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Thomas
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There are a few issues with the game with only two players: The bidding track is useless and having majorities in the goods is too strong and can cause a run away leader.

Not sure how to tweak the bidding track but maybe for the goods track there could be a dummy marker that the player must pass in order to get the highest point reward. Not sure where exactly to start it at, should it be the same for each good or varying (descending from left to right)? The 5 point spot would be a good starting point for testing.

*if you feel the game is fine with two then no need to comment, this thread is for those of us who feel otherwise.

Thanks in advance. Any other ideas/suggestions please feel free to add them.
 
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Matt Simpson
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We just rotate first player each round
 
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Thomas
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coldkorn wrote:
We just rotate first player each round


What about the neutral token idea on the tracks?
 
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Scott Douglass
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When I was first examining the idea of a dummy player to increase the competition for 2 player, I concluded that the logical place to put it was at 3 on all goods. This was back in first edition though, and before the expansion. If you're playing with the steam bots, I'm not sure whether it's better to place it on 3 or 4.

The main thing is that there are more goods per player in 2 player, and any uncontested good gives you an advantage. Having a dummy player at 3 means that you don't get the bonus income or the full points during scoring for taking a single town or a building that gives 2 of one good and 1 of another. It increases the value of the cards that give 3 of a single good relative to the ones that give 2 of one good and one of another, which is what I was looking for in order to improve the balance between diversity and focus. The issue now is that steam bots allow you to much more easily reach 3 with a single card, so I would consider raising it to 4 if you don't think that 3 is enough.
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Thomas
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sdougla2 wrote:
When I was first examining the idea of a dummy player to increase the competition for 2 player, I concluded that the logical place to put it was at 3 on all goods. This was back in first edition though, and before the expansion. If you're playing with the steam bots, I'm not sure whether it's better to place it on 3 or 4.

The main thing is that there are more goods per player in 2 player, and any uncontested good gives you an advantage. Having a dummy player at 3 means that you don't get the bonus income or the full points during scoring for taking a single town or a building that gives 2 of one good and 1 of another. It increases the value of the cards that give 3 of a single good relative to the ones that give 2 of one good and one of another, which is what I was looking for in order to improve the balance between diversity and focus. The issue now is that steam bots allow you to much more easily reach 3 with a single card, so I would consider raising it to 4 if you don't think that 3 is enough.


I have the 2nd edition and no expansion. Any other ideas to help balance out the 2 player game? I think something is needed as the spread is too large if a one player has majority on more than two resources they are getting 6-10 points more when scoring as well as lots of money while the other person gets just a couple points. Having a dummy player would neuter this a little which would tighten the game up a lot.

ps what are the steam bots?
 
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Matt Simpson
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LunarSoundDesign wrote:
coldkorn wrote:
We just rotate first player each round


What about the neutral token idea on the tracks?


I have to clarify that, sorry. We rotate 2ns player gets a coin and first player gets no reward except for going first. We ignore the rest of the track. I think a dummy token would just frustrated us, but probably work
 
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Thomas
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coldkorn wrote:
LunarSoundDesign wrote:
coldkorn wrote:
We just rotate first player each round


What about the neutral token idea on the tracks?


I have to clarify that, sorry. We rotate 2ns player gets a coin and first player gets no reward except for going first. We ignore the rest of the track. I think a dummy token would just frustrated us, but probably work


A dummy player had nothing to do with player order read the OP
 
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Scott Douglass
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Steamb bots are a variant that was added with the expansion, but in second edition they were included in the base game.
 
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Thomas
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sdougla2 wrote:
Steamb bots are a variant that was added with the expansion, but in second edition they were included in the base game.


Are they in the back of the rules, I don't recall seeing any thing about them.. What do they do?
 
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Scott Douglass
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Basically whoever takes the first card in the row or discards it when they conquer a neutral town gets a steam bot. There's only one available per round. You can assign a steam bot to a building that generates goods, and it gives you one more of whichever good it gives more of. So if you have a building that gives 3 turnips, you can put a steam bot on it and get an additional turnip, or if you have a building that gives 2 glow moss and 1 turnip you can put a steam bot on it to get an additional glow moss. A card can only have one steam bot normally, and assigning them is permanent.

It's at the back of the rules at the beginning of the variant section.
 
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Thomas
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How do they work with two? Are they suggested?
 
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Scott Douglass
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I think the 2 player game probably works better without them, but you can try them and see what you think.
 
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Thomas
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sdougla2 wrote:
I think the 2 player game probably works better without them, but you can try them and see what you think.


Any ideas to fix the player order bidding track? I'm also thinking 4 is the best spot for the neutral player
 
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