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Thomas Chauvin
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Hey y'all!

I'm new on this board, so I apologize if this has been asked already. I've lately found a deeper interest in board games. I don't have any relationship to Lovecrafts stories, however I think MoM looks like a really exciting and fun game.

For someone who has never played such games before, what edition would you recommend? As I've understood the main difference is that in the first edition, one player is managing the keeper role, while in the second there's an app for doing so.

What is pros and cons for both games? Is the app so good that one will not miss to play as a keeper? Or is it so fun to be the keeper that one have to try it out?
 
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Bruce
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Your summary is correct. First edition is very fiddly to set up (takes a long time and one error can ruin the game). It also has some broken scenarios out of the box. Personally I wouldn't consider 1st Ed to be worthwhile without the Call of the Wild expansion. It doesn't fix the setup issues, but the scenarios are much more interesting (plus there is a lot more content in general).

For someone getting into this type of game 1st ed MoM could be a bit much. 2nd ed is certainly more accessible while (arguably) not losing much.

That said both the base game for first ed and Call of the Wild are out of print, so depending on your budget and local availability you might not have much choice anyway.
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Johan Anglemark
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BruceLGL wrote:
Your summary is correct. First edition is very fiddly to set up (takes a long time and one error can ruin the game). It also has some broken scenarios out of the box. Personally I wouldn't consider 1st Ed to be worthwhile without the Call of the Wild expansion. It doesn't fix the setup issues, but the scenarios are much more interesting (plus there is a lot more content in general).

For someone getting into this type of game 1st ed MoM could be a bit much. 2nd ed is certainly more accessible while (arguably) not losing much.

That said both the base game for first ed and Call of the Wild are out of print, so depending on your budget and local availability you might not have much choice anyway.

The new edition has a BGG Weight: 2.60, the old one 3.24. (And in this case that doesn't mean how hard it is to win, but just how complex when it comes to rules and various components. The 2 ed is much more streamlined.)

Apart from the obvious thing, the app, I'd say that 1 ed is more Keeper vs Players than a coop, and as Bruce mentioned, much fiddlier. 2 ed is more like a coop RPG, the app is not an AI playing against you, but a neutral GM, and it is much more streamlined rules-wise.
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James
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If you look on the forums of BGG for Mansions of Madness, you will find a variant for playing the game without a Keeper. I have played one called "The Fall of House Lynch" using the paragraph method, and it's a lot of fun either solo or coop. Most of the scenarios are available in this format.

The reasons I'm currently staying away from MOM 2 are as follows

1. The ridiculous price ($115.95 + tax + shipping)
2. Quality of the components (miniatures and bases)
3. Problems with the app (lots of bugs...)
4. The game does not contain much for the price and in order to get more miniatures you will need to buy content from first edition (who knows how much that will be selling for)
5. Only four scenarios in MOM 2 (perhaps 5, I can't remember)
6. What will happen to the app long term (I would prefer to have a hard copy of the program)

With so many great games on the market and with much better quality components, I am hard pressed to spend so much on so little.
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Brian Bowles
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Also might mention that FFG is going to release all the mini's and board tiles from all of 1st ed. boxes for use in 2nd Ed. So you will be able to get all the 2nd ed. playable content without paying eBay prices for out of print 1st ed. stuff.
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Alexander Steinbach
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Get the second edition, hands down.

While the first edition is a great game (it truly is!), it takes you at least 30 minutes to setup (45 when inexperienced) and misplacing 1 single card on the board can break the game. Game play in general feels clunky. Several scenarios are greatly imbalanced and need patching to fix. A lot of the rules are complicated and redundant. Combat is innovative, but very clunky. Additionally, you need a player to be the Keeper. Usually this role befalls you, as the game owner. And while I had great fun playing the keeper in mansions 1, it is nice to be able to be an investigator in this game.

Mansions of madness 2 streamlines a lot of elements from the 1st edition. The app manages everything that took the keeper an entire evening to prepare and organise. Setup is quick and easy. Maps can now vary and you explore the mansion tile by tile while you play. Combat is quick and easy; the new dice system is better than the previous system. Scenarios are better designed overall and the game is now (in general) full coop. I say in general because it contains a possible traitor mechanic in the insanity cards which are really a cool addition is you ask me!

So, what's not to like? James basically summed up the negatives like he often does.
1. Yes, the game is expensive. Although I have heard that the prices can vary a great deal depending on where you do your shopping. A lot has been said about that already. It costs what it costs and it is up to you to decide if you can afford it.
2. Monster quality is fine. It's not excellent, it's not stellar. Some might say it is not even good. But they're not terrible and do get the job done. They are not going to improve either, so it's take it or leave it.
3. The app has some bugs which they are working out as we speak. This is to be expected with a game like this. The newest version seems to have solved the most damaging bugs and malfunctions. Give it a few more weeks and they have this completely sorted out.
4. The game comes with 4 scenarios. While this is not much, 2 additional scenarios have already been announced which will be free. The app gives them the opportunity to release new scenarios on a regular basis without the need to print and ship more cards. Additionally, because of the app, a lot of variation can be introduced in each scenario giving them a great replayability. They are not that easy either, so don't expect to win them all on your first playthrough.

This turned out to be almost a review in its own. But if you like this kind of games and are willing to pay the money, then by all means, get this game.
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Chris
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To the OP: I would definitely get 2nd edition over 1st at this point. However James (grahamj) does make some good points about the current issues.

grahamj wrote:
The reasons I'm currently staying away from MOM 2 are as follows

1. Not a ridiculous price IMO but quite high. Cheapest currently is about $90 (price+shipping), or maybe $82 if you're already a B&N "member"($25/yr) with extra coupon.
2. Quality: Most people seem "ok" with the minis, but mediocre quality doesn't match the price tag. Plus the big bases seem like a cumbersome holdover from 1st ed than a requirement.
3. App problems: Yeah, it's called being on the "bleeding edge", combined with a seeming rush to publish. At least the updates are coming frequently. Most probably see no problems, but enough do for me to worry a little. Probably will be fully stable in 4-6 weeks.
4. 1st ed. components are coming soon in 2 expansions. I would not be surprised to see MSRP of both combined to be around the same as 1st ed.'s old MSRP ($80), though.
5. # of scenarios: Time will tell if FFG releases more core scenarios as app updates "for free" (justifying the high game price). More likely to be released as IAP (in-app-purchase) and DLC (downloadable content upgrade) for a fee, though.
6. Although "hot" game apps do live on a different timescale ("ancient" = 5 years?), the apps should get updates as long as the board game is in print. Afterwards it will likely still run for years. 10+ years after that there will likely be emulators for our brain implants to run such old software.
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Aaron Yoder
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To answer your last question, it should be mentioned that in 1st Ed. MoM, if the Keeper plays his hardest (or tries at all, really), the players WILL lose. It cannot be played as a competitive game even though it is clearly designed to be, and most of the game's tension hinges upon the threat of the Keeper winning. This is a fatal design flaw, and it renders the game pointless to play as the Keeper. Nobody is missing out by not playing the Keeper.
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Jason Nopa
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grahamj wrote:

1. The ridiculous price ($115.95 + tax + shipping)

This will depend on where you live. In some cases, you may live somewhere where it's not that expensive, so it's really a personal choice.

grahamj wrote:

2. Quality of the components (miniatures and bases)

This is another area where some people are fine with it, and others want more. If the price was already expensive to you, you'll find reason to complain. I find the price to be fine. The miniatures are ok. I have games with far worse miniatures, but I also have games with better miniatures. The miniatures serve their purpose for me and they do not distract. Some people have had issues with bases and the miniatures not fitting or the monster tokens not fitting into the bases. Both are known issues, but you can fix them yourself. Many people would argue that if they're paying for the game at such a high price, it shouldn't be an issue at all. It's really up to you and what your expectations are, though.

grahamj wrote:

3. Problems with the app (lots of bugs...)

Something that can be fixed in time. Other games have "bugs", too. Those are fixed with errata. App driven games are fixed with software updates. App driven games are more problematic because a hard crash or bug can cause you to lose progress on a game. Where most board games shine are in their ability to work around that problem by house ruling/etc. Mansions of Madness 2.0 (and 1.0) as a whole suffer when the game does not work as intended. A bad 1.0 problem can be worked around, however. A 2.0 crash is just time lost. So if that's a concern for you, do your research or wait for the app to be updated.

grahamj wrote:

4. The game does not contain much for the price and in order to get more miniatures you will need to buy content from first edition (who knows how much that will be selling for)

For me, there is a quality of experience vs quantity. And when the game runs well, it has provided a wonderful experience. The extra miniatures are nice for thematic variety, but they won't overwhelm you. This is a starting point...it's up to their design team to take it further. You may need to be patient, however, as FFG sometimes spends a lot of time jumping around their franchises and some games don't see expansions for a while. (Battlelore 2.0 went about a year without an expansion; Runebound went quite a while; and X-com went even longer)

grahamj wrote:

5. Only four scenarios in MOM 2 (perhaps 5, I can't remember)

They've already announced that the expansions containing 1.0 figures/tiles will also come with 1 new scenario each. We don't know of future plans, but they can also release additional scenarios for APP purchase at any time.

grahamj wrote:

6. What will happen to the app long term (I would prefer to have a hard copy of the program)

Most people want the app to exist permanently in some physical form so they always have access to it. I don't blame them. However, it's only an issue for anything with a very restrictive license. Otherwise, Steam will have it, and the app stores will have it for quite some time. If it ever goes away, you know someone will have figured out what needs to be backed up, and they'll keep it stored somewhere. That's the "general" idea, and while it's not a hard written promise, you'd be hard pressed to prove that it won't happen.

So, these are legitimate concerns for the above poster, but for me, having played it, I find it to be worth my money and time. (I also have 1.0, and find that equally as fun, but for completely different reasons. I'll be keeping both and playing one or the other dependent on the group i'm with)
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Enon Sci
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rokkon wrote:

grahamj wrote:

3. Problems with the app (lots of bugs...)

Something that can be fixed in time. Other games have "bugs", too. Those are fixed with errata. App driven games are fixed with software updates. App driven games are more problematic because a hard crash or bug can cause you to lose progress on a game. Where most board games shine are in their ability to work around that problem by house ruling/etc. Mansions of Madness 2.0 (and 1.0) as a whole suffer when the game does not work as intended. A bad 1.0 problem can be worked around, however. A 2.0 crash is just time lost. So if that's a concern for you, do your research or wait for the app to be updated.


Also something that might be fixed as we speak, seeing as how FFG did a fairly extensive update yesterday (1.0.2).

I suspect another patch will follow in short order for smaller concerns, but my biggest concerns seem addressed (save bug).

p.s. and no, addressed doesn't mean fixed, but it leaves me hopeful till I can try for myself.
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Scott Cantor
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nomoredroids wrote:
To answer your last question, it should be mentioned that in 1st Ed. MoM, if the Keeper plays his hardest (or tries at all, really), the players WILL lose. It cannot be played as a competitive game even though it is clearly designed to be, and most of the game's tension hinges upon the threat of the Keeper winning. This is a fatal design flaw, and it renders the game pointless to play as the Keeper. Nobody is missing out by not playing the Keeper.


That's not a fatal flaw, it just makes 1e essentially a stripped down Call of Cthulhu RPG experience. If you play CoC and want to kill the party, you can. Same in any RPG. If you're not looking for an RPG experience, then no, you would not care for 1e.

Unlike Descent, it's even explicit in the MoM rules that the Keeper's job is to create a good story, not compete balls out to win. Some people like that, some don't. I actually enjoy it quite a bit, but I also liked DMing in my younger days.
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Enon Sci
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More Mellotron wrote:
nomoredroids wrote:
To answer your last question, it should be mentioned that in 1st Ed. MoM, if the Keeper plays his hardest (or tries at all, really), the players WILL lose. It cannot be played as a competitive game even though it is clearly designed to be, and most of the game's tension hinges upon the threat of the Keeper winning. This is a fatal design flaw, and it renders the game pointless to play as the Keeper. Nobody is missing out by not playing the Keeper.


That's not a fatal flaw, it just makes 1e essentially a stripped down Call of Cthulhu RPG experience. If you play CoC and want to kill the party, you can. Same in any RPG. If you're not looking for an RPG experience, then no, you would not care for 1e.

Unlike Descent, it's even explicit in the MoM rules that the Keeper's job is to create a good story, not compete balls out to win. Some people like that, some don't. I actually enjoy it quite a bit, but I also liked DMing in my younger days.


True, and to take your point just an inch further, CoC's trademark claim to fame was the almost certainty any particular story would end as a tragedy. That was how I was introduced to it in the late 80s -- this was a game where everybody died or went insane by the end. The role of the "Keeper" was merely to facilitate a good story leading up to that inevitability.

That said, I agree that this approach doesn't work intuitively in board game form. I somewhat agree with the poster that called this a flaw, as not everybody will hold that passing rule book commentary to heart.

I think it is poor game design to create a system, and then artificially constrain how players will interact with that system through "spirit of the game" rationales alone. If you want to constrain the Keeper from playing overly competitively, you need to hardwire that. It's foolish, as a design, to give people freedom, and then say "but don't do this.. or this.. or that." This is the problem I have with semi-cooperatives in my group -- I learned that I could only make the games play the way I envisioned them if everybody looked at the game how I did. After my second pre-game lecture before Dead of Winter, it promptly got sold away (that said, I wish Plaid Hat the best with the idea).

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Scott Cantor
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Anarchosyn wrote:

That said, I agree that this approach doesn't work intuitively in board game form. I somewhat agree with the poster that called this a flaw, as not everybody will hold that passing rule book commentary to heart.

I think it is poor game design to create a system, and then artificially constrain how players will interact with that system through "spirit of the game" rationales alone. If you want to constrain the Keeper from playing overly competitively, you need to hardwire that.


I don't think you can, really, it's just how storytelling games work. If you don't like Tales of the Arabian Nights, for example, no shame in that, but you can't turn it into a win/lose game.

I thought it was very cool of FFG to produce an Arkham Files game that was quite a bit different from the usual. I think MOM2 is a bit more of the "same old" in comparison. I bought it, and am looking at it on my kitchen table now waiting to play it, and looking forward to it, but I do think MOM1 has its place if you like that sort of thing.

Guess bottom line is I'm glad I picked up a copy before it got too expensive, though I wish I'd landed Call of the Wild too. cry
 
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ioticus
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When I read the rules for 1st edition MoM, I never got the impression that the Keeper was supposed to "hold back" in any way. I guess reading comprehension fail on my part.
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Justin Colm
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Vardaine wrote:
additional scenarios have already been announced which will be free.


Supposedly these scenarios are designed to use the 1st edition components, so they're only 'free' if you already have 1st edition. Otherwise you're forking out for a (likely) expensive box set of 1st edition stuff to play them.

Please don't give people misleading information.
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More Mellotron wrote:
Anarchosyn wrote:

That said, I agree that this approach doesn't work intuitively in board game form. I somewhat agree with the poster that called this a flaw, as not everybody will hold that passing rule book commentary to heart.

I think it is poor game design to create a system, and then artificially constrain how players will interact with that system through "spirit of the game" rationales alone. If you want to constrain the Keeper from playing overly competitively, you need to hardwire that.


I don't think you can, really, it's just how storytelling games work.


Well you can; nothing that is purely in the providence of human imagination is impossible. It's just far more expedient to replace the offending issue with a machine.

Personally, I prefer FFG's approach, and do not lament the lack of a Keeper. The system was too much of a delicate house of cards anyway (hence all the fiddly set-up complaints).

All that said, I've yet to settle into my first session with Mansions either (tonight? Perhaps), but already can see it offers something distinct from their other products still.

Nevertheless, I'd love to hear your thoughts when it does hit your table. Happy sessioning.
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Justin Colm
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ioticus wrote:
When I read the rules for 1st edition MoM, I never got the impression that the Keeper was supposed to "hold back" in any way. I guess reading comprehension fail on my part.


No, you were right. Some people chose to play it like an RPG 'DM', managing the experience but not trying to win. But that wasn't the design intention.

Usually however the Keeper only had a small window of opportunity to win the game and up to that point was simply preparing / biding his time / softening up the investigators. It wasn't totally satisfactory.

On the other hand I find it rather annoying how people are piling on 1st edition and extolling the virtues of 2nd edition, especially when they ignore or gloss over the faults 2nd edition has.

For the record, 2nd edition does not have much greater variety than 1st edition. The much-hyped variation in the scenarios supposed to be provided by the app was over-stated to say the least. The scenarios are very repetitive to play, in my opinion perhaps even more so than 1st edition, where the scenario objectives at least changed from play to play. I've played the first 3 scenarios and in each one the 1st play was explore / experience the story / learn the scenario and come close but not quite beat it. The second was 'we know what we have to do now; let's do it efficiently and win'. After that there's no further interesting playability in the scenarios.

Personally, I think both games are different enough to be considered as just that: different games, and I'm rather narked by this idea of 2nd edition 'improving' on 1st 'in nearly every way'. No. 1st edition was much more tactical, was competitive, and had more replayability. Some of the scenarios were hit and miss. But on the other hand players weren't at the mercy of a buggy app. Pros and cons.
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High Flying Bird wrote:
ioticus wrote:
When I read the rules for 1st edition MoM, I never got the impression that the Keeper was supposed to "hold back" in any way. I guess reading comprehension fail on my part.


No, you were right. Some people chose to play it like an RPG 'DM', managing the experience but not trying to win. But that wasn't the design intention.


The guy you're quoting was referring to this comment above (second paragraph): https://boardgamegeek.com/article/23433503#23433503

I never played 1st edition, but Scott seems on point enough for me to trust his word. Maybe you missed it too.
 
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High Flying Bird wrote:
ioticus wrote:
When I read the rules for 1st edition MoM, I never got the impression that the Keeper was supposed to "hold back" in any way. I guess reading comprehension fail on my part.


No, you were right. Some people chose to play it like an RPG 'DM', managing the experience but not trying to win. But that wasn't the design intention.


(EDIT)
I can't locate the text I thought I had seen, and I suspect it's because I saw what I expected to see due to the way the game was taught to me. The guy who taught it emphasized that the Keeper's role wasn't to really go after the players with monsters and just try and move the story along and look for chances to screw with the players at fun moments.

I've seen enough people talk about it that I think I just read things into it that weren't there. I can certainly agree that if you don't play it that way, I think the game would be pretty one-sided in most scenarios, and that would be a flaw.

But there aren't many games that evoke this kind of RPG feel in a boardgame package, so even if it was unintentional, that's not a fatal flaw to me.

Quote:
On the other hand I find it rather annoying how people are piling on 1st edition and extolling the virtues of 2nd edition, especially when they ignore or gloss over the faults 2nd edition has.


I just think they're very different, and the uniqueness with 1e is worth something.

Just like I think EH has its charms but AH remains by far my favorite. I like that both exist and think they're just different experiences.
 
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Scott Cantor
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Anarchosyn wrote:

I never played 1st edition, but Scott seems on point enough for me to trust his word. Maybe you missed it too.


Oh well, serves you right. whistle

It really is/was a much, much better game played that way, though. I guess some people just don't like the concept, and if you're not interested in moderating a game rather than outright playing it, that's not going to be very fun.

It's funny, I certainly enjoy playing as Keeper in MOM, but you couldn't pay me less than 3 figures to be Overlord in Descent.
 
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More Mellotron wrote:

I just think they're very different, and the uniqueness with 1e is worth something.

Just like I think EH has its charms but AH remains by far my favorite. I like that both exist and think they're just different experiences.


I completely agree. That is exactly my sentiment too. But, and I suppose it's that old 'cult of the new' syndrome, I'm seeing a lot of commentary here saying how much better this iteration is, how it fixes a flawed game etc. And a lot of it from people who have barely played it yet, and I suspect barely played 1st edition, if at all. This version has problems of it own to go along with its strengths and really doesn't feel like the original.
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Jason Nopa
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High Flying Bird wrote:
More Mellotron wrote:

I just think they're very different, and the uniqueness with 1e is worth something.

Just like I think EH has its charms but AH remains by far my favorite. I like that both exist and think they're just different experiences.


I completely agree. That is exactly my sentiment too. But, and I suppose it's that old 'cult of the new' syndrome, I'm seeing a lot of commentary here saying how much better this iteration is, how it fixes a flawed game etc. And a lot of it from people who have barely played it yet, and I suspect barely played 1st edition, if at all. This version has problems of it own to go along with its strengths and really doesn't feel like the original.


I agree, which is why I am glad I managed to get all of first edition, so I can have both.

I think 1st Edition has a lot of neat things going for it. I like that the puzzles are not tied to the app. I also kind of like the unique setup (despite it taking a while, and the chances for an inexperienced keeper to ruin everything and it screwing the whole thing up) I like the single die check for tests. I like the idea of the Keeper getting different mythos action cards per scenario, and I like the combat deck mechanism. I think the Mythos and Trauma decks are interesting. In general, the narrative feels pretty strong, and being able to see the timer for Keeper events gives the investigators a certain feeling of dread.

2nd Edition does give a fun feel, and I love how it works as a co-op experience. The damage/horror deck in the style of X-wing damage cards is ingenious and is a good implementation compared to just damage and horror tokens. I like how you do feel more like you're exploring an unknown area as you only reveal a few tiles at a time. I think the multi-dice combat system is fun for skill checks in another modified system borrowed from X-wing. The unknown stuff that the app hides is great in a different way from 1st edition. Not knowing for sure what the timer is...or what could happen during the Mythos phase... it's a fun surprise.

I think either game can be a hit with the right group. It's just that 1st Edition has a requirement that you have someone who wants to be the keeper and is less prone to making mistakes. Still, I find myself liking both versions a lot...
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Diego Matheus
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Vardaine wrote:
Get the second edition, hands down.

While the first edition is a great game (it truly is!), it takes you at least 30 minutes to setup (45 when inexperienced) and misplacing 1 single card on the board can break the game. Game play in general feels clunky. Several scenarios are greatly imbalanced and need patching to fix. A lot of the rules are complicated and redundant. Combat is innovative, but very clunky. Additionally, you need a player to be the Keeper. Usually this role befalls you, as the game owner. And while I had great fun playing the keeper in mansions 1, it is nice to be able to be an investigator in this game.

Mansions of madness 2 streamlines a lot of elements from the 1st edition. The app manages everything that took the keeper an entire evening to prepare and organise. Setup is quick and easy. Maps can now vary and you explore the mansion tile by tile while you play. Combat is quick and easy; the new dice system is better than the previous system. Scenarios are better designed overall and the game is now (in general) full coop. I say in general because it contains a possible traitor mechanic in the insanity cards which are really a cool addition is you ask me!

So, what's not to like? James basically summed up the negatives like he often does.
1. Yes, the game is expensive. Although I have heard that the prices can vary a great deal depending on where you do your shopping. A lot has been said about that already. It costs what it costs and it is up to you to decide if you can afford it.
2. Monster quality is fine. It's not excellent, it's not stellar. Some might say it is not even good. But they're not terrible and do get the job done. They are not going to improve either, so it's take it or leave it.
3. The app has some bugs which they are working out as we speak. This is to be expected with a game like this. The newest version seems to have solved the most damaging bugs and malfunctions. Give it a few more weeks and they have this completely sorted out.
4. The game comes with 4 scenarios. While this is not much, 2 additional scenarios have already been announced which will be free. The app gives them the opportunity to release new scenarios on a regular basis without the need to print and ship more cards. Additionally, because of the app, a lot of variation can be introduced in each scenario giving them a great replayability. They are not that easy either, so don't expect to win them all on your first playthrough.

This turned out to be almost a review in its own. But if you like this kind of games and are willing to pay the money, then by all means, get this game.

Again you help me. Tks mate. I'm completely sold with that.
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Alexander Steinbach
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High Flying Bird wrote:
Vardaine wrote:
additional scenarios have already been announced which will be free.


Supposedly these scenarios are designed to use the 1st edition components, so they're only 'free' if you already have 1st edition. Otherwise you're forking out for a (likely) expensive box set of 1st edition stuff to play them.

Please don't give people misleading information.


The scenarios are free whether you own the 1st edition components or not, so there is nothing misleading about my statement there.

It is my opinion that the 1st edition material is not strictly needed to play. Monsters and investigators are completely present in the conversion kit. The miniatures are just fluff. The tiles are a bit more "necessary", but you can find an appropriate 2e replacement for almost every single 1e tile there is. Especially if you are willing to put a little work in, I don't think getting the 1st edition or the announced cosmetic expansions is necessary to enjoy the 2 additional scenarios.
 
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Pat Mccrotch
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Vardaine wrote:
The scenarios are free whether you own the 1st edition components or not, so there is nothing misleading about my statement there.

It is my opinion that the 1st edition material is not strictly needed to play. Monsters and investigators are completely present in the conversion kit. The miniatures are just fluff. The tiles are a bit more "necessary", but you can find an appropriate 2e replacement for almost every single 1e tile there is. Especially if you are willing to put a little work in, I don't think getting the 1st edition or the announced cosmetic expansions is necessary to enjoy the 2 additional scenarios.


Your opinion excepted, that's not how or why they're releasing the scenarios "free" if you own 1e. They expect players to buy the new expansions to play them, which I think was his point. Noone's attempting to tell you you can't engineer some other way to play them... As Corey Koneska-what's-his-face said, they're free if you own 1e or buy the expansions.

(I get that you may not have been trying to mislead anyone by saying they were free. Not trying to pin that on you)
 
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