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Scythe» Forums » Rules

Subject: Another Automa/Encounter question rss

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Sky Zero
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Gave the Automa deck a chance multi-player and ran into a situation where the faction leader was on the factory hex and I drew the Encounter/Factory automa action. Does the faction leader move in place and stay in the factory or do you take the "or /" action?
 
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Bård Holst
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skyzero wrote:
Gave the Automa deck a chance multi-player and ran into a situation where the faction leader was on the factory hex and I drew the Encounter/Factory automa action. Does the faction leader move in place and stay in the factory or do you take the "or /" action?


The Automa Character will move to the factory and take a card only once.
Once it has a factory card it will move to an encounter hex if it's in the neighbourhood of any automa unit.
If he can't get a to an encounter and he is on the factory hex I beleive you skip that move and go for the next as he has no valid moves to take.
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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Nusferatu wrote:
skyzero wrote:
Gave the Automa deck a chance multi-player and ran into a situation where the faction leader was on the factory hex and I drew the Encounter/Factory automa action. Does the faction leader move in place and stay in the factory or do you take the "or /" action?


The Automa Character will move to the factory and take a card only once.
Once it has a factory card it will move to an encounter hex if it's in the neighbourhood of any automa unit.
If he can't get a to an encounter and he is on the factory hex I beleive you skip that move and go for the next as he has no valid moves to take.


This is exactly correct!

I find that it will often move back to the factory with a non-combat character move later, if a non-combat mech move doesn't fill it first.
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Morten Monrad Pedersen
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Nusferatu wrote:
skyzero wrote:
Gave the Automa deck a chance multi-player and ran into a situation where the faction leader was on the factory hex and I drew the Encounter/Factory automa action. Does the faction leader move in place and stay in the factory or do you take the "or /" action?


The Automa Character will move to the factory and take a card only once.
Once it has a factory card it will move to an encounter hex if it's in the neighbourhood of any automa unit.
If he can't get a to an encounter and he is on the factory hex I beleive you skip that move and go for the next as he has no valid moves to take.


That is correct.

Just to clarify, the Automa character only moves to encounter territories if there's an encounter token there.

The idea behing the encounter/factory action is that the Automa character only moves to a territory if it can remove something (encounter token or factory card) from the game.

If that's not possible you move on to the next action on the list.
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Sky Zero
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Thanks all for the clarification, we definitely played it wrong but will get it right next time!
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Redd

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mortenmdk wrote:
That is correct.

Just to clarify, the Automa character only moves to encounter territories if there's an encounter token there.

The idea behing the encounter/factory action is that the Automa character only moves to a territory if it can remove something (encounter token or factory card) from the game.

If that's not possible you move on to the next action on the list.

So if the Automa character (having not yet pulled a Factory card) is in the neighborhood of the Factory spot currently occupied by opposing combat figure(s) and draws another factory/encounter card it will abandon the factory and go for a valid encounter token closest to the Factory? I ask because I played it that it was still going to try and get to the Factory card first and stayed there (awaiting combat for the spot?) vice going after an encounter token. Now seems like I should have played that differently.
 
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Sky Zero
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ReddWolf wrote:
mortenmdk wrote:
That is correct.

Just to clarify, the Automa character only moves to encounter territories if there's an encounter token there.

The idea behing the encounter/factory action is that the Automa character only moves to a territory if it can remove something (encounter token or factory card) from the game.

If that's not possible you move on to the next action on the list.

So if the Automa character (having not yet pulled a Factory card) is in the neighborhood of the Factory spot currently occupied by opposing combat figure(s) and draws another factory/encounter card it will abandon the factory and go for a valid encounter token closest to the Factory? I ask because I played it that it was still going to try and get to the Factory card first and stayed there (awaiting combat for the spot?) vice going after an encounter token. Now seems like I should have played that differently.


I would still question whether or not the character shouldn't stay controlling the factory. It's worth 3 hexes at game end.
 
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Larry Schneider
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skyzero wrote:
ReddWolf wrote:
mortenmdk wrote:
That is correct.

Just to clarify, the Automa character only moves to encounter territories if there's an encounter token there.

The idea behing the encounter/factory action is that the Automa character only moves to a territory if it can remove something (encounter token or factory card) from the game.

If that's not possible you move on to the next action on the list.

So if the Automa character (having not yet pulled a Factory card) is in the neighborhood of the Factory spot currently occupied by opposing combat figure(s) and draws another factory/encounter card it will abandon the factory and go for a valid encounter token closest to the Factory? I ask because I played it that it was still going to try and get to the Factory card first and stayed there (awaiting combat for the spot?) vice going after an encounter token. Now seems like I should have played that differently.:what:


I would still question whether or not the character shouldn't stay controlling the factory. It's worth 3 hexes at game end.


Because it's likely the Automa will focus in on the factory with a Mech, I think.
 
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Sky Zero
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schnel wrote:
skyzero wrote:
ReddWolf wrote:
mortenmdk wrote:
That is correct.

Just to clarify, the Automa character only moves to encounter territories if there's an encounter token there.

The idea behing the encounter/factory action is that the Automa character only moves to a territory if it can remove something (encounter token or factory card) from the game.

If that's not possible you move on to the next action on the list.

So if the Automa character (having not yet pulled a Factory card) is in the neighborhood of the Factory spot currently occupied by opposing combat figure(s) and draws another factory/encounter card it will abandon the factory and go for a valid encounter token closest to the Factory? I ask because I played it that it was still going to try and get to the Factory card first and stayed there (awaiting combat for the spot?) vice going after an encounter token. Now seems like I should have played that differently.


I would still question whether or not the character shouldn't stay controlling the factory. It's worth 3 hexes at game end.


Because it's likely the Automa will focus in on the factory with a Mech, I think.


Only if the the right action randomly appears. I can't see conceding the 3 hex value for an encounter.
 
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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skyzero wrote:
schnel wrote:
skyzero wrote:
ReddWolf wrote:
mortenmdk wrote:
That is correct.

Just to clarify, the Automa character only moves to encounter territories if there's an encounter token there.

The idea behing the encounter/factory action is that the Automa character only moves to a territory if it can remove something (encounter token or factory card) from the game.

If that's not possible you move on to the next action on the list.

So if the Automa character (having not yet pulled a Factory card) is in the neighborhood of the Factory spot currently occupied by opposing combat figure(s) and draws another factory/encounter card it will abandon the factory and go for a valid encounter token closest to the Factory? I ask because I played it that it was still going to try and get to the Factory card first and stayed there (awaiting combat for the spot?) vice going after an encounter token. Now seems like I should have played that differently.


I would still question whether or not the character shouldn't stay controlling the factory. It's worth 3 hexes at game end.


Because it's likely the Automa will focus in on the factory with a Mech, I think.


Only if the the right action randomly appears. I can't see conceding the 3 hex value for an encounter.


It has been confirmed by Morten that the character will prioritize encounters it can reach over the factory once it has a factory card. This is not up for question as far as the actual rules go.
 
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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ReddWolf wrote:

So if the Automa character (having not yet pulled a Factory card) is in the neighborhood of the Factory spot currently occupied by opposing combat figure(s) and draws another factory/encounter card it will abandon the factory and go for a valid encounter token closest to the Factory? I ask because I played it that it was still going to try and get to the Factory card first and stayed there (awaiting combat for the spot?) vice going after an encounter token. Now seems like I should have played that differently.


You should indeed have played that differently. With a factory/encounter move if the character either cannot move to the factory (because it is occupied by an enemy unit, or is not in the neighbourhood of an automa unit) or it already has a factory card, it will move to an encounter space assuming there is a valid one. In your situation the only way it would stay in its current space is if there were no encounter space it could legally reach.
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Sky Zero
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reverendunclebastard wrote:
skyzero wrote:
schnel wrote:
skyzero wrote:
ReddWolf wrote:
mortenmdk wrote:
That is correct.

Just to clarify, the Automa character only moves to encounter territories if there's an encounter token there.

The idea behing the encounter/factory action is that the Automa character only moves to a territory if it can remove something (encounter token or factory card) from the game.

If that's not possible you move on to the next action on the list.

So if the Automa character (having not yet pulled a Factory card) is in the neighborhood of the Factory spot currently occupied by opposing combat figure(s) and draws another factory/encounter card it will abandon the factory and go for a valid encounter token closest to the Factory? I ask because I played it that it was still going to try and get to the Factory card first and stayed there (awaiting combat for the spot?) vice going after an encounter token. Now seems like I should have played that differently.


I would still question whether or not the character shouldn't stay controlling the factory. It's worth 3 hexes at game end.


Because it's likely the Automa will focus in on the factory with a Mech, I think.


Only if the the right action randomly appears. I can't see conceding the 3 hex value for an encounter.


It has been confirmed by Morten that the character will prioritize encounters it can reach over the factory once it has a factory card. This is not up for question as far as the actual rules go.


I understand the rule, just thinking about if I use the deck in a multiplayer game if I won't just ignore the encounter movement. Make someone fight for the factory.
 
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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skyzero wrote:

I understand the rule, just thinking about if I use the deck in a multiplayer game if I won't just ignore the encounter movement. Make someone fight for the factory.


You are, of course, free to play however you wish, but keep in mind that the Automa went through over 200 playtests so there is a solid reason for every decision it makes. Your impressions over a handful of games are unlikely to result in better choices for the Automa than the heavily tested ones that the actual rules reflect.

Edit: You should also, when participating in a thread with a rules question, make it clear that you are discussing a variant and not an interpretation of the rules in order to avoid confusing the issue for those who are looking for the answer to how the rules as written are to be played.

Cheers!
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Sky Zero
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reverendunclebastard wrote:
skyzero wrote:

I understand the rule, just thinking about if I use the deck in a multiplayer game if I won't just ignore the encounter movement. Make someone fight for the factory.


You are, of course, free to play however you wish, but keep in mind that the Automa went through over 200 playtests so there is a solid reason for every decision it makes. Your impressions over a handful of games are unlikely to result in better choices for the Automa than the heavily tested ones that the actual rules reflect.

Edit: You should also, when participating in a thread with a rules question, make it clear that you are discussing a variant and not an interpretation of the rules in order to avoid confusing the issue for those who are looking for the answer to how the rules as written are to be played.

Cheers!


Fair points, but the decision not to move away from a 3 score hex makes more sense if the objective is to win. Will give it a shot next weekend multiplayer and see if there's any material impact to gameplay. If anything combat should get a slight uptick.

EDIT: I'm having a discussion, it's a forum.
 
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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skyzero wrote:

the decision not to move away from a 3 score hex makes more sense if the objective is to win.


I would disagree with this. The automa is designed to win, and it does a good job of it. Wasting the Automa's character holding the factory while players take the remaining encounter tokens is not nearly as effective for the Automa as using its character to sweep up encounters (denying them to the players), which it can reach much faster than players, while taking the chance that a mech will fight its way into the factory later. The rules for Automa movement virtually guarantee that an Automa mech will make a late game attempt to fight for the factory, in fact it will often make several until it is successful. This fight will not only give it the factory if it wins, but also a combat star.

I understand why people house-rule things in games, especially loosely designed sandbox games (Firefly, Zombicide, etc.), but I wonder why people are so quick to house-rule a game as heavily play-tested and balanced as Scythe is. I don't mean to be insulting, but it seems kind of arrogant to think that a handful of plays leaves anyone with better ideas and knowledge of the game than the designers have after hundreds of play-tests. That being said, one of the true joys of board games over video games is that we all have the ability to tinker with them at will, so if that brings you joy... go for it!

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Sky Zero
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reverendunclebastard wrote:
skyzero wrote:

the decision not to move away from a 3 score hex makes more sense if the objective is to win.


I would disagree with this. The automa is designed to win, and it does a good job of it. Wasting the Automa's character holding the factory while players take the remaining encounter tokens is not nearly as effective for the Automa as using its character to sweep up encounters (denying them to the players), which it can reach much faster than players, while taking the chance that a mech will fight its way into the factory later. The rules for Automa movement virtually guarantee that an Automa mech will make a late game attempt to fight for the factory, in fact it will often make several until it is successful. This fight will not only give it the factory if it wins, but also a combat star.

I understand why people house-rule things in games, especially loosely designed sandbox games (Firefly, Zombicide, etc.), but I wonder why people are so quick to house-rule a game as heavily play-tested and balanced as Scythe is. I don't mean to be insulting, but it seems kind of arrogant to think that a handful of plays leaves anyone with better ideas and knowledge of the game than the designers have after hundreds of play-tests. That being said, one of the true joys of board games over video games is that we all have the ability to tinker with them at will, so if that brings you joy... go for it!



Even if there were 1000's of playtests, something can always be made better. It is why Scythe exists. We shall agree to disagree
 
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