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In the Name of Odin» Forums » General

Subject: Our only "house rule"... rss

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John Van Wagoner
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Bluffton
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(thought i'd pass it along)...we're really enjoying the game; nice to have something other than TTR and Catan to play with non-gamers...

but, keeping with the "viking spirit" we house rule that should a viking player decide to play a card during the "raid modification" phase they do not get to then draw (replenish their hand)..."just the cost of doing business" (messing with another Jarl's raid)...your thoughts?
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Luke Turner
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I personally think that this rule is game breaking. It pretty much nullifies the only real balance for the end game condition and turn order too (see this thread: No Compensation Based On Turn Order?).
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John Van Wagoner
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sakoguru wrote:
I personally think that this rule is game breaking. It pretty much nullifies the only real balance for the end game condition and turn order too (see this thread: No Compensation Based On Turn Order?).
sorry, but I really don't see what that post has to do with this one?

And this rule is far from game breaking, house rule or not...
 
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Luke Turner
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To quote myself from that thread I linked:
sakoguru wrote:

I think it's balanced though (sorry for not thinking of this rule earlier as a counter) as when a player raids the other players get a chance to play a card to 'modify the raid requirements' (see: Page 9 part D of Raiding). What this does is allows players later in turn order to trash useless cards leading up to their turn, so by the time 3rd and 4th players get to go their hand of cards has been somewhat curated and they get a shot at a stronger turn (unlike 1st and probably 2nd player who are just stuck with their hands and the swap cards).


So by removing the later player's ability to purge useless cards for a change at new cards, they will not get a slightly stronger turn to help balance turn order (with this house rule they will potentially have a much weaker turn).

Thematically I like your house rule and it makes sense, but the game mechanisms rely on strong hand management and the house rule can severely hamper that.
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John Van Wagoner
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The "later player" can always decide not to play a card; they don't have to try and reduce another player's FPs...
 
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Luke Turner
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My whole point is that the later players can use the mechanism of "modify the raid requirements" to get a better hand for when their turn comes around. By just not participating at all that just leaves them with the same junk they didn't/couldn't use anyway in their hand.
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foksieloy
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Being able to recycle cards is one of the main mechanisms in game. You really shouldn't be removing it.
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John Van Wagoner
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sakoguru wrote:
My whole point is that the later players can use the mechanism of "modify the raid requirements" to get a better hand for when their turn comes around. By just not participating at all that just leaves them with the same junk they didn't/couldn't use anyway in their hand.
seems to me the point of playing a card here is to reduce another player's FP potential; you watch what cards they've been expending to recruit the necessary vikings (for example), and if you see 3 of those cards had the same "action/bottom" symbol you might want to play a card with that same action/bottom symbol (hoping they will not be able to match it, and thus maybe lose a point or so)...

i suppose it's possible, but i really don't think the intent of the raid modification was just to help other players recycle cards...and for us, we'll keep playing "our way" since we enjoy it...
 
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Chris Mikols
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Yes, exactly. This mechanism works both as a "take that" element to the game (you can try to deduce what card will hurt a player the most, instead of letting the random draw decide), but mostly it's there to allow you to get a replacement card in preparation for your turn. Which is why, for the most part, it makes sense to get rid of a card that you know you're not going to do anything with - especially if you're the next player in line.

Once everybody takes a card from the offer, it's refilled again, so it's almost like two replacements of the offer for free, which allows you to get some new cards on the board if it's been stuck for a while.


The above is a quote directly from the designer in a thread call 'take that: playing action cards against raiders' sorry I don't know how to directly quote or create links for you to follow
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John Van Wagoner
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chris0zz wrote:
Yes, exactly. This mechanism works both as a "take that" element to the game (you can try to deduce what card will hurt a player the most, instead of letting the random draw decide), but mostly it's there to allow you to get a replacement card in preparation for your turn. Which is why, for the most part, it makes sense to get rid of a card that you know you're not going to do anything with - especially if you're the next player in line.

Once everybody takes a card from the offer, it's refilled again, so it's almost like two replacements of the offer for free, which allows you to get some new cards on the board if it's been stuck for a while.


The above is a quote directly from the designer in a thread call 'take that: playing action cards against raiders' sorry I don't know how to directly quote or create links for you to follow
fair enough, it's their game...but, actually now it's my game (smile)...and we'll stick with the "penalty of 1 card lost" if you choose to mess with another Jarl's raid...(easy enough to get new cards; probably the easiest in any game i own)
 
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Mr Mason
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John_VW wrote:

i suppose it's possible, but i really don't think the intent of the raid modification was just to help other players recycle cards...and for us, we'll keep playing "our way" since we enjoy it...


It's your game, but I don't recommend this house rule to anyone else. Can you explain why you made it?

As you see in the rules, the raid leader will have to match 3 cards either way (unless you're also ignoring this rule). Having to match throwaway symbols (usually leader symbols for us) can be easier than random symbols from the deck.

Besides, the only way to recycle cards is through this raid mechanic. Seems reasonable the designer wanted some way to recycle cards.
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Jarad Bond
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contiguity wrote:
John_VW wrote:

i suppose it's possible, but i really don't think the intent of the raid modification was just to help other players recycle cards...and for us, we'll keep playing "our way" since we enjoy it...


It's your game, but I don't recommend this house rule to anyone else. Can you explain why you made it?

As you see in the rules, the raid leader will have to match 3 cards either way (unless you're also ignoring this rule). Having to match throwaway symbols (usually leader symbols for us) can be easier than random symbols from the deck.

Besides, the only way to recycle cards is through this raid mechanic. Seems reasonable the designer wanted some way to recycle cards.

I agree with you about not recommending the house rule for the reasons posted above (mainly that it allows later players to have a chance for better hands earlier).

However, the raid mechanic isn't the only way to recycle cards. You can also always recycle one card per turn, or two cards per turn if you have the right building.
 
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Thomas
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We play it, you play one.. then you get to draw one. Just like swapping from the card row.
 
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