing story with an seemingly impossible love. Everybody should watch this movie! The love part is not the greatest part in this movie, but it is an important item.
Speaking purely personally and subjectively (I recognize that many people love this film), I really hate this one. I couldn't have cared less about the "love" story within it (I put that in quotes because this is one of those films that gives the viewer absolutely no reason to believe in the male/female relationship -- the female lead is completely unappealing and they try to generate empathy for the character by making her a victim of abuse; in any case, the relationship is never developed to any depth.)
What I dislike most about the film is that it's the epitome of Baby Boomer narcissism and navel-gazing -- you know the type of film; all world events are important only insofar as they are rites of passage for the Baby Boomers. The 1950s? Well, that was the time of cocooned innocence. Vietnam? Important only because it's when the baby boomers lost their innocence, don't you see. The 1970s? Hey, that's when "everyone" was following silly fads and engaging in lifestyle experimentation.
It's my own baggage, I suppose, but I'm sick to death of pop culture that is all about the Baby Boomers' trips down memory lane. I can afford to be only mildly offended because my life has been pretty nice (my own time of "innocence" was the early 1970s, which you'd never know was possible from a film like this.) Also, the 1950s were a much more diverse and intellectually challenging time than Hollywood appears determined to have everyone believe. But again, that's only mild irritation. But if I grew up in, say, Vietnam, I think I'd be irritated beyond description by films like this one with its juvenile, narcisstic take on the wrenching events that unfolded in my country.
Chuckles is largely right: It's a heavy dose of baby boomer narcissism and the love story element is not a love story.
But what really bugs me about this movie is the famous line that is wrong. In a chocolate sampler, every chocolate is marked. There is a coding system, eg, between two chocolates that are otherwise identical, the one with four dots has an almond and the one with two swirls contains a prune. (I don't know the actual code, because the only chocolate I want is a plain Hershey Special Dark, but there is a code.) So the folksy wisdom becomes:
Life is like a box of chocolates: If you're ignorant you never know what you're going to get.
Chuckles is largely right: It's a heavy dose of baby boomer narcissism and the love story element is not a love story.
But what really bugs me about this movie is the famous line that is wrong. In a chocolate sampler, every chocolate is marked. There is a coding system, eg, between two chocolates that are otherwise identical, the one with four dots has an almond and the one with two swirls contains a prune. (I don't know the actual code, because the only chocolate I want is a plain Hershey Special Dark, but there is a code.) So the folksy wisdom becomes:
Life is like a box of chocolates: If you're ignorant you never know what you're going to get.
Sure, there's a code, but how many people actually know it? I Don't. And how many people keep the piece of wax paper that has the thing printed on it? I don't. So by the time i go to get a piece, I don't actually know what I'm gonna get. Actually, I don't fancy chocolates that come in a box like that, so I don't have this problem, but my grandmother did*.
Now, having said that and gotten the devil's advocate part out of the way, I can say I actually agree with you.
The movie is not that great, but it is decent, though the love story part of it is lacking. I think the theme there had to do with the whole peas and carrots thing. His perception was that, no matter how long they spent apart, when they were together they fit like parts made for each other. Since the movie is mostly from his point of view, we don't get to see what she thinks, until the end, when she is thankful that he gave her a son. But I'm not sure it qualifies as a love story because I don't think she loved Forrest, but he did love her, so maybe it's an unrequited love story (even though the did have sex the one time).
* my grandma always used to throw the thing away and then not know what she was getting. So she would take a bite out of it and, if she didn't like it, put it back into the box and try another.
This is a movie of one-sided love. She at no time considers Forrest as anything more than a good friend. He interprets her caring for him as something that doesn't exist, which makes it more of a true love story than all of the others put together.
Chuckles . . . never mind. This a boardgaming community.
This is a movie of one-sided love. She at no time considers Forrest as anything more than a good friend. He interprets her caring for him as something that doesn't exist, which makes it more of a true love story than all of the others put together.
Right, which is why I said it's an unrequited love story. As in, one person feels one way and the other doesn't return the feeling.
I'm not sure why you think this is more of a true love story than any others listed here, other than the fact that it happens in the real world more than mutual love does (especially, maybe, to us geeks)
Whenever I talk about this movie, I call this the guy's equivalent of a chick flick. I think I've figured out what my beef is with most of the stereotypical "chick flicks":
* Girl meets boy * Boy falls in love with girl * Boy does not change enough to suit girl * Stupid misunderstanding occurs * Girl breaks up with boy * Boy changes his ways * Girl changes pretty much nothing * Boy chases after girl * Girl deigns boy worthy to take back
Basically, any movie that gives a woman an unrealistic expectation of love. (See also: any movie with Julia Roberts.) Say Anything is a beautiful movie to me because boy and girl both change and grow through the movie while staying true to themselves at their core, their relationship still has problems and issues, and they both have to fight and compromise to make it work. Most of all, they both are in love with the other person as they are in that moment, not with who they will be at the end of the film or who they would ideally be. She is a focused academic and that's all most people see. He sees everything else about her almost to the exclusion of her devotion to studying, but when the time comes to make a choice, he supports her going overseas because he loves her. And he remains an aspiring kickboxer with few real prospects, but she loves him. It's the kind of picture where I can picture problems down the road, such as him being a kickboxer with no prospects and why he doesn't get a real job, but I also see the two of them working together to overcome them.
To be honest, I can kind of understand the appeal, chick flicks work for women because they give the illusion that you can be an insufferable, self-centered bitch and still get prince charming (the sad part? it's true), action flicks work for men because they give the illusion that you can be a stinking, hairy chested murder machine and still get some genetic mix-up between Marilyn vos Savant and Betty Page (the sad part? it's untrue).
To be honest, I can kind of understand the appeal, chick flicks work for women because they give the illusion that you can be an insufferable, self-centered bitch and still get prince charming (the sad part? it's true), action flicks work for men because they give the illusion that you can be a stinking, hairy chested murder machine and still get some genetic mix-up between Marilyn vos Savant and Betty Page (the sad part? it's untrue).
I had to entirely requote that post, and thumb it. That's the single best description of the differences in "Chick Flicks" and "Guy Flicks" I've ever read. Love it.
I would say this is a story of conquest not love, since it's sex, not love that ends the cycle.
Wow, missing the point of a great movie! Assuming that you aren't a troll... Phil doesn't sleep with Rita at any point in the movie. If you recall, when he wakes up "the next day" she mentions how he fell asleep soon after they returned to his room. The cycle ended because he learned to become a good person and use his time helping others instead of helping himself. To further disprove your statement, earlier in the film he tricks another lady into sleeping with him, and the cycle remains unbroken.
I would say this is a story of conquest not love, since it's sex, not love that ends the cycle.
Wow, missing the point of a great movie! Assuming that you aren't a troll... Phil doesn't sleep with Rita at any point in the movie. If you recall, when he wakes up "the next day" she mentions how he fell asleep soon after they returned to his room. The cycle ended because he learned to become a good person and use his time helping others instead of helping himself. To further disprove your statement, earlier in the film he tricks another lady into sleeping with him, and the cycle remains unbroken.
Groundhog Day rulz!
I I really like the movie and now I think I like it more. I always assumed they had sex in the end and it seemed like it cheapened the movie. You have just improved the film ten fold for me! I stand gratefully corrected. Also, I appreciate the assumption that I'm not a troll.
I always feel guilty every time I watch this about how much I love this film, but if you don't get choked up at some point in the last five minutes (either their reunion, their parting, his mania about getting back to her or revisiting smile in the portrait), I suggest you stop by your nearest Salvation Army thrift store and pick up a second-hand soul.
This is the film I would have posted if it wasn't here. Sure, it's all Tarantino dialogue, blood 'n guns, but it's rare to get a film with a main plot involving the relationship between two people, who stay utterly devoted to each other from begining to end.
Brilliant movie. Though I still don't know what a Drexl is.
A typical Hollywood romance seems to consist of the two main characters simultaneously being attracted to each other but also having several (banal) obstacles in the way of their being together, which are surmounted by the end of the story. Amelie is more about life and the search for love in general. The title character is quirky and adorable, and we become so fond of her, and so interested in her life and the lives of those around her, that as a byproduct we find ourselves wanting her to have romance and companionship in her life. And wishing that we could be the ones to share our lives with her.
Tender Mercies The Horton Foote screenplay with Robert Duvall and Tess Harper is hard to watch at times, but it reminds me of people I've known and places I've been. (I guess that's not very damned hard since it was filmed in parts of Waxahachie, Texas that look a lot like a whole bunch of other places around here.)
Will Ferrell in a serious role with just the right amount of humor spread throughout the film. He hears his life is being narrated as he falls in love with an indie-bakery owner (Maggie Gyllenhaal).
Yes, I liked this movie, though I wasn't sure that I would. Will Farrell did a nice turn in a relatively dramatic role. Can't say as it's a "greatest of all time" love story, but the love story within it is decent and depicts boring "normal" people, who are also lonely, falling in love.
I was surprised at how much I LOVED this movie. I enjoy Maggie Gyllenhaal (sp?) and Emma Thompson. Will Ferrell really surprised me. I recommend it highly.
My favorite love stories in no order (I'm sure I'm missing some): King of Hearts (Le Roi de Coeur) All that Heaven Allows Sabrina (1954) Show Me Love An Affair of Love The Cook, the Thief, His Wife, Her Lover Annie Hall Love and Death Code 46 Sullivan's Travels It Happened One Night Trust Cranes are Flying Some Kind of Wonderful His Girl Friday Closely Watched Trains Victor/Victoria Amélie Delicatessen Tampopo Mr. Jealousy Funny Face Charade Harold and Maude Palm Beach Story I Know Where I'm Going Petulia LA Story Lost in Translation Mumford Mr. Deeds Goes to Town Velvet Goldmine A Very Long Engagement Princess and the Warrior Heaven Punch Drunk Love Roman Holiday Steamboat Bill Jr. Adam's Rib Brigadoon An American in Paris Better off Dead Loves of a Blonde Cactus Flower Ninotchka City Lights Pillow Talk Ridicule Lady Eve Defending Your Life High Fidelity Indiscreet Four Weddings and a Funeral The Grass is Greener White Christmas Truly, Madly, Deeply Venus Beauty Institute Tie Me Up, Tie Me Down Fast and the Furious Secretary Sound of Music Heathers Truman Show Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind The Umbrellas of Cherbourg Marty Next Stop Wonderland Millionairess My Fair Lady Philadelphia Story Room with a View Bell, Book, & Candle On the Beach
In my family there are three adult females and three under-tens. The television is on all day every day; if it's not the accursed Disney channel or endless soaps, it's nausea-inducing chick flicks. Any mention of the name Hugh Grant causes me to run to another room to watch Arnie blowing things up. Or to play a board game of course.
Grow up. Blowing things up can get very, very boring and predictable, too. Those bad guys always get it in the end.
This list is akin to something I've always looked for - Movies Where No One Dies (tm). It's not that I have anything particularly against depicting death and killing - but man, it's been done. And done. And done. And done. And done again with a sequel coming out. Even most of these "chick flicks" have dramtic deaths in them. I'll bet any moderate TV/film buff has sat through thousands, if not tens of thousands, of death scenes - villians where everyone celebrates, innocents with weeping well-wishers, heroes with their famous last words to live by.
It is just so ridiculously easy to kill off a fictional character for dramtic effect. What is hard - and rare - is creating interesting non-comedy drama without doing it. Something actually good and compelling, not just schlock (yes, Hugh Grant makes me run to the other room, too).
In film, death is the cheap fix and true love the rare jewel.
Blowing things up is much better than watching people to pretend to swoon over each other. They DO make good and more realistic love stories for guys though. They're called pornos.
Posted Mon Dec 28, 2009 1:47 am
But I'm also not a girlie-girl, and typically don't go for chick-flicks.
She might have rethought the whole thing. 
However, it's not the love story in particular that I like. I just like the movie as a whole. Btw, the version I like is the six hour one, and not the disgusting Keira Knightley one.
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