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1844/1854» Forums » General

Subject: So now that it is trickling out... rss

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Mark Watson
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How do people feel about this printing? And the play of the game(s) generally? The only O&O game I've played is 1880, which I thought was really neat.
 
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Jimmy Okolica
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1854 is new for me and I like it. There are several interesting decisions including pursuing an 1830 yellow strategy, when/if to split, game timing for hitting the top right of the stock market, dumping a bunch of cash into the minors so that the locals can run for lots of money. Our second play was 4.5 hours so I can see this sitting in the 3 - 4 hour range which will probably get it at least an occasional play.

For me, 1844 is just too long without enough interesting decisions. It's not a bad game and I won't say no to play it, but I'd pick two shorter games over one play of 44.
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Alex Yeager
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Note that "trickling out" should be read as "out of stock, and potentially out of print, at the publisher level""under 20% of the print run remaining at the publisher level"...

Alex Yeager
Mayfair Games
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Paul Schorfheide
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AlexYeager wrote:
Note that "trickling out" should be read as "out of stock, and potentially out of print, at the publisher level"...


Wow, feeling better about my impulse buy at my FLGS a couple weeks ago.
 
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James E
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AlexYeager wrote:
Note that "trickling out" should be read as "out of stock, and potentially out of print, at the publisher level"...


That was fast! I've only seen in stock at one retailer here in Canada.
 
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They've done some nice things on the production:
- the map and hexes are gorgeous and, for the most part, highly legible
- hexes exclusive to one game have a small flag on the front and a large one on the back to denote which game they're used in
- tokens have unique badges designs on one side depending upon the game they're used in while the backs have text in serif (54) or sans serif (44) which is really nice when you're separating them out.
- great tile manifest showing the upgrade options
- train cards are color coded based upon phase
- the rulebook, for 54 at least (haven't looked at 44 yet,) is well organized and not the disaster that was Mayfair's version of 30

The drawbacks of the production I've seen so far include:
- no baggies in the box
- the lettered company tokens for 54 are double sided
- the charters are too big
- no certificates for the local companies in 54 so that the (huge) charters have to be setout in their place during the intial auction
- the stock market (44)/ local map (54) is cardstock instead of cardboard
- the font used in the 54 stock market isn't the most legible
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John Wellman
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AlexYeager wrote:
Note that "trickling out" should be read as "out of stock, and potentially out of print, at the publisher level"...

Alex Yeager
Mayfair Games


Awesome news, especially considering it seems like the 2011 print of 1830 seems to have not run out yet!
 
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Alex Yeager
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I will revise the above in an hour or two, but I was the victim of bad Intel; we're about 80% through the run right now. Still better than we originally expected, but a but less panic is required by interested parties.

Sorry for the confusion! (And to the above comment about still having 1830: we printed a LOT more of that, and we're beginning to think about what happens next there, as we're–hah, I see what you did there! Try to trip me up twice in one day, huh? Ingrates, allaya!)

Alex Yeager
Mayfair Games
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JR
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@Alex, any chance you can/will state the size of the print runs of 1844/1854 and/or the 1830 run?
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dyvim tanelorn
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I bought Poseidon. And so I've had to buy 1830. At that point 1853 was bought. 1844/1854 was mine as soon as it was available. So, the question is... what's next?
A man can dream, so... 1817 :whistle: ?
 
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JR
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A couple years ago I would have laughed at the suggestion of such a niche title as 1817 to get picked up for mass print by an effort like the Lookout/Mayfair treatment, but I also would probably have laughed at the proposition of 1844 being printed and we've seen that happen now. I guess it's possible, but it still seems like it would be a poor choice to print 1817. Legendary though it may be, 1817 is still surely one of the most prohibitive 18XX titles in terms of complexity, duration of play time and cost of components. Assuming the rights holders are interested in licensing out any title to Mayfair, I'd expect there to be many more profitable games they could target.

I have nothing to base this on, but I would also suspect that the 1844/1854 release was at least somewhat fueled by the fact that Helmut and Lonny built a relationship with Lookout Games through the publication of Railroad Barons and Poseidon. If that relationship is any part of the reason behind this latest production, then those who are interested in speculating such things might look at the Double-O library of games to see what could be eligible for a larger-scale reprint. 1848: Australia is a gem that would surely receive greater praise if it were in more collections.
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J C Lawrence
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I'm also quite fond of the original 1862 from Double-O Games. It isn't the most exciting game, but it has more than a little charm.
 
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RvdH
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Mark.Watson wrote:
How do people feel about this printing? And the play of the game(s) generally? The only O&O game I've played is 1880, which I thought was really neat.


I'm quite happy with the printing, especially compared to Mayfair's 1830: Railways & Robber Barons. The quality of the components is excellent. I was impressed when I opened the box for the first time.
* I really like the tokens: they're double sided, but the front has the company logo, while the back has the name. So you can flip them during play, but still recognize which is which.
* The tiles are thick, so they're easy to pick up. They have a classic design and use the "normal" numbering scheme.
* The shares are clear enough. Percentages are displayed in a large font, and it uses adequate striping. There is also a subtile difference between the front and back of shares that can be split, although maybe it could've been a little more explicit.
* The country flags on the front and back of components are really useful. It makes separating stuff at the end of a game fairly easy.
* The board is OK. It is debatable whether the mountains are clear enough, but it works.
* The charters have a nice finish. The charters of the Local Railways (1854) should not have space for a mail contract on them, which is unfortunate.

So component wise a good production.
 
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Devin Smith
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I need to contradict the others: the tokens are terrible. Completely awful, particularly in 1844.

All the companies in '44 have the same logo, in different colours with a graphic that's so tiny as to be invisible. There's three or four elements crammed onto the tokens, causing all of them to be too small.

They used a different shield shape for '54, but still the same shape on all of them.

Use a different shape/logo on every single token. You don't have to include the graphic on which company type/number it is inside the circle. I can tell the companies in '17 apart from across the table, and there are 25 of them. I can't tell the logo sides of the some pre-swiss railways apart from more than a foot away.

I'm severely tempted to make my own tokens for this game if I can dig up the historical logos for the companies that actually existed.
_____
The tables on the charters are missing at least one important piece of information, though I forget which thing I had to continually look up the rules without the game in front of me. The train limits are not listed in the phase change chart.
_____

On another note there's at least two places where the rules self-contradict, and at least one place where the rules left an XX meant to be filled in later in place.

 
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JR
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Devin if you do undertake making your own replacement tokens, you might find using historical logos to be little improvement for readability across the table, a criterion you specifically noted. Historical real-world logos are often pretty ghastly when used on 1/2" discs because they were intended to emblazon the side of huge locomotives. Furthermore, it is often the case that historical RR markings will conflict with the many colour-coded materials in the game (such as charters and/or shares) adding to confusion.

If you do look to replace the tokens, I'd suggest using Clearclaw's xxpaper to whip up a set of highly readable and distinguishable tokens. This would give you freedom of colour choices (including the ability toe have two colours on a token) and put very readable acronyms on the tokens.
 
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J C Lawrence
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jrebelo wrote:
This would give you freedom of colour choices (including the ability toe have two colours on a token)...


Actually, you can get up to 6 colours without getting fancy: top and bottom colours, top and bottom stripe colours, background colour and text colour. Which is not to say it would be a Good Idea...



The bottom token there has the most colours I've used together yet, but you could go further.
 
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JR
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Very nice, JC. Is this sheet from your current design with the free city placement and 50 share corps?
 
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J C Lawrence
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Yup.

(Though the repo is both stale and a bit confused right now -- I have a rather horrible N-way merge I need to recover from...)
 
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Alex Yeager
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@JR: Not really, no. The 1830 was the large run, of course; these other games have been a smaller (though, frankly, not inconsiderable runs compared to other games in our line). 1830 sold big out of the gate, and then slowed down. 1853 sold well, and met our projections for when that would sell out. What we have seen is in the past 9-12 months is a surge in interest/sales in 1830, coinciding with the runup to 1844/54. So, that surge is causing our 1844/54 supply to be running out MUCH faster than expected, and the 1830 stock to be dwindling quickly. We're discussing what will come next, as our two goals is to keep 1830 available as a starting point, and cycle through other titles to keep the variety up. From where we stand, this is a growing niche and we're thinking about how to both keep it growing and supply it appropriately.

Alex Yeager
Mayfair Games

(edit to fix 1853 to correct title)
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Toby Mao
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AlexYeager wrote:
@JR: Not really, no. The 1830 was the large run, of course; these other games have been a smaller (though, frankly, not inconsiderable runs compared to other games in our line). 1830 sold big out of the gate, and then slowed down. 1854 sold well, and met our projections for when that would sell out. What we have seen is in the past 9-12 months is a surge in interest/sales in 1830, coinciding with the runup to 1844/54. So, that surge is causing our 1844/54 supply to be running out MUCH faster than expected, and the 1830 stock to be dwindling quickly. We're discussing what will come next, as our two goals is to keep 1830 available as a starting point, and cycle through other titles to keep the variety up. From where we stand, this is a growing niche and we're thinking about how to both keep it growing and supply it appropriately.

Alex Yeager
Mayfair Games


Wow, this is great news for the hobby. Glad 18xx is picking up steam (I'm a new comer to the system)and thankful that you guys are reacting to it positively.
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JR
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That's a great update to hear, Alex. Best of luck continuing to grow this community. We really need more players here on Vancouver Island. If you can get more boxes onto FLGS shelves then I'll try to take it from there.
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Mark Watson
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Partially out of OOS fears (but mostly because I want to play it!) I now have a copy. Thanks again to Lookout and MFG for helping renew interest in this game series.
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Michael Theiss
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Excalabur wrote:
I need to contradict the others: the tokens are terrible. Completely awful, particularly in 1844.

All the companies in '44 have the same logo, in different colours with a graphic that's so tiny as to be invisible. There's three or four elements crammed onto the tokens, causing all of them to be too small.

They used a different shield shape for '54, but still the same shape on all of them.

Use a different shape/logo on every single token. You don't have to include the graphic on which company type/number it is inside the circle. I can tell the companies in '17 apart from across the table, and there are 25 of them. I can't tell the logo sides of the some pre-swiss railways apart from more than a foot away.

I'm severely tempted to make my own tokens for this game if I can dig up the historical logos for the companies that actually existed.
_____
The tables on the charters are missing at least one important piece of information, though I forget which thing I had to continually look up the rules without the game in front of me. The train limits are not listed in the phase change chart.
_____

On another note there's at least two places where the rules self-contradict, and at least one place where the rules left an XX meant to be filled in later in place.


Yes, I will bw redoing the tokens and charters.
 
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