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Giga-Robo!» Forums » Rules

Subject: Craters (3 questions) rss

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Nate Parkes
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Quote:
If you are on top of a Structure and you wish to move across the board to the top of another Structure at the same Tier, you do not need to pay additional elevation level movement costs, as you have not changed elevation levels.


Quote:
CRATER
2 movement to enter/exit.
-1 Elevation.


Question 1

Can you "jump" over craters?

Let's sat I wanted to move to an open space 2 hexes away, but directly between my robot and that space was a crater. Which one of these is accurate?

A) I "jump" over the crater, the same way I would "jump" from one tier 1 structure to another over the gap in-between? [2 movement points]

B) I "trudge" through the crater, spending 2 movement to enter and 2 movement to exit.

Question 2

I'm standing in a crater, adjacent to another crater. How much does it cost me to move from crater 1 to crater 2?

A) 4 points (2 movement to enter/exit x 2)
B) 3 points (1 movement, +1 to exit, +1 to enter)
C) 2 points (the first crater says "2 points to exit," so that's all it costs)
D) 1 point (they're the same elevation, so just 1 point)

Question 3

I'm standing in a crater, adjacent to a Tier 2 building. It would normally cost 3 points to move from an empty hex to an adjacent Tier 2 structure. But since I'm in the crater at -1 elevation, it costs...

A) 6 points (4 points to move from elevation -1 to elevation 2, +2 points to enter/exit)
B) 5 points (4 points to move from elevation -1 to elevation 2, +1 additional to enter/exit)
C) 4 points (4 points to move from elevation -1 to elevation 2)
D) 2 points (it says "2 points to exit" on the crater, so that's all it costs)

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Oblivion Doll
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Question 1, following rules as written, I'd go with A. Unless you start off in the crater, or decide on your own to enter it for some reason, you should be able to jump over.

Question 2, actually not entirely clear. I'd probably argue for the 3 movement points, 1 for the movement itself, +1 for exiting a crater, and +1 for entering another crater.

Question 3, I'd probably go with 4 points here, personally. With the logic of 1 movement for 1 hex +1 point to exit, +2 to climb onto a tier 2 structure.
 
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Steven Hammerschlag
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Eldil wrote:
Quote:
If you are on top of a Structure and you wish to move across the board to the top of another Structure at the same Tier, you do not need to pay additional elevation level movement costs, as you have not changed elevation levels.


Quote:
CRATER
2 movement to enter/exit.
-1 Elevation.
This language on terrain and elemental impact tiles in regards to additional movement costs will get altered slightly. Intent for crater is +1 movement to enter/exit, signifying the negative change in elevation.

Question 1

Can you "jump" over craters?

Let's sat I wanted to move to an open space 2 hexes away, but directly between my robot and that space was a crater. Which one of these is accurate?

A) I "jump" over the crater, the same way I would "jump" from one tier 1 structure to another over the gap in-between? [2 movement points] If the path is clear to do so then yes as you aren't increasing elevation from your starting position, and your ending position is the same elevation as your starting position.

B) I "trudge" through the crater, spending 2 movement to enter and 2 movement to exit. You can still decide to move down into the crater (if there's an elemental impact tile you want to gain the effects from, for instance) and out again.

Question 2

I'm standing in a crater, adjacent to another crater. How much does it cost me to move from crater 1 to crater 2?

A) 4 points (2 movement to enter/exit x 2)
B) 3 points (1 movement, +1 to exit, +1 to enter) You're at the same elevation over both hexes, so it's one movement and then the +1 movement for leaving, +1 movement for entering. If you enter or exit a crater you have to fulfill the move cost.
C) 2 points (the first crater says "2 points to exit," so that's all it costs)
D) 1 point (they're the same elevation, so just 1 point)

Question 3

I'm standing in a crater, adjacent to a Tier 2 building. It would normally cost 3 points to move from an empty hex to an adjacent Tier 2 structure. But since I'm in the crater at -1 elevation, it costs...

A) 6 points (4 points to move from elevation -1 to elevation 2, +2 points to enter/exit)
B) 5 points (4 points to move from elevation -1 to elevation 2, +1 additional to enter/exit)
C) 4 points (4 points to move from elevation -1 to elevation 2)In this case what is normally a 3 movement cost move only has the +1 movement cost for a total of 4.
D) 2 points (it says "2 points to exit" on the crater, so that's all it costs)

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Nate Parkes
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schlagamuffin wrote:
This language on terrain and elemental impact tiles in regards to additional movement costs will get altered slightly. Intent for crater is +1 movement to enter/exit, signifying the negative change in elevation.


If the +1 movement is to signify the negative change in elevation, it doesn't seem like it would apply when entering the crater from an open hex (per page 4: "Moving to lower elevation levels does not cost extra movement).

I had assumed there was a "rubble penalty" effect, and the movement penalty was in addition to any elevation penalties.

If there's no "rubble penalty", I think the crater should simply read "-1 elevation." (which would mean the crater would cost 1 move to enter from an open hex, and 2 move to exit to an open hex). Attempting to add or calculate the elevation movement penalty on the tile text itself has a lot of potential for confusion, since the actual penalty depends on the elevation of the adjacent tile.

If there is a "rubble penalty," I think the crater should read "+1 move to enter/exit, -1 elevation." (which would mean it costs 2 move to enter from an open hex and 3 move to exit onto an open hex).
 
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Steven Hammerschlag
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Yeah the "+1 movement" will be reflected in revised wording (as opposed to stating the total move cost in to, or out of)- we may also explicitly state in the manual that terrain and elemental impact tile movement costs (if any, rubble, crater, and water right now) override general movement costs if entering or exiting the hex (as you pointed out you can jump over a Crater) just so there's no further confusion.
 
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mathew rynich
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Just to make sure I understand, so the intent is +1 movement if you end your move in the crater or begin your move in a crater. Is that correct? That is true for all Impact Tiles?

So if I'm on the ground, I want to move to a ground hex 4 hexes away and there is a tier 1 structure in the middle it would cost 5 movement. If it was a crater instead of a tier 1 structure it would cost 4 movement.

I had assumed that those movement penalties applied whenever going through that tile during movement. I think it was the enter/exit terminology that sort of implied that. Begin/End your movement in the tile is probably clearer.

Quote:
If you are on top of a Structure and you wish to move across the board to the top of another Structure at the same Tier, you do not need to pay additional elevation level movement costs, as you have not changed elevation levels.


I had assumed this doesn't apply to impact tiles because in the beginning of the statement it states that you are on top of a structure (I assume it means begin your movement on top of a structure rather than at any point in the movement). Though if I parse this sentence literally it seems to imply that if I start my movement on a tier 1 structure, I end on a tier 1 structure, and there is a tier 2 structure in the middle I don't need to pay the +1 movement for increasing my elevation to account for the tier 2 structure. Is that the intent?
 
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Steven Hammerschlag
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The intent is +1 movement when entering or exiting the Crater hex. Moving into or out of a hex normally costs 1 movement - the Crater will add +1 movement to this cost. Your example re: 4 hexes away etc. is correct because you are leaping from one elevation to another elevation instead of hoping down into the crater and then climbing back out again (or while running somewhere, climbing up a T1 structure and then jumping back down again). But again, you have the choice in this situation to leap over the Crater or to go down into the Crater and climb back out (or stay).

Impact tiles are all laid out in the manual - some have movement modifications and others do not.

Illustrations are going to help clarify these movement rules as they're super simple once you see the examples, especially if you're a visual learned like myself - I apologize I'm not able to better/more concisely sum up this movement quirk.
 
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Alex Cheng
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We actually removed the printed extra movement cost off of the Crater so it's just "-1 Elevation", but we were considering retaining the text in a different format, so there was a miscommunication between Steven and I.

The extra costs were originally added because at conventions first time players would often forget to include the elevation change in their movement.

So the answers are:

Question 1
A

Question 2
D

Question 3
C
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Nate Parkes
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jetjagaa wrote:
We actually removed the printed extra movement cost off of the Crater so it's just "-1 Elevation", but we were considering retaining the text in a different format, so there was a miscommunication between Steven and I.

The extra costs were originally added because at conventions first time players would often forget to include the elevation change in their movement.

So the answers are:

Question 1
A

Question 2
D

Question 3
C


Fantastic! I was hoping crater would remain just as simple and clear as that. It's intuitive (once you grok the elevation movement rules, which are also intuitive).
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Ethan Krindle
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If Craters follow normal elevations rules, why would they incur a +1 movement penalty when entering them, as stated above by Steven? Wouldn't that be like "dropping down" off a building? Or was that the "miscommunication" you referred to?

Personally, I'm for just leaving the text as "-1 elevation", but if you want to add the additional text back in, please make it clear that it's reminder text (such as by putting it in brackets or adding the word "reminder"), and not a separate terrain effect.
 
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Alex Cheng
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That was the miscommunication I was referring to.
 
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mathew rynich
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Glad to see you guys are on top of it.

Quote:
If you are on top of a Structure and you wish to move across the board to the top of another Structure at the same Tier, you do not need to pay additional elevation level movement costs, as you have not changed elevation levels.


So really the movement rules just need to make a more generic statement about being able to jump over intervening equal/lower elevation hexes if there is an equal elevation hex on the other side. The text as is currently for me was adding confusion because it all seemed to be structure specific and made me question what applied to impact tiles. Then crater could just say -1 elevation and it would be much cleaner.

I do enjoy this element of the game. I don't think I've seen the concept of jumping over holes done this way in this sort of mini combat game. To be honest it makes me want to create maps with as many interesting terrain features as possible so traversing the map becomes an interesting challenge if you are not boosting.

For my own clarity can this "jump" move also be used to jump over flood, inferno... impact tiles? I assume so because when you say enter/exit you seem to imply this is not just plotting movement through the hex. You need to pause on the hex because you are ending your movement or need to move to a higher elevation etc.
 
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Alex Cheng
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The Craters only say "-1 Elevation" now.

We're adding the full diagrams and expanded clarifications to the rulebook. There are going to be diagrams and examples for essentially everything.

You can jump over Impact Tiles. Movement, like targeting, is meant to be very open and free. Entering an Impact Tile moreso refers to you choosing to enter that hex, being forcefully moved onto that hex, or the Impact Tile being created underneath you.

 
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Nate Parkes
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phillosmaster wrote:
For my own clarity can this "jump" move also be used to jump over flood, inferno... impact tiles? I assume so because when you say enter/exit you seem to imply this is not just plotting movement through the hex. You need to pause on the hex because you are ending your movement or need to move to a higher elevation etc.


I'm pretty certain that you can't jump over other terrain tiles unless you start at elevation 1 or 2.

Thematically, a "jump" seems to be like a lateral booster thrust. So it will carry you along the same altitude.

But infernos, arcs, and even floods are occurring at 0-elevation. So if you booster thrust from a 0-elevation open hex into an inferno or an electrical arc, and a deluge of broken water lines, you'd still take the effect.

Alex, is that correct?
 
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mathew rynich
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Thanks Alex. The intent is clear to me now.

@Nate yeah that's what I had originally thought and I think a strict reading of the demo rules implies that, but from the responses in the thread I started to see it was as Alex described above. Specifically what Enter/Exit means on the impact tiles.
 
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