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Caverna: The Cave Farmers» Forums » Reviews

Subject: This Game Sucks, Don't Be A Sheep rss

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R. S.
Canada
Whitby
Ontario
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This game should be called "Reaching for Wild Cards" because there's so many piles of pieces there's no way to sit in one spot and reach for everything, and everything in the game is basically interchangeable on demand as needed. I get Agricola was punishing and it sucked too, but this game is a prime example of what most game makers are pumping out there days: easy games with little rewards to trick you into feeling good about accomplishing something.

So I'll skip harping on the "Can you pass me X?" and "What does that card say?" Which is asked by everyone playing at least twenty times throughout the two hour three player experience, and get right to the core issue. Rubies can be anything you want, and in the mid and late game there are plenty. Expedition (questing) is a cool idea, but again in the mid to late game it's basically take 3 or 4 of anything you possibly want in the game. This somehow includes building a tunnel back in your house or sowing. Yes, for one expedition action, you can literally build a tunnel, sow crops, wrangle a cattle and even somehow force animals to mate, all at once. This is a very late game example but once this comes out, it's like, wtf was the first 80% of the game in here for?

Other parts of the game were kinda weird feeling, but these two stand out the most. Like you will struggle to get food (mildly struggle) at the mid game, and then somehow end up with unlimited food even with dwarf junior running around.

It becomes a scramble at the end, and I only won because I was sitting next to the room upgrade that gave 1 VP per stone, and I saw a surplus of it. So while everyone else was working their ass off abusing the absurd exchange rates and never ending expeditions, I won because I was sitting at one end of the table by the yellow room upgrades and saw an opportunity. Which unless we played this five more times somehow, or we increased the "What does that card say?" up to 40x a player, there was no way for the other two to really have this perk.

Stupid over rated over hyped game that makes everyone feel like they did something no matter how badly you play it.
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Andy Burgess
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... and breathe.

Feel better now?
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How many games of this have you played?
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Jan-Willem van Leeuwen
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Basically you hate everything that makes this game different from Agricola, even though you rate it higher. shake
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Joseph Pinkley
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I know you are, but what am I?

Seriously though, you're wrong. Like, all objectively and shit.
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R. S.
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Just one play through, as per the review, the only one lol

I don't get why this game is fun. Instead of the random attitude responses, tell me how your experience differed from ending up with a few animals, probably 2-4 fields with crops, and caves with probably one mine, one ruby mine, one new dwelling, and two cavern upgrades. I guarantee this is what 90% of players end up with after playing through "choices" and applying such good "strategy" for 2+ hours.

Wow, so unique! So innovative! So wow!
 
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Eric Rampson
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Donald Trump has a BGG account?
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that Matt
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Y'all need better lighting under your bridge.
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Zach Greenwalt
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I don't quite understand your "interchangeable" argument? In a board game where you win by victory points and things get you victory points, wouldn't that be true for every game? Like suburbia? Or 7 wonders? (2 of your higher rated games). The fun of caverna is diverging pathways and seeing how you built your farm different than everyone else. And yes, everything gets you points, the way you go about obtaining points is what make the different items worth going for. Sheep and cows are worth the same, but cows will give you more food if you need to slaughter but sheep are easier to obtain. Pigs and donkeys are worth the same, but donkeys can go in my mine to save space but pigs can go in the fields to fill squares. I think if you played it again with the mindset that the path you choose will be different than everyone else's and you buy into the theme a little more, you'll start to see how amazing and fun the game is. Or maybe you won't, everyone has an opinion.
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Zach Greenwalt
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TheNewblar wrote:
Just one play through, as per the review, the only one lol

I don't get why this game is fun. Instead of the random attitude responses, tell me how your experience differed from ending up with a few animals, probably 2-4 fields with crops, and caves with probably one mine, one ruby mine, one new dwelling, and two cavern upgrades. I guarantee this is what 90% of players end up with after playing through "choices" and applying such good "strategy" for 2+ hours.

Wow, so unique! So innovative! So wow!


Of course you didn't have fun, that farm sucks
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R. S.
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zacharius96 wrote:
I don't quite understand your "interchangeable" argument? In a board game where you win by victory points and things get you victory points, wouldn't that be true for every game? Like suburbia? Or 7 wonders? (2 of your higher rated games). The fun of caverna is diverging pathways and seeing how you built your farm different than everyone else. And yes, everything gets you points, the way you go about obtaining points is what make the different items worth going for. Sheep and cows are worth the same, but cows will give you more food if you need to slaughter but sheep are easier to obtain. Pigs and donkeys are worth the same, but donkeys can go in my mine to save space but pigs can go in the fields to fill squares. I think if you played it again with the mindset that the path you choose will be different than everyone else's and you buy into the theme a little more, you'll start to see how amazing and fun the game is. Or maybe you won't, everyone has an opinion.


The amount of interchangeable objects on demand without any prerequisite in this game is just insane and not comparable to 7 Wonders (where you have to devote resources and a turn to acquiring a building), or Suburbia (not sure there's any trade X for X in that game).

Yeah they were trying to make it so you can end up with a relatively identical farm to everyone else using different methods, but really it's just expedition or farm. Like, ore is just nice for VPs if you build the right room. And animals are animals... They just sit there and collect.

Rubies turn into anything, and expeditions can yield anything... So... Like objectively speaking, despite the cool theme which is dragged down by the 15+ spread out piles of pieces (which are a total pain to setup and clean up), it's a pretty linear game which forces everyone into doing the exact same thing. As mentioned prior, allows everyone to enjoy the experience if you're not into any sort of challenge and the illusion of making valuable choices, but if you can see through that, it's no fun at all, especially for the giant price tag that accompanies it.

That said, nice to see a legit response for once lol
 
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Zach Greenwalt
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TheNewblar wrote:
zacharius96 wrote:
I don't quite understand your "interchangeable" argument? In a board game where you win by victory points and things get you victory points, wouldn't that be true for every game? Like suburbia? Or 7 wonders? (2 of your higher rated games). The fun of caverna is diverging pathways and seeing how you built your farm different than everyone else. And yes, everything gets you points, the way you go about obtaining points is what make the different items worth going for. Sheep and cows are worth the same, but cows will give you more food if you need to slaughter but sheep are easier to obtain. Pigs and donkeys are worth the same, but donkeys can go in my mine to save space but pigs can go in the fields to fill squares. I think if you played it again with the mindset that the path you choose will be different than everyone else's and you buy into the theme a little more, you'll start to see how amazing and fun the game is. Or maybe you won't, everyone has an opinion.


The amount of interchangeable objects on demand without any prerequisite in this game is just insane and not comparable to 7 Wonders (where you have to devote resources and a turn to acquiring a building), or Suburbia (not sure there's any trade X for X in that game).

Yeah they were trying to make it so you can end up with a relatively identical farm to everyone else using different methods, but really it's just expedition or farm. Like, ore is just nice for VPs if you build the right room. And animals are animals... They just sit there and collect.

Rubies turn into anything, and expeditions can yield anything... So... Like objectively speaking, despite the cool theme which is dragged down by the 15+ spread out piles of pieces (which are a total pain to setup and clean up), it's a pretty linear game which forces everyone into doing the exact same thing. As mentioned prior, allows everyone to enjoy the experience if you're not into any sort of challenge and the illusion of making valuable choices, but if you can see through that, it's no fun at all, especially for the giant price tag that accompanies it.

That said, nice to see a legit response for once lol


I have played it 15+ times and I've literally never experienced what you're talking about. Is it just the interchanging animals into food? And ore is good for building weapons faster, not not nessecarily needing that "one room" to be valuable. It's not like I can say, " hey I'll trade in 2 sheep for a cow" it just doesn't work like that. And after every one of those games, no 2 farms have ever looked the same. I try to go for a really strong farm at the start, filling over half my fields with crops, fill over half my mine with rubies, and worry about getting one of each animal at the end. It makes sense that rubies make anything, it's currency. Other people go hard for expeditions and ignore the rest of the action board. Some people fill their caves with special buildings so they're getting compounding points.

This game is something that everyone is still trying to solve. So many pathways and strategies, so many options that are DIFFERENT. And yet that can all change if you play with a new group that finds different ways to play.

This is a good game.
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Stephane Nolet
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R.S., you are allowed to not like the game as we are allowed to like it, preferably without being called sheeps. Believe it or not, we can shape our own opinion without the need of other people's. I suggest you try Caverna at least one more time and if you really hate it, then trade/sell it. But find yourself another group to test it, though. If people in your group were asking "What does that card say?" over and over again as you mentioned (cards that have just a few words on them by the way), maybe they should go for lighter games.

I love Caverna and I'm not afraid to say it. My only concern with it is the lack of diversity in the cards. There was rumors of an expansion but I doubt we will ever see it.
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james napoli
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R. S.
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Noloatmo wrote:
R.S., you are allowed to not like the game as we are allowed to like it, preferably without being called sheeps.


If you are getting your feelings hurt by being indirectly called a sheep in the title of a thread on a forum specific to a particular board game's reviews, you should probably disconnect your internet. Like seriously, don't ever use google. You'll end up in tears.

The people in this forum are hilarious.
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Andrew B
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TheNewblar wrote:
The people in this forum are hilarious.


Someone had to pick up the slack.
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Grant Holzhauer
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TheNewblar wrote:
Noloatmo wrote:
R.S., you are allowed to not like the game as we are allowed to like it, preferably without being called sheeps.


If you are getting your feelings hurt by being indirectly called a sheep in the title of a thread on a forum specific to a particular board game's reviews, you should probably disconnect your internet. Like seriously, don't ever use google. You'll end up in tears.

The people in this forum are hilarious.


It's not that people are actually offended by what you said; it's the lack of charity on your part. Simply because the Internet is filled with trolls that we all have to deal with doesn't mean you or I need to become one.
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Richard Keiser

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TheNewblar wrote:
Noloatmo wrote:
R.S., you are allowed to not like the game as we are allowed to like it, preferably without being called sheeps.


If you are getting your feelings hurt by being indirectly called a sheep in the title of a thread on a forum specific to a particular board game's reviews, you should probably disconnect your internet. Like seriously, don't ever use google. You'll end up in tears.

The people in this forum are hilarious.


But is it a wargame?
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Grant
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I'll preface by saying that I like negative reviews and think they can often add more to the discussion about a game than positive ones.

That being said, wow, what a bad review.

I see this is your first review, so, nice attempt, I guess?

You seem like a fun guy. I'm definitely subscribing. I hope you don't disappoint.
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Aernout Casier
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Ladies and gents, the trolls are among us
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Scud-O wrote:
Donald Trump has a BGG account?

My two cents, and PSA: tread lightly here.

I was recently warned for a thinly-veiled allusion to a certain US presidential candidate. Based on that, I assume BGG wants to keep any politics-referencing comments in RSP.
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