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Twilight Struggle» Forums » General

Subject: Does anybody ever attack Australia? rss

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David Harrison
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Bought this game on Steam recently and have really been loving playing it; I was skeptical about the #1 rated board game but have been pleasantly surprised.

One thing I've noticed that I find rather amusing is that Australia is never, ever, contested. To be fair, why would it be? It's a 4 strength country that starts out belonging to USA and isn't a battleground country, a Southeast Asian country, or adjacent to either superpower. It just kind of sits there.
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Conor Hickey
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It's only real purpose is to give the US a way into SE Asia via Malaysia. The only time I saw someone put USSR influence in there was when he was messing around before conceding
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CD Harris
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I've seen the AI do it several times. It's annoying and not terribly effective (IOW, a very AI move).

I suppose there's an edge case where it's the easiest country to break control of for Domination purposes, but it's an easy Ops War for the USA to win, so it'd be very edge case-y even so.
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Alex Drazen
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coblackmagus wrote:
Bought this game on Steam recently and have really been loving playing it; I was skeptical about the #1 rated board game but have been pleasantly surprised.

One thing I've noticed that I find rather amusing is that Australia is never, ever, contested. To be fair, why would it be? It's a 4 strength country that starts out belonging to USA and isn't a battleground country, a Southeast Asian country, or adjacent to either superpower. It just kind of sits there.


Canada and the UK aren't usually contested, either (Suez Crisis, Pershing II Deployed, and/or Socialist Governments may hit them, but it's rare that the USSR would play into UK, and even more rare that they'd play into Canada).

Norway, Denmark, and Sweden also rarely see any action (only time they usually would is via Marshall Plan, if the USSR has France and the Mediterranean 2-stabs).

Bolivia, West African States, and Somalia won't usually see much activity, either.
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Moshe Callen
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Jerusalem
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I often will undermine US control of the UK as the Soviets. I don't intend to take the UK but to mess with what the US scores in European scoring or to force the US to waste OPs to recover the UK. So if the event says to place influence in US controlled countries in Europe or Western Europe and there's nowhere more obvious, I will place one of at most two influence in the UK as the Soviets. This is when I'm using the strategy of undermining US control of countries especially battleground countries whenever possible if I'm not taking control of other countries.
 
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Mikhail Dektyarev
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UK gets USSR visit quite often - if NATO is in effect, US controls UK without overcontrol - then playing Special Relationship into UK before event is quite effective in my opinion - you waste just 1 op instead of 2.
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Alex Drazen
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mihaild wrote:
UK gets USSR visit quite often - if NATO is in effect, US controls UK without overcontrol - then playing Special Relationship into UK before event is quite effective in my opinion - you waste just 1 op instead of 2.


By "contested," I mean that the USSR isn't usually going for control of UK or Canada.

Yes, you can put Special Relationship into UK, but it's a 2 Op, so it's just a nearly dead AR. You break UK and put one in, the event does nothing, and the USA repairs next time they place influence. Certainly worth doing if NATO is in effect, but I'd hardly call that "contesting" the UK.

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So if the event says to place influence in US controlled countries in Europe or Western Europe and there's nowhere more obvious, I will place one of at most two influence in the UK as the Soviets


There isn't such a card for Europe. There are cards to remove US influence. There are cards to place general USSR influence (The Reformer and Glasnost), but they're not limited to US-controlled countries.

It also may not be wise to break UK if Truman is still lurking (assuming there are no potential better uses for Truman; for example, if you're staring down 0/7 in East Germany and Poland and France is US controlled or easily broken).


 
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Carlo Patek
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I remember someone that posted a turn 10 AR7 situation which could only be won by playing into Australia.

IIRC, there was shuttle diplomacy and formosan involved
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Mikhail Dektyarev
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Shuttle diplomacy doesn't matter for final scoring, but it's quite easy to find such situation - assuming USSR has only 2 ops, Australia affects Asia domination, Asia domination affects result after final scoring, US has dead AR7 and all other relevant countries are overcontrolled.
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Alex Drazen
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Kajo wrote:
I remember someone that posted a turn 10 AR7 situation which could only be won by playing into Australia.

IIRC, there was shuttle diplomacy and formosan involved


Yes, there was a situation where the USSR had Europe Control, but the USA had enough VP to win via Asia Scoring for Domination. However, the only Asian non-BGs for USA were Australia and Taiwan. By playing Formosan to break Australia on AR7, Taiwan becomes a BG country for the USA, and the USA no longer has Domination, because it has no Asian non-BG.

Here is the original thread. It's a pretty specific situation.

Another way USSR might play to Australia is if it's the only USA non-BG in Asia and they have USA stuck in Quagmire. Then they could use it to break a USA Domination and dump Asia Scoring.
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Erik Syvertsen
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But don't you get two armies a turn for holding Australia?
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David Tsui
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whac3 wrote:
I often will undermine US control of the UK as the Soviets. I don't intend to take the UK but to mess with what the US scores in European scoring or to force the US to waste OPs to recover the UK. So if the event says to place influence in US controlled countries in Europe or Western Europe and there's nowhere more obvious, I will place one of at most two influence in the UK as the Soviets. This is when I'm using the strategy of undermining US control of countries especially battleground countries whenever possible if I'm not taking control of other countries.


Is that you, Vladimir Putin?
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Silver Robert
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mak
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If i as the USSR in Turn 1, AR1 headline The Cambridge five and my opponent has Asia scoring i might consider placing the influence in Australia so as not to let him score Asia after the AR1 coup.
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Drew Lawson
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Makis mou wrote:
If i as the USSR in Turn 1, AR1 headline The Cambridge five and my opponent has Asia scoring i might consider placing the influence in Canada so as not to let him score Asia after the AR1 coup.


That seems like the perfect opportunity to parachute into India, freeing up your AR1 options (with the Iran coup no longer as important). Depending on my other cards, I'd strongly consider using AR1 to control India + Burma for a strong domination right off the bat. Also frees me up to focus on the ME since there's not a lot that can be done by the U.S. in response to that play.
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ray donovan
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I once place 3ops in Canada with NORAD
 
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King in Green
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ajpl wrote:
Makis mou wrote:
If i as the USSR in Turn 1, AR1 headline The Cambridge five and my opponent has Asia scoring i might consider placing the influence in Canada so as not to let him score Asia after the AR1 coup.


That seems like the perfect opportunity to parachute into India, freeing up your AR1 options (with the Iran coup no longer as important). Depending on my other cards, I'd strongly consider using AR1 to control India + Burma for a strong domination right off the bat. Also frees me up to focus on the ME since there's not a lot that can be done by the U.S. in response to that play.


I would regard Malaysia or Laos (depending on cards) and Thailand as superior if placing AR1. No I-P War risk to those ops and better position.

I have heard a strong player recommend Australia, but have also seen placements in Laos & Burma.
 
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Karl Ruppelt
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Oh noes!!! Some one has discovered the Australian Hammer and broken the game!!!
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James Barton
Australia
Melbourne
Victoria
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Australia was more interesting in the play test version. But they took out the knifey-spoony card from the final version. Since then it's been solidly a US only zone.
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Drew Lawson
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Paul Harding wrote:
ajpl wrote:
Makis mou wrote:
If i as the USSR in Turn 1, AR1 headline The Cambridge five and my opponent has Asia scoring i might consider placing the influence in Canada so as not to let him score Asia after the AR1 coup.


That seems like the perfect opportunity to parachute into India, freeing up your AR1 options (with the Iran coup no longer as important). Depending on my other cards, I'd strongly consider using AR1 to control India + Burma for a strong domination right off the bat. Also frees me up to focus on the ME since there's not a lot that can be done by the U.S. in response to that play.


I would regard Malaysia or Laos (depending on cards) and Thailand as superior if placing AR1. No I-P War risk to those ops and better position.

I have heard a strong player recommend Australia, but have also seen placements in Laos & Burma.


Laos? Couldn't the U.S. just invest a couple ops in a coup and potentially roll big? That seems like a bigger risk than the possibility of them holding I-P War.
 
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Greg Love
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coblackmagus wrote:
It just kind of sits there.

Yep, welcome to Australia. Just kinda sits there, waiting for Indonesia to attack.

shake

However, a couple of interesting factoids pertaining to Aus. during the Cold War, and international 'tension':

(1) 20 April 1987 – ABC comedy series 'The Dingo Principle' broadcasts a mock interview with the Ayatollah Khomeini, which results in diplomatic tensions with Iran, including the expulsion of two Australian diplomats. Two weeks later, the ABC (Australian Broadcasting Commission) receives a letter of complaint from the Soviet embassy regarding a skit lampooning Russian figures Mikhail Gorbachev and Vladimir Lenin.

No sense of humour, perhaps?
Maybe the use of satire as a political tool to besmirch the reputation of "serious" countries (e.g., Iran, Russia) would make an interesting game mechanic in Twilight Struggle, such as:

"Your country has just taken the p*** out of a battleground country. Decrease Defcon by how witty / degrading the satire was".

(2) Russia bugged Australian embassy
01 Jan, 2009 01:00 AM (I know its not during the Cold War era)
Russian intelligence bugged Australia's embassy in Moscow, cabinet documents published by the National Archives today show.

The major security breach is revealed for the first time in a cabinet minute recording that foreign minister Andrew Peacock briefed cabinet on July 25, 1978, on ''the present situation in regard to the discovery of listening devices in the Australian chancery in Moscow''.

On the other hand:

"For its part, Australia also collected intelligence from the Soviet embassy in Canberra, routinely tapping all the official and private telephones of diplomats and using listening devices in their residences and within the embassy itself."

whistle

Strange, but true.
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Oliver Koenig
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Pretty off-topic, I'll just leave this here anyway ..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emu_War
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King in Green
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ajpl wrote:
Paul Harding wrote:
ajpl wrote:
Makis mou wrote:
If i as the USSR in Turn 1, AR1 headline The Cambridge five and my opponent has Asia scoring i might consider placing the influence in Canada so as not to let him score Asia after the AR1 coup.


That seems like the perfect opportunity to parachute into India, freeing up your AR1 options (with the Iran coup no longer as important). Depending on my other cards, I'd strongly consider using AR1 to control India + Burma for a strong domination right off the bat. Also frees me up to focus on the ME since there's not a lot that can be done by the U.S. in response to that play.


I would regard Malaysia or Laos (depending on cards) and Thailand as superior if placing AR1. No I-P War risk to those ops and better position.

I have heard a strong player recommend Australia, but have also seen placements in Laos & Burma.


Laos? Couldn't the U.S. just invest a couple ops in a coup and potentially roll big? That seems like a bigger risk than the possibility of them holding I-P War.


It depends...perhaps the USSR has played into Burma or Afghanistan as well. Or played somewhere else annoying like Israel. If the US player is investing ops in a coup of Laos AR1 the USSR player is probably happy with Italy open to a coup and other options available.
 
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Greg Love
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Oddly enough, in an offline game today against the USSR, they attempted a re-alignment roll in Australia. Not sure what the intention there was.
 
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Karan R
India
Mumbai
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Offline misclick
 
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