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Wargames» Forums » Historical Context

Subject: Range of a 152mm gun? (Longues sur Mer battery) rss

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M@tthijs
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Just returned from my vacation which started with 2 nights in a hotel in Caen. We used the better part of the day to visit a number of D-Day locations: Point du Hoc, Omaha Beach, the Am. War Cemetery and the Longues sur Mer battery. I like that last one, because the rusty guns are still in place.

I read the battery consisted of four Kriegmarine 152 mm guns. But I must admit, standing there next to the guns, looking over the ocean, I had no idea about what their range was.

So what was their range, in miles or km?
And also, how does that translate to the ocean view? Would the shells land behind the horizon on a clear day? Halfway?
I really have no idea how to imagine this; any help welcome!
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Jim McNaughton
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Is this useful? http://www.war44.com/misc/images/1/Longues_Map.jpg
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"Beyond the horizon" is dependent upon the height of the target, and the height of the gun. At water's edge (standing with your feet in the surf) a 30 foot tall ship might be 6 or 7 miles away before falling out of sight, depending on weather conditions. It's possible to see much farther if refraction is occuring, but that's a good spitball estimate. Given the weather on D-Day I doubt curvature was the limitation to sighting.

S.
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Jur dj
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There were some gun shots exchanged between batteries around Dover and Calais during the war, which suggests a range of over 33km.
 
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M@tthijs
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Thanks!

So assuming it is an accurate drawing above, the guns would have a reach of something like 16-18km.

Standing on the beach, looking at that 10 meter high ship, you would still see it at about 10km (6.5 miles), meaning from that point of view the shells would be able to land well beyond your horizon.

Standing next to one of the bunkers would be a different thing, as the battery is quite some meters above sea level. The picture below (not mine) looking at the mulberry harbor is taken near the battery and gives an indication of how high above sea level the guns are placed.

Googling somewhat further I found the horizon is some 35 km away when standing on a 100m tower, and 64 km when standing on a 322 m high object (the highest "mountain" in the Netherlands ) So standing next to the bunkers your view is probably some 30-50 km.

Thanks guys, this put things for me somwhat more in perspective!

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M@tthijs
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jurdj wrote:
There were some gun shots exchanged between batteries around Dover and Calais during the war, which suggests a range of over 33km.
Any idea what kind of guns there were?
 
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Michael McCalpin
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_Kael_ wrote:
jurdj wrote:
There were some gun shots exchanged between batteries around Dover and Calais during the war, which suggests a range of over 33km.
Any idea what kind of guns there were?

Quite a variety: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross-Channel_guns_in_the_Seco...
 
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M@tthijs
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mmccalpin wrote:
_Kael_ wrote:
jurdj wrote:
There were some gun shots exchanged between batteries around Dover and Calais during the war, which suggests a range of over 33km.
Any idea what kind of guns there were?

Quite a variety: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross-Channel_guns_in_the_Seco...
So the ones firing at the English coast were 380mm, with a range of 55,7 km

Interesting, but not what I asked for! laugh
 
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_Kael_ wrote:

So what was their range, in miles or km?


About 24,000 yards / 14 miles.
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hammurabi70 wrote:
_Kael_ wrote:

So what was their range, in miles or km?


About 24,000 yards / 14 miles.
Ah?!

Bases on this drawing...
Maccyn wrote:
...I came to 16-18 km (10-11¼ mile).

What is your source?

Thanks!
 
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Eddy Sterckx
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_Kael_ wrote:

Standing next to one of the bunkers would be a different thing, as the battery is quite some meters above sea level. The picture below (not mine) looking at the mulberry harbor is taken near the battery and gives an indication of how high above sea level the guns are placed.


As I said in the other thread fire direction for those guns was done from the observation bunker, several hundred yards in front of the guns, situated on the cliff edge, buried and with observation slits at ground level. Sideways visibility from it is much poorer than from out in the open on the hill where the guns are.

The battery that actually hit Omaha beach wasn't on any Allied intel maps - a serious blunder - and wasn't discovered until a couple of years ago - Google "Maisy Battery" for a virtually unknown participant in the D-Day battle.
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Carl Fung
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OK, my notes from Day of Days: The Invasion of Normandy 1944 say the battery at Longues sur Mer was the 4th Battery of the 1260 HKAA (Army Coastal Artillery Battalion).

The guns were 4 x 150mm TbtsK C/36, not 152mm. Per wikipedia, it had a range of 21,950 metres (24,000 yd) at 30°.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/15_cm_TbtsK_C/36_naval_gun

http://www.atlantikwall.org.uk/longues_sur_mer.htm

http://www.dday-overlord.com/eng/wn_48.htm
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