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Mansions of Madness: Second Edition» Forums » Rules

Subject: How do Barricades work? rss

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Howard

Frisco
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Before anyone asks me if I read the rules reference, yes, here's the text:

A Barricade is a feature that can be used to block a door.
^^As an action, an investigator in a space containing a Barricade
may move the Barricade against a door or Secret Passage or move
the Barricade away from the door or Secret Passage it blocks.
• An investigator cannot move a Barricade to another space
unless an effect specifically allows it.
^^ Investigators cannot move through blocked doors or blocked
Secret Passages.
^^As an action, an investigator can attempt to move a Barricade on
the other side of a blocked door or Secret Passage. The investigator
must be adjacent to the space the Barricade occupies but not in the
same room to perform this action.
• The investigator tests strength (). If he rolls two or more
success results (), he moves the Barricade away from the
door or Secret Passage that it blocks. Then the investigator may
move one space through the door or Secret Passage.
^^When a monster attempts to move through a blocked door or a
blocked Secret Passage, it can destroy the Barricade by resolving
the following steps:
1. Determine Dice Pool: Determine the number of dice the monster
will roll. This number is its dice pool.
• Start with the printed value of the monster's brawn—the
red value in the bottom-right corner of the back of the
monster's token.
• Add or subtract all dice as specified by other effects such
as monster abilities.
2. Roll Dice: An investigator rolls a number of dice equal to the
monster’s dice pool on behalf of the monster.
• The investigator cannot use an effect to reroll dice or convert
dice results unless the effect specifically states it can affect
this roll.
3. Determine Result: If the monster rolled two or more success
results (), the Barricade is discarded and the monster moves as
normal. Otherwise, the monster forfeits its movement.


Now what doesn't make sense to me is, when the app first has you setup a tile, it tells you that a barricade goes in 'X' spot, but once it tells you that, the barricade graphic just disappears. There is no option in the app (that I can find) which allows you to move the barricade in front of the door. Is this entire mechanic meant to be handled outside of the app? That's fine if it is, it just seems a bit odd.
 
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Calvin Le Huray
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You have to implement it outside of the app. If the door is blocked the monster has to roll a number of dice equal to the red number under the monster tile; if you roll two successes the monster breaks through.
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Richard A. Edwards
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Lacey
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Yes. Like several things, it's done on the board, not in the app.
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Howard

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eatshootsandleafs wrote:
You have to implement it outside of the app. If the door is blocked the monster has to roll a number of dice equal to the red number under the monster tile; if you roll two successes the monster breaks through.


Ahhh, ok. That makes sense. I actually tried to move the barricade to the entrance of the house but I guess that's not possible. Thanks for the quick responses!
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Eddie B
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Struggled with this too. I wish they would have left it in the app or when the monster comes in that it would ask if the door was barricaded or not.
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Baker Odom
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Bluffton
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This is covered under "Features" but strangely not under Barricade itself.
 
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Calvin Le Huray
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burrie wrote:
Struggled with this too. I wish they would have left it in the app or when the monster comes in that it would ask if the door was barricaded or not.


Agreed, it is a little confusing.
 
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Chris J Davis
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eatshootsandleafs wrote:
burrie wrote:
Struggled with this too. I wish they would have left it in the app or when the monster comes in that it would ask if the door was barricaded or not.


Agreed, it is a little confusing.


Comes in where? The app doesn't know where monsters are located on the board, so how is it supposed to ask if "the door" (which door?) is barricaded or not?
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Julia
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bleached_lizard wrote:
eatshootsandleafs wrote:
burrie wrote:
Struggled with this too. I wish they would have left it in the app or when the monster comes in that it would ask if the door was barricaded or not.


Agreed, it is a little confusing.


Comes in where? The app doesn't know where monsters are located on the board, so how is it supposed to ask if "the door" (which door?) is barricaded or not?


That's the point. The app could have integrated more options, but this would have required a lot more of constant inputting info into the app, resulting in the game to drag and in a lot of additional problems (more complex interface, more options to debug for each room and so on, so the app would have been heavier). Remember the app integrates the boardgame in order that the game is smoother, and the game is still a boardgame, thus it sounds right to me to have some stuff on the board to take care of
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Calvin Le Huray
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Spoiler (click to reveal)
In the first scenario the app suggest a monster comes through one of the doors and if you have put a barricade against the door, which the app instructs you to put in the room, maybe it should be asking you whether the door is barricaded.
 
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Chris J Davis
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eatshootsandleafs wrote:
Spoiler (click to reveal)
In the first scenario the app suggest a monster comes through one of the doors and if you have put a barricade against the door, which the app instructs you to put in the room, maybe it should be asking you whether the door is barricaded.


The only way the app would be saying something like "the monster comes through the door" is if the monster is being placed on the board. There's no way the app would say "the monster comes through the door" when the monster is moving (the app doesn't even provide flavour text during monster movement).
 
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Eddie B
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I still am a bit confused by the barricades. Let's say I need to place a monster but I barricaded the door and the monster fails the test to come in. Do I then just kill the monster in the app in order to get rid of it?
 
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Chris J Davis
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burrie wrote:
I still am a bit confused by the barricades. Let's say I need to place a monster but I barricaded the door and the monster fails the test to come in. Do I then just kill the monster in the app in order to get rid of it?


No. The monster just doesn't move. Why do you think it would be killed?
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Eddie B
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So it would just sit there and try the next turn to come in again?
 
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Chris J Davis
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burrie wrote:
So it would just sit there and try the next turn to come in again?


Exactly. But don't think of it as "just sitting there". It is viciously trying to rip the barricade into a flurry of wooden splinters while your investigators cower on the other side. Just in a turn-based way.
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Justin Davis
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Keep in mind that if a card or the App uses the word "Place", then you place the monster/investigator/component where it tells you, irrespective if doing so would normally violate movement rules because of distance, walls, barricades, etc.
 
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Graham Martin
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I think the confusion here is between the moment a monster first appears ("place a monster on the map" or "spawn") vs. when a monster that is already on the map starts to move ("move").

The app implies (incorrectly) that a barricade can be used to prevent a monster from entering the map (aka "being placed on the map.").

It implies this when, during the setup of the first scenario, it instructs you to place a red token over one specific door. It then plays a sound clip of crashing plates and says something like "sounds of screams and things crashing to the floor come from the next room." Right away, it displays a barrier token next to that same red token it was just talking about and says something like "You notice a bookshelf. Pushing it in front of the door could prevent someone or something from coming through. Place the barricade as indicated."

So, in short, the app just did the following:

1) Pointed to a specific door;

2) Let you know via sound effects and text that something bad is happening on the other side of that door; and

3) Told you that if you use an action to push the bookcase in front of that specific door, it MAY prevent something (let's face it...it's a monster, isn't it? It has to be...oh god I am so scared already...) from "coming" through that door. (Note: They use the ambiguous word "coming" which is not defined in the rules instead of "moving" or "spawning.")

Novice players like myself naturally think, "OK. There will be a monster coming through that door soon. The game is giving me a choice: do I use an action to move the barricade or do I think I have time to start moving and investigating and possibly outrun that thing? I think I will barricade the door. Now, how do I tell the app that I blocked that door?"

They, like myself, then look for the barricade icon in the app to click on and don't see one. They then click on the red token to see if there is a "I barricaded this door" pop-up menu option and don't see one. They grab the rule book again to read up on barricades and see only a sentence that says "When a monster attempts to move through a blocked door...it can destroy the barricade by doing X." We check the "Related Topics" at the end of the section on Barricades and see "Component Actions, Features, and Monsters." (Note...no reference to the section on "Movement.") We read those sections and see nothing more informative about this barricade issue.

We shrug our shoulders and think, "OK...I guess when the time comes, the app will show the the red icon in question and play some thumping sounds and ask me if the door is blocked." We then barricade the door and move on with the game.

A few turns later, the app does, indeed, focus on that red token, plays a screaming sound and then says that we are too late to do [spoiler]. We think..."Oh god, it's coming. I hope that barricade buys us some time. Who's got a gun?"

Then, the app shows a monster in the lobby and says "A creature bursts into the lobby from the direction of the scream.... Spawn a X monster as indicated."

This is when we all go "WTF? I barricaded that door. The door that the app just said that monster just came through. The app never asked me if it was barricaded and that monster just tore right through it. WTF?"

We then grab the rule book again and confirm that yes...it says "When a monster attempts to move through a blocked door...it can destroy the barricade by doing X." We then think...it never asked me to do X.

I hope that everyone can see how this would be frustrating.

We then come to board game geek and see a bunch of people asking the same question and feel a little less stupid. We then see people giving answers like "Barricades stop monsters from moving through doors. RTFM n00b!" and worry about people's ability to explain things.

We eventually figure out through piecing together several answers that the barricades don't have an effect when a monster is first placed on the map. Such an event is a "spawning" and not a "movement." Barricades only affect the movement of monsters already on the map, not monsters being spawned.

Finally, we think, "If we couldn't have prevented the monster from coming through that door, WTF was up with tricking us into wasting time barricading the door? FFS, you could teach us about barricades in some other way."

This is the fault of the poorly-designed setup text for the first scenario. Go read it again. Better yet, go start a new game and experience it. The entire scenario tells you that a) there is a monster on the other side of that specific door with a red token and b) you should seriously think about barricading that door. Later, it tells you that the monster came from the other side of that door. This is GREAT from the perspective of creating that eerie spooky feeling for first time players. Not so great from a "here's a tutorial for you n00bs" perspective.

They should 1) add explanatory text to the rule book and 2) add text to the scenario setup.

They should also consider adding a tutorial in teh app like they did for the Descent app.

Love the game, just need some tweaks to the text for us newbs!
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Pumpkinhead76 wrote:
^^As an action, an investigator in a space containing a Barricade
may move the Barricade against a door or Secret Passage or move
the Barricade away from the door or Secret Passage it blocks.


Not sure how often this would come up, but if you wanted to move a barricade from one door to another in the same space, would that require 2 separate actions, or just one?

The first part of that sentence just says the barricade must be in the same space as the investigator to be able to move it against a(nother?) door.
 
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Justin Davis
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Great explanation, and I agree with everything you said. When we played last night, I knew enough from talking with Burrie and reading these threads that we didn't bother doing anything with the barricades, though the rooms were set up in such a fashion that we could have used them later.

Overall, we had a blast playing, and despite this confusion, I think this is one of FFGs better explained games from a rules perspective.
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I think the confusion may not be helped with the app saying the barricade can be used on "the" door, rather than "a" door. But there were 3 doors total in the same space.
(EDIT: 3 doors includes the front door without Explore token.)

I noticed it said "the door" the next time a barricade appeared too, but that time there was only 1 door in the same space.
 
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Dan Killian
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Now I opened the door (of course) and assumed they'd mentioned the barricade should I want to chicken out, slam the door and barricade "it" in.

I've only played the scenario once so I'm not sure if the 'x' monster is the same but having been in the Kitchen area there's no back door there for a monster to come through so surely they're coming through the front door (and thus your barricade would never have done anything anyway as they didn't come through that door).

I can understand the frustration but that's how I interpreted it though granted you can't barricade the front door. Though why on earth you'd barricade yourself in a Mansion that's quite clearly got some spooky crap going down. Or why you'd go in there in the first place!

Love the game though
 
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Marijn Schaap
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Grahamers2002 wrote:
The app implies (incorrectly) that a barricade can be used to prevent a monster from entering the map (aka "being placed on the map.").


I agree. I did the same things you mentioned and still didn't get how to use the barricades. Since it kept bothering me I checked on BGG to find this topic. Now it seems I can't (usefully) use the first barricade at all.

The solution is probably to:
- "explore" the room.
- Don't "move" into it.
- "barricade" the door.

But I'm not sure since I only played it once, without barricading (I couldn't find the action in the "how to play" or app) the door and moving to other places.
 
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Chris J Davis
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GIIANT wrote:
Grahamers2002 wrote:
The app implies (incorrectly) that a barricade can be used to prevent a monster from entering the map (aka "being placed on the map.").


I agree. I did the same things you mentioned and still didn't get how to use the barricades. Since it kept bothering me I checked on BGG to find this topic. Now it seems I can't (usefully) use the first barricade at all.

The solution is probably to:
- "explore" the room.
- Don't "move" into it.
- "barricade" the door.


Barricading in this way is still useful. It will prevent the monster from leaving for longer than if you didn't do it (barring really unlucky dice rolls).

It also makes more thematic sense doing it this way rather than entering the mansion and just immediately barricading the first door you see. You hear some noises from the kitchen, so you just immediately move the nearby dresser up against the door? What if it's just the chef having a tantrum? The poor guy may have a bit of a temper, but that doesn't mean he deserves to be barricaded in his own kitchen!
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Eddie B
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bleached_lizard wrote:
GIIANT wrote:
Grahamers2002 wrote:
The app implies (incorrectly) that a barricade can be used to prevent a monster from entering the map (aka "being placed on the map.").


I agree. I did the same things you mentioned and still didn't get how to use the barricades. Since it kept bothering me I checked on BGG to find this topic. Now it seems I can't (usefully) use the first barricade at all.

The solution is probably to:
- "explore" the room.
- Don't "move" into it.
- "barricade" the door.


Barricading in this way is still useful. It will prevent the monster from leaving for longer than if you didn't do it (barring really unlucky dice rolls).

It also makes more thematic sense doing it this way rather than entering the mansion and just immediately barricading the first door you see. You hear some noises from the kitchen, so you just immediately move the nearby dresser up against the door? What if it's just the chef having a tantrum? The poor guy may have a bit of a temper, but that doesn't mean he deserves to be barricaded in his own kitchen!


Odd. When I go to a stranger's house, the first thing I do is barricade the door if I hear a strange noise...
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Andrzej Kaczor
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I have a question about barricade:

Let's say we have a monster which is standing next to the door which are barricaded. On the opposite side we have a room with investigators.

There is another path to that room but it is longer, about 4 spaces

Then app tell's us to move monster 2 spaces toward the nearest investigator. Nearest one is behind the doors but they are barricaded

So - monster should stay and try to move through barricade? Or choose longer way?

Also, if we have 2 paths to investigator which are equal length do players choose which one monster would take?
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