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Scythe» Forums » Rules

Subject: Does Saxony HAVE to place a victory star after 2? rss

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Chip Crawford
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The rules say there is no limit, but after they place two stars for combat victories, are they required to place additional stars for further victories?

We had a game where another player attacked Saxony and sloughed the bid so that Saxony would win and place their last star. (Saxony was not in a winning position)

I noticed that Saxony had already played two star to victories, and doubting my own winning position, I suggested that the Saxony player not place the star. We agreed at the table that the rules did not say they "must" so she chose not to, and the game continued.

Which worked for me, because I went on to win.

What does everyone think? Did we play right?
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Jamey Stegmaier
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If you win combat and you can place a star, you must place a star.
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Chip Crawford
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Thanks, Jamey.
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Jamey Stegmaier
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For the record, I can see how the rules are unclear about that. They say the right thing--place a star when you win combat--but that statement always includes the caveat of "up to 2 stars". That's there to remind non-Saxon players that they can only get up to 2 stars for winning combat, but regardless, the rule that proceeds that "up to 2 stars" statement still applies to Saxony.
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Jussi-Pekka Jokinen
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jameystegmaier wrote:
For the record, I can see how the rules are unclear about that. They say the right thing--place a star when you win combat--but that statement always includes the caveat of "up to 2 stars". That's there to remind non-Saxon players that they can only get up to 2 stars for winning combat, but regardless, the rule that proceeds that "up to 2 stars" statement still applies to Saxony.


So, compared to other rewards such as resources and coins (which are always optional), stars are mandatory? This applies to power and popularity stars, right? We had a game where I forgot to place a star when I had the "trigger" for it, and my girlfriend frowned at my "wait wait let's back up a turn".
 
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GAF Blizzard
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Thinsilver wrote:
jameystegmaier wrote:
For the record, I can see how the rules are unclear about that. They say the right thing--place a star when you win combat--but that statement always includes the caveat of "up to 2 stars". That's there to remind non-Saxon players that they can only get up to 2 stars for winning combat, but regardless, the rule that proceeds that "up to 2 stars" statement still applies to Saxony.


So, compared to other rewards such as resources and coins (which are always optional), stars are mandatory? This applies to power and popularity stars, right? We had a game where I forgot to place a star when I had the "trigger" for it, and my girlfriend frowned at my "wait wait let's back up a turn".

I assume stars are mandatory, BUT you can decline the other rewards that would trigger stars.

For example, you can choose not to gain the final heart if you don't want the star.
 
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Chip Crawford
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GAFBlizzard wrote:
Thinsilver wrote:
jameystegmaier wrote:
For the record, I can see how the rules are unclear about that. They say the right thing--place a star when you win combat--but that statement always includes the caveat of "up to 2 stars". That's there to remind non-Saxon players that they can only get up to 2 stars for winning combat, but regardless, the rule that proceeds that "up to 2 stars" statement still applies to Saxony.


So, compared to other rewards such as resources and coins (which are always optional), stars are mandatory? This applies to power and popularity stars, right? We had a game where I forgot to place a star when I had the "trigger" for it, and my girlfriend frowned at my "wait wait let's back up a turn".

I assume stars are mandatory, BUT you can decline the other rewards that would trigger stars.

For example, you can choose not to gain the final heart if you don't want the star.


GAF,

Can you describe a situation where you would be able to decline a popularity point?

Jamey has described it as basically, if you CAN you MUST, but I'm not sure I understand the situation you're talking about.
 
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Philip Morton
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ChipChuck wrote:
Can you describe a situation where you would be able to decline a popularity point?

Jamey has described it as basically, if you CAN you MUST, but I'm not sure I understand the situation you're talking about.

Anything in a green box, you're allowed to decline.

From the rulebook, page 10:

Quote:
The costs (red boxes) and benefits (green boxes) on your Player Mat are shown by the number of empty spaces before the action is taken. When taking an action, first pay the cost, then gain the benefit (or only part of the benefit, in the rare case where your strategy depends on a partial benefit).

Stars aren't a thing in a green box, so you can't decline them.
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Chip Crawford
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Chrondeath wrote:
ChipChuck wrote:
Can you describe a situation where you would be able to decline a popularity point?

Jamey has described it as basically, if you CAN you MUST, but I'm not sure I understand the situation you're talking about.

Anything in a green box, you're allowed to decline.

From the rulebook, page 10:

Quote:
The costs (red boxes) and benefits (green boxes) on your Player Mat are shown by the number of empty spaces before the action is taken. When taking an action, first pay the cost, then gain the benefit (or only part of the benefit, in the rare case where your strategy depends on a partial benefit).

Stars aren't a thing in a green box, so you can't decline them.


Oh, okay, now I understand. I was confused thinking you meant something like making it to the top of the popularity chart and gaining the star.

So, yeah, that's interesting that you can decline the benefits from the action space.
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Jamey Stegmaier
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Philip is correct. Benefits in Scythe are optional (anything in a green box) or on an encounter card (specifically noted on the encounter page of the rules), but stars aren't optional. They represent something bigger than a standard benefit.
 
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GAF Blizzard
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Yes, Philip said what I meant. A recruit bonus might give you a heart, forcing your 6th star to occur.

But, you can refuse that recruit bonus since it's in a green box.
 
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Martin Jeffreys
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jameystegmaier wrote:
If you win combat and you can place a star, you must place a star.

We had a 2 player game where there Nordic player (with 5 stars, incl. two from combat) attacked a 5 star Saxony (also with two from combat already) intending to make Saxony place a 6th Star.

We weren't sure at the time if placing beyond the 2nd Star was mandatory, but counted scores to see if it made a difference - Saxony won by 5 points (48 vs 43).
With their next turn, Saxony would have reached tier 2 on the popularity track and been well ahead, so the play by the Nords had merit.
An interesting tactic to be aware of when playing as Saxony!
 
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Flight Doc
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If the situation is such that the winner does not want the star because this will end the game when he's is a weak position, he can "throw" the fight instead and put a zero on his power dial. He'll lose, get no cards, have to retreat, etc. BUT, the game won't end and the winner may actually lose popularity depending on the presence of workers.
 
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