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Champions of Midgard» Forums » General

Subject: Sheesh. Hollywood is now more realistic than our hobby rss

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Patrick C.
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My wife and I have been watching the History Channel's Vikings series. We just finished half of season 4 and now have to wait for the next 10 episodes. We're becoming less enchanted with it, but my wife still loves the character Lagatha, a woman who means what she says while still remaining faithful to those closest to her.

We've been looking for a real Vikings themed game, something that at least touched upon their history of exploration, war and innovation. And Vikings was not it.

Heard a lot of great things about Champions of Midgard. Just received the game today. I didn't look at the artwork until just now when I opened the box.



Versus this for Lagatha in the TV series


I see that someone has already commented on the image above from the game and sure enough, someone else responded sarcastically about how the trolls in the game weren't realistic.

I realize this game has clear fantasy elements.

But what is the purpose of the artwork of a female warrior carrying two swords (just no) with an exposed midriff? Because the only clear reason to me is to appeal to male eyes. Even in a fantasy setting the image above is ridiculous. It's ridiculous that the artwork in this game is the norm, not the exception.

It really says something when Hollywood can do a better job than our hobby. No, we don't have a problem. Not at all.whistle shake

I'll be blunt, I'm not really interested in fending off remarks from people who think I'm being PC or trying to censor, or whatever. You feel that way, fine. But I'm disgusted and I'm sure I'm not the only one. The above image repels people from this hobby. It repels many women and the people who don't want such stupid artwork in their games.

Assuming Viking women fought in combat - and I believe that is true even if it wasn't the norm - they did not dress like the women in Midgard. It is not PC to say you want a female warrior to be dressed . . . like a real warrior.

As for Lagatha, the only problem I see in the image above is her long hair which would have been a problem in combat. It's a non-issue when comparing to how bad the artwork is in so many of the games in this hobby.
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Richard Derr
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If I'm remembering my player boards correctly for this game, a few of the men are shirtless. I don't think the men dressed this way either. So if there's an argument to make about this game it's that the artist was consistent across genders with their lack of armor.

I could be remembering the board wrong though....

However, I do get your point and generally agree with you, I just don't think this is the game to make that argument.
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Maui Chris
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travvller wrote:
It really says something when Hollywood can do a better job than our hobby.


really? please, save your silly outage for something more serious than this. There are plenty of better examples out there.

At worst, this is a PG disney-esque portrayal of a viking warrior. maybe Svanhildr is so badass, she doesn't need a stinking shield. After all the best defense is a good offense.

Apparently Rollo & those other dudes don't need shirts or a shields either (since you brought Vikings into it)
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Thomas King
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travvller wrote:

We've been looking for a real Vikings themed game, something that at least touched upon their history of exploration, war and innovation. And Vikings was not it.

Champions of Midgard is more fantasy game than Viking game. It's a mix of norse mythology and contemporary fantasy tropes. If you want something more grounded in reality, I recommend Fire & Axe.
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Peter Darby
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Well, I've filled out "It's not so bad", "It's fantasy", "Here's men without shirts in something else, please pretend it's relevant" and "There are much worse things to complain about" on my Casual Objectification Excuse Bingo Board. One more square for the line! I'm hoping it's "But she's HOT!"
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Maui Chris
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pete_darby wrote:
Well, I've filled out "It's not so bad", "It's fantasy", "Here's men without shirts in something else, please pretend it's relevant" and "There are much worse things to complain about" on my Casual Objectification Excuse Bingo Board. One more square for the line! I'm hoping it's "But she's HOT!"



well Katheryn Winnick, the actor who plays Lagertha is gorgeous. Maybe they should have cast some hag to be more realistic devil
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Andrew Kapish
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travvller wrote:
sure enough, someone else responded sarcastically about how the trolls in the game weren't realistic.
Sounds like a real jerk.
 
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Casey Lent
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pete_darby wrote:
Well, I've filled out "It's not so bad", "It's fantasy", "Here's men without shirts in something else, please pretend it's relevant" and "There are much worse things to complain about" on my Casual Objectification Excuse Bingo Board. One more square for the line! I'm hoping it's "But she's HOT!"


I like to imagine, "Don't like it? Don't buy it!" as the "free square" in the middle of the board.

We've now condemned this thread to lock up.
 
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Reid
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I think it's important to keep in mind the roots of artwork done for fantasy settings. In the genre you won't find many bigger names than Frank Frazetta, who did paintings for Conan the Barbarian and such. His style tended to oversexualize the subjects set in a barbaric, fantasy world. It's one of those situations where his work is so synonymous with the genre (viking/barbarian) that it's ingrained in many that it's what it should look like. Kind of like how everyone calls a tissue a Kleenex. Look at the art for Blood Rage, and you'll see the same influence.

Google some of his work. You have to admire his skill even if you don't like the subject matter. For me, seeing artwork like this, I always see an artist giving a nod to Frazetta, who truly deserves the respect.
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Kyle Reeser
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I'll be honest, Patrick; the fact that Svanhildr is dressed like that wasn't even a blip on my radar until you brought it up--but now I can't unsee it blush At least Dagrun is wearing something more sensible, although I'm also now aware that she's showing way more cleavage than is necessary. (Which is to say, any at all.)

You're right, of course--there's really no reason for the ladies to look the way they do, and it is the sort of thing that could alienate a large percentage of gamers and potential gamers. This is something I (and others) could stand to be more mindful of.
 
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Martin Wheeler
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pete_darby wrote:
Well, I've filled out..."Here's men without shirts in something else, please pretend it's relevant"...

Hello, just a quick few clarifications if I may. Not all directly related to your post mind.

1. The picture of men without shirts is not "in something else". Both the armoured female above and the unarmoured men (also above) are from the same show "Vikings". So you cheated on your bingo card.

The fact that she (Lagertha in the series) is armoured is down to the fact that she is an Earl and thus the armour is a status symbol. In earlier shows she wore leather armour closely resembling a corset/miniskirt combo, although with a long sleeved top underneath.

2. Vikings is not in fact "Hollywood", it's made for the History TV channel so should be more historically accurate right?

3. Sadly, despite this fact a number of scholars and professors have criticised it for a wide range of historical inaccuracies including it's depiction of Viking clothing. So the picture from the show isn't much more accurate that chainmail bikini warrior. soblue


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Robert Kingery
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I will second Fire and Axe. It is a great Viking game.

You may not want to avoid Kingdom Death at all cost. (It is an amazing game though)
 
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Bård Holst
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It's Lagertha
 
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Jeremy C
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I thought this post was going to be a complaint about the frustration of rolling dice in games not even meeting the realism of combat portrayed in Hollywood.

Not joking, that's why I clicked on it.

I agree that the art is getting close to typical adolescent male fantasy art. (We all know from experience that we've seen much worse, if nothing else, on the cover of a comic book. It's just rare in games.)

It would be one thing if all the art was silly or unrealistic as part of their theme or stylistic choices. I'd have no problem in that case.
 
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