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Subject: [MM] Valeria: Card Kingdoms $28 rss

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Daniel C
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http://www.miniaturemarket.com/hpsdmgvck001.html

Valeria: Card Kingdoms
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Y P
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Fun game. Machi Koro with a fantasy theme, but better than Machi Koro due to more variety of resources and quests, and you're always involved even when somebody else rolls because all your cards trigger regardless of who rolls (you get more when you're doing the rolling). Variable setup, events added in mini expansions--good stuff.
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A J
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Finding it hard to pull the trigger on this one. Reading a lot about how there's a glut of resources and lacks tension.
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When bad things happen, I know you want to believe they are a joke, but sometimes life is scary and dark. That is why we must find the light. -BMO
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ayejae wrote:
Finding it hard to pull the trigger on this one. Reading a lot about how there's a glut of resources and lacks tension.


Told myself I'd pick this up on sale, but yeah, I'm not pulling the trigger. There's no one specific reason.
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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MentatYP wrote:
Fun game. Machi Koro with a fantasy theme, but better than Machi Koro due to more variety of resources and quests, and you're always involved even when somebody else rolls because all your cards trigger regardless of who rolls (you get more when you're doing the rolling). Variable setup, events added in mini expansions--good stuff.


Agreed. I've been describing it as Machi Koro meets Splendor with a variable Dominion Kingdom style set-up.

This isn't a game that relies on "tension" to be satisfying so a lack thereof isn't an indictment. It has no more or less tension than say Splendor, Machi Koro, or RftG.

It's fun, offers reasonably interesting decisions, and plays in under an hour.

My only gripe is the set up being a bit of a hassle for a game this length and weight but it's been enjoyed by all every time I've brought it to the table.

All of that said, apart from really beautiful art it's not particularly remarkable either. It's a perfect fit if you're looking for a dice roller that's a step up from Machi Koro. It's solid but not a must buy.
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Richard Dickson
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It also doesn't have the "Oh, you rolled a 7, I get all your money" frustration of Machi Koro. There's a small take-that element, but it's limited to a few cards and a small amount of resources per activation. A setback, but not devastating like Machi Koro can be.
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Stuart Dunn
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If you decide to buy this game, don't forget to pick up the two mini-expansions:

Valeria: Card Kingdoms: Expansion Pack #1 - King's Guard
http://www.miniaturemarket.com/hpsdmgvck002.html
Valeria: Card Kingdoms: Expansion Pack #2 - Undead Samurai
http://www.miniaturemarket.com/hpsdmgvck003.html
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I don't know much about this game. Going to check out the game page.

Does it play better than Machi Koro you only 2 players?
 
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Matt D
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SgtSagara1001 wrote:
I don't know much about this game. Going to check out the game page.

Does it play better than Machi Koro you only 2 players?


I find it plays really well with two players. Nothing really unbalances it, and it adds a nice layer of complexity of choices. The way the "monster fighting" works you move your way down to tougher monsters, so in a 2P game you have to sometimes weigh what you get versus what you are opening up for your opponent. Still true of multiplayer but it's more of a tense and controlled situation with just two.

I've really enjoyed it and feel it gives a nice extra layer of complexity to Machi Koro. As was said, this isn't a game that relies upon tension or tightness so a glut of resources isn't necessary a bad thing. Assuming that's what you are looking for.

It's a fun way to roll dice that is between the complexity of King of Tokyo (YAHTZEE WITH MINSTERS) and Roll for the Galaxy (wait, I can't use that for what?)

Also, the art is awesome. If you like it there are two more coming from the Valeria series. Villages of Valeria is in printing now, and Quests of Valeria which just ended its KS a couple of months ago so is probably still in proofing stage. They are all part of a shared world (same art, names, etc) but aren't sequels or expansions and all have different mechanics. But this company puts out a good product and stands behind it (the initial KS run of V:CK had some card curling issues on some of the runs and they replaced everyone who was impacted with a new set of cards. Compare that to some KS companies that literally say "take it up with the printer in China)


** Disclaimer: I enjoy all three games referenced. They just tend to appeal to different audiences -- in my mind, while all three porridges are tasty, V:CK falls into "just right"
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elac yenwod
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I played this at a game night and wanted a copy to replace macho koro but $28 is too high for what the game is.
 
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A J
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NuMystic wrote:
This isn't a game that relies on "tension" to be satisfying so a lack thereof isn't an indictment. It has no more or less tension than say Splendor, Machi Koro, or RftG.


In Splendor and Machi Koro, lack of resources gives you a big decision -- do I buy now or save up for next turn to buy something better?

If resources are no longer scarce and there's no "tension" in that sense, what's the point of even having resources? It becomes more action selection at that point. The game sounds broken in that sense.
 
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Y P
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ayejae wrote:
NuMystic wrote:
This isn't a game that relies on "tension" to be satisfying so a lack thereof isn't an indictment. It has no more or less tension than say Splendor, Machi Koro, or RftG.


In Splendor and Machi Koro, lack of resources gives you a big decision -- do I buy now or save up for next turn to buy something better?

If resources are no longer scarce and there's no "tension" in that sense, what's the point of even having resources? It becomes more action selection at that point. The game sounds broken in that sense.

You still have to decide whether to buy now or save up for later. The ability to buy just comes quicker than Machi Koro since resources are more abundant, but there are also 3 different resources so it's not like you always have an over-abundance of everything.

You also need to decide whether to take on the available monsters or wait until the harder and more rewarding monsters are revealed by somebody else taking on the early monsters (the monster stacks are ordered from easy to hard).

There's still tension in the game. You want to grab cards before others can. But there are also more things you can do so it's a lot less likely you'll get stuck in a hole you can't get out of just because of bad die rolls.
 
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A J
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MentatYP wrote:
ayejae wrote:
NuMystic wrote:
This isn't a game that relies on "tension" to be satisfying so a lack thereof isn't an indictment. It has no more or less tension than say Splendor, Machi Koro, or RftG.


In Splendor and Machi Koro, lack of resources gives you a big decision -- do I buy now or save up for next turn to buy something better?

If resources are no longer scarce and there's no "tension" in that sense, what's the point of even having resources? It becomes more action selection at that point. The game sounds broken in that sense.

You still have to decide whether to buy now or save up for later. The ability to buy just comes quicker than Machi Koro since resources are more abundant, but there are also 3 different resources so it's not like you always have an over-abundance of everything.

You also need to decide whether to take on the available monsters or wait until the harder and more rewarding monsters are revealed by somebody else taking on the early monsters (the monster stacks are ordered from easy to hard).

There's still tension in the game. You want to grab cards before others can. But there are also more things you can do so it's a lot less likely you'll get stuck in a hole you can't get out of just because of bad die rolls.


Machi Koro has cards that create penalties for hoarding. Are there any penalties for that here?
 
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Y P
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ayejae wrote:
MentatYP wrote:
ayejae wrote:
NuMystic wrote:
This isn't a game that relies on "tension" to be satisfying so a lack thereof isn't an indictment. It has no more or less tension than say Splendor, Machi Koro, or RftG.


In Splendor and Machi Koro, lack of resources gives you a big decision -- do I buy now or save up for next turn to buy something better?

If resources are no longer scarce and there's no "tension" in that sense, what's the point of even having resources? It becomes more action selection at that point. The game sounds broken in that sense.

You still have to decide whether to buy now or save up for later. The ability to buy just comes quicker than Machi Koro since resources are more abundant, but there are also 3 different resources so it's not like you always have an over-abundance of everything.

You also need to decide whether to take on the available monsters or wait until the harder and more rewarding monsters are revealed by somebody else taking on the early monsters (the monster stacks are ordered from easy to hard).

There's still tension in the game. You want to grab cards before others can. But there are also more things you can do so it's a lot less likely you'll get stuck in a hole you can't get out of just because of bad die rolls.


Machi Koro has cards that create penalties for hoarding. Are there any penalties for that here?

Other players penalize you for hoarding because they get stuff done and points won while you hoard. There are cards that let you steal resources from other players but nothing as crippling as some of the purple cards in Machi Koro. If you love completely wiping out each other then Machi Koro is a better fit.
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J M
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They started changing the game mid-kickstarter and destroyed the economy. The game devolved into who got to spend their 30+ resources on the right card(s) that turn. They tried to correct it by bringing in a new rule about not gathering resources when to the right of the current player but, at least for four players, the game was ruined for our group, and we had been avid players of the p&p up until that point.

The warning flag should have been that they were still developing the game mid-campaign, with insufficient play testing.
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Matt Brown
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One of the characters you can pick to determine your secret end game scoring bonuses is also rather overpowered.
 
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Captain Yellowbeard
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matthean wrote:
One of the characters you can pick to determine your secret end game scoring bonuses is also rather overpowered.

Do tell ...
 
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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ayejae wrote:
NuMystic wrote:
This isn't a game that relies on "tension" to be satisfying so a lack thereof isn't an indictment. It has no more or less tension than say Splendor, Machi Koro, or RftG.


In Splendor and Machi Koro, lack of resources gives you a big decision -- do I buy now or save up for next turn to buy something better?

If resources are no longer scarce and there's no "tension" in that sense, what's the point of even having resources? It becomes more action selection at that point. The game sounds broken in that sense.


It's not even remotely broken in that sense. As already noted the game still has plenty of interesting decisions and rewards skillful play. Just because resources aren't incredibly scarce doesn't mean you have enough to do whatever you want every single turn. In our last game the player who was sitting on the most resources much of the game wasn't even close to winning in the end.

I have no idea what it was like previous to release, I bought my copy post-KS. I've taught the game to 5 different people this far, all die-hard gamers, and every single person enjoyed it for exactly what it is. No critical comments about the design whatsoever (and this is a plenty critical group) and it's been requested since. Not every game requires a tight economy to be enjoyable.

My only concern is that I think it may need more cards to stay fresh beyond 20 plays. Insert was clearly designed to hold more but I haven't heard anything about expansions in development yet.
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A J
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Ok you guys convinced me. But be warned, if I don't enjoy it, the ghost of my $28 will haunt you forever! zombie
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Jimmy Hudson
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We did a review on this one and I loved it. Really hits the spot for me. Roll the dice, get a bunch of resources, and then do a bunch of stuff!
 
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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ayejae wrote:
Ok you guys convinced me. But be warned, if I don't enjoy it, the ghost of my $28 will haunt you forever! zombie


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Leon Z.
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NuMystic wrote:
My only concern is that I think it may need more cards to stay fresh beyond 20 plays. Insert was clearly designed to hold more but I haven't heard anything about expansions in development yet.


Pretty sure full expansion is coming later in the year. They planned it before the KS even finished.
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Matt Brown
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CapnYB wrote:
matthean wrote:
One of the characters you can pick to determine your secret end game scoring bonuses is also rather overpowered.

Do tell ...


One of them where you get 2VP per each character. My first play I had to pick between it and another. I picked the other and just lost out on first. The guy picked it in the second game and ran away with it. The secondary bonuses are harder to pick up, but 14-15 characters is easily doable.
 
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Y P
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matthean wrote:
CapnYB wrote:
matthean wrote:
One of the characters you can pick to determine your secret end game scoring bonuses is also rather overpowered.

Do tell ...


One of them where you get 2VP per each character. My first play I had to pick between it and another. I picked the other and just lost out on first. The guy picked it in the second game and ran away with it. The secondary bonuses are harder to pick up, but 14-15 characters is easily doable.

Was that a KS exclusive? I don't seem to have that one in my retail edition.
 
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A J
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NuMystic wrote:
ayejae wrote:
Ok you guys convinced me. But be warned, if I don't enjoy it, the ghost of my $28 will haunt you forever! zombie




NooOooooooOooo!

Oh wait, I can still return it...
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