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BoardGameGeek» Forums » Everything Else » Religion, Sex, and Politics

Subject: Castro's Place in History rss

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Andre
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/yoani-sanchez/fidel-castro-bir...

The Cuban people have grown weary of the Cult of Leadership, and the Revolution. The country is destined for democratization, and Castro will be written off to history, by his own people, as being a long, and tortuous diversion, to what they truly want. Proof positive that the Cult of Leadership is only effective, for the duration the Leader is in power.

With his brother in power, the transition may still linger longer than most Cubans might want, but it's only a matter of time before they turn to the U.S.A., with a hand of friendship, both economic and political.
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G Rowls
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"with his brother in power, the transition may still linger longer than most Cubans might want, but it's only a matter of time before they turn to the U.S.A., with a hand of friendship, both economic and political"

to the very nation that forced it to communism in the first place. Just to protect the mafias profits in its casinos and the corporations profits in fruit estates. Prior to you giving him no choice Castro was a nationalist who wanted to end corruption.

Why didnt you hold out the hand of friendship then?
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Mike Stiles
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growlley wrote:
"with his brother in power, the transition may still linger longer than most Cubans might want, but it's only a matter of time before they turn to the U.S.A., with a hand of friendship, both economic and political"

to the very nation that forced it to communism in the first place. Just to protect the mafias profits in its casinos and the corporations profits in fruit estates. Prior to you giving him no choice Castro was a nationalist who wanted to end corruption.

Why didnt you hold out the hand of friendship then?


Why'd you ask the US to overthrow the lawfully elected leader of Iran?

we can totally play this game.
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G Rowls
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Your the nation that claims to be the 'World police" bringing freedom and democracy and apple pie - we are just unreconstructed imperialists.



why did you continue to support the use of death squads in your 'backyard' South America Just call it what it is naked greed for money.
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Mike Stiles
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growlley wrote:
Your the nation that claims to be the 'World police" bringing freedom and democracy and apple pie - we are just unreconstructed imperialists.



why did you continue to support the use of death squads in your 'backyard' South America Just call it what it is naked greed for money.


You're a weird egg, I'll grant you.

I'd understand this rant from a Cuban or a Central/South american, but you're borrowing hate, and watch those shards from your house.
 
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Jorge Montero
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I'll take Manhattan in a garbage bag. With Latin written on it that says "It's hard to give a shit these days"
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This is a case where everyone is dirty. The situation in Cuba, pre-castro, was pretty dire for all but the upper class. The problem is that all that Castro accomplished as to get large amounts of foreign aid from Russia, and really had no plan whatsoever without said foreign aid. As the USSR declined, so did Cuba, all while the upper class, then politically connected people, kept their standard of living, going back to square one.

Even Raul Castro's Cuba is already pretty ready to open up the economy: The Obama visit as no accident, and if Hillary wins, I am told this will keep going. It's going far slower than Cubans wish it did, but I'd be surprised if Cuba wasn't, basically a regular capitalist economy in 20 years.
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"You're a weird egg, I'll grant you." - Why because I freely acknowledge we built an empire for the sake of money and in large parts of the world we did evil things to get it.

Or is it because I dont buy into your american self delusional hype that your are the good guys bringing 'freedom and democracy'?

Never mind just wave that flag one more time and chant USA etc.
 
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David Dearlove
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hibikir wrote:
This is a case where everyone is dirty. The situation in Cuba, pre-castro, was pretty dire for all but the upper class. The problem is that all that Castro accomplished as to get large amounts of foreign aid from Russia, and really had no plan whatsoever without said foreign aid. As the USSR declined, so did Cuba, all while the upper class, then politically connected people, kept their standard of living, going back to square one.

Even Raul Castro's Cuba is already pretty ready to open up the economy: The Obama visit as no accident, and if Hillary wins, I am told this will keep going. It's going far slower than Cubans wish it did, but I'd be surprised if Cuba wasn't, basically a regular capitalist economy in 20 years.

What's a regular capitalist country? The USA's model with worse medicine for the poorest than Cuba? Denmark, France? Japan? S. Korea? All very different.
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Andre
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growlley wrote:
"You're a weird egg, I'll grant you." - Why because I freely acknowledge we built an empire for the sake of money and in large parts of the world we did evil things to get it.

Or is it because I dont buy into your american self delusional hype that your are the good guys bringing 'freedom and democracy'?

Never mind just wave that flag one more time and chant USA etc.


Not sure what world you live in, but building an empire for the sake of money is what got this country to #1 on the globe,, and is nothing new. And don't look down upon it necessarily, the pursuit of wealth can lift a society as a whole. Castro's case is one of egalitarianism, that just did not work. I find it most educational, that those that don't have a capitalistic society, are usually the ones that crave it most. Don't knock it, it's a good system, and one that made this country a world power on the global stage.
 
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Boaty McBoatface
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abadolato01 wrote:
growlley wrote:
"You're a weird egg, I'll grant you." - Why because I freely acknowledge we built an empire for the sake of money and in large parts of the world we did evil things to get it.

Or is it because I dont buy into your american self delusional hype that your are the good guys bringing 'freedom and democracy'?

Never mind just wave that flag one more time and chant USA etc.


Not sure what world you live in, but building an empire for the sake of money is what got this country to #1 on the globe,, and is nothing new. And don't look down upon it necessarily, the pursuit of wealth can lift a society as a whole. Castro's case is one of egalitarianism, that just did not work. I find it most educational, that those that don't have a capitalistic society, are usually the ones that crave it most. Don't knock it, it's a good system, and one that made this country a world power on the global stage.
And those who have it often crave something else (that is why revolutions occur).

As to Castro's place in history. Look at Stalin, reviled immediately after his death, now looked upon with nostalgia by many Russians.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/exclusive-why-does-russ...

But of course history is written by those...who have education and the ability to get published.
 
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Chris R.
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Quote:
The country is destined for democratization...


There is no magic destiny for good things to happen, especially in a country that has seem so much evil. Was the People's Republic of China destined for democratization many years ago?

Freedom in the future is created by those willing to risk their lives today to promote freedom for tomorrow.

One year after Cuba re-opened its embassy Cuba's human rights situation is much worse, July 19, 2016

"This is not a conclusion based on random anecdotes from the island, but the result of a well-documented report just released by the Havana-based Cuban Human Rights and Reconciliation Commission, the island's oldest and most respected non-government, human-rights monitoring group.

According to the commission, short-term political detentions have gone way up so far this year, from a monthly average of 718 last year to a monthly average of 1,095 during the first six months this year. The number of political detentions skyrocketed during the months before and after President Obama’s visit to the island in March, the monthly figures show."

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/and...

http://www.incubatoday.com/news/article90586582.html

Political Detentions in Cuba

6,573 in the first six months of 2016
8,616 in 2015
6,424 in 2013
2,074 in 2010

Some of the deaths attributed to the Cuban State as recently as 2014 include...

http://cubaarchive.org/files/2014_Report_Selected_Case_Profi...

"beaten by prison guards for three days, handcuffed to his cell bars, and lit on fire; he died screaming. Prison authorities told the family he had committed suicide."

"...forcefully injected with a toxic mixture while imprisoned; he had been in prison for trying to prevent a man from sexually assaulting his wife."

"suicide by hanging in prison, but his body was full of bruises and sutures. The tips of his toes and heels were missing from his body."

"suffered from constant headaches, chest pains, cramps, and loss of vision after a brutal beating by prison guards. His medical care was ignored, and he died."
 
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Mike Stiles
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growlley wrote:
"You're a weird egg, I'll grant you." - Why because I freely acknowledge we built an empire for the sake of money and in large parts of the world we did evil things to get it.

Or is it because I dont buy into your american self delusional hype that your are the good guys bringing 'freedom and democracy'?

Never mind just wave that flag one more time and chant USA etc.


I'm not denying the US has a pretty poor history in the US. It's just bizarre to me that you, coming from what we know of your background, have so much bile on the subject.

The issue is borrowing anger.
 
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G Rowls
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It's just a personal quirk Everybodies got their own personal bugbear - mine just happens to be hypocrisy, No one every builds an empire without a mountain of rcorpses its not the morality that bothers me just the 'holier' than every one else attitude.
 
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