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Smash Up» Forums » General

Subject: How is it with only 2p? rss

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Igor Persin
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My gf is thinking about getting it, but it will be played almost exclusivly with 2p. On rare occasions we have someone to play it with more, and then we have other games for those occasions.
So, do you think it would be worth it only with 2p? Or do you maybe have some other recommendation? Btw. what is usual game lenght with 2p?
 
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Alexander K
United States
Seattle
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FWIW I don't think I would like this with more than 2 personally. I like the back and forth nature with 2, and I think it would feel too chaotic for me personally with more.

That's just me, though.

It's been a while since we played, but I think my wife and I got through games in 30-45 minutes.
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Mark Turner
United Kingdom
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I've played this 2-player on and off with my son for ages. We've always enjoyed it plenty.

I personally see this as a 2 or 3 player game. 4 player has too much downtime and not enough control.
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Scott Mohnkern
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Germantown
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MrMT wrote:
I've played this 2-player on and off with my son for ages. We've always enjoyed it plenty.

I personally see this as a 2 or 3 player game. 4 player has too much downtime and not enough control.


Interesting, because I always saw it play much better at 3-4 and not so we;ll at two. With two players its basically a slugfest between two, and with 3-4 there's greater variety in play.
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Matteo Kintarouji
Italy
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I play often with my girlfriend, it's faster and immediate.
I recommend it with 2P too and I've tried it in 3, 4 and 5 (variant HR with 5 bases).
 
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Reed Dawley
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Delmar
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I prefer it with three, plays fine with two though. It feels less chaotic with two than I want it to.
 
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Andre Oliveira
Brazil
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I like it with 2. But it's a pure conflict game like that.
It's probably best with 3.
With 4p free for all, it's too much downtime. I would recommend a variant like 2x2 on those cases.

All that being said it's fun with 2 but faction power must be carefully balanced.
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sacha cauvin
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My wife and i play a lot of 2 player games.
My favourite is with 3
 
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Wim D
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I play it mostly 2 player, occasionally with 3 or 4.
It is a great game with 2 players, but the faction strengths and weaknesses can be different, as well as the strategic and tactical choices you (have to) make, compared to how it plays in 3 or 4 player settings.

For example in the base set:
in 2 player, I rate Aliens and Ninjas as top factions, while in 3-4 player, I rate zombies and robots as the most powerful and Aliens and Ninjas become weaker than average factions.
 
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Moose Detective
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I've played a LOT of 2 player games with the gf.
I've played a handful of 3-4 player games with other people.

I think I actually prefer it at 2 player.
At 2 player - its a strategic game where you have to carefully plan your moves in advance because you can't set up your opponent for the base win. Plus its way easier to keep track of all the cards/effects on the board.

At 4 player - its super chaotic. Partly because you can't keep track of all the cards/effects being player to all the bases. Partly because now 3 players will be going before you do and every base can possibly be broken without your participation. It also means that any AP is magnified and if players are new, or slow readers it can take quite a while between turns.

3 player feels closer to 4 player than to 2 player.

I think for multi-player I'd much rather play something like Libertalia where everyone plays a card simultaneously and it keeps the downtime down.

As for game length - it totally depends on factions and familiarity with the factions. Your first games will be LONG even with 2p because you will both have an entire hand of cards to read and process.

This is the game that a lot of people complain about because they expect it to be "light and quick" and its not.

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Mike Czerniewski
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Overland Park
Kansas
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2-player Smash Up is fine, but it is way more cutthroat than with 3 or 4 players. If you have expansions: 5 players is okay but not recommended. NEVER try to play this game with 6 or more players.
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Andrew Kapish
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Brunswick
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Smash Up is best with 3 players or 2v2 teams.
Smash Up is pretty, sorta, just meh with 2.
Smash Up is worst with 4 player free-for-all.

There's so many great 2 player games designed to be played as such.
I can't help but wish I was playing one of those instead.
 
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Daniel Reid
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I've played it 2p, and it seems less strategic, but more immediate. I do think it suffers a bit with less than 3.
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Dan Smith
Canada
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smurfORnot wrote:
My gf is thinking about getting it, but it will be played almost exclusivly with 2p. On rare occasions we have someone to play it with more, and then we have other games for those occasions.
So, do you think it would be worth it only with 2p? Or do you maybe have some other recommendation? Btw. what is usual game lenght with 2p?


It'S perfectly fine at 2.

Some factions are better in 1vs1 (Tricksters) some are worse (Faeries)
 
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Galen Kaup
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As a beginner, there isn't too much difference. If you play a lot 2p and 3-4p become more and more different.

2p is a control game about forcing stuff to happen on your terms. It emphasizes burst and covering specific potential threats by your opponent. 3p and 4p are more about getting value for your power and setting up the board so that Opponent 1's best choice happens to benefit you more than Opponent 2.

Basically, if you enjoy looking for tactics on future turns you'll prefer 2p, if you enjoy trying to make the biggest play right now this turn you'll prefer 3p/4p.

Game length depends very much on the players, but it should take less than 30 minutes per game under normal circumstances.
 
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Igor Persin
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Okay, so she got the game. SHe does like it, I am more or less happy with it too. She is a bit AP, so considers a lot of options on her turn, but it's manageble, she doesn't take too long.
But from what I see, in 1v1, it's basically smash up over one location at time. We always both go for highest score lcoation in game.

We had blind picks and first game she won vs me, it was ballanced game. But in 2nd game I got robots+aliens and she got so much iritated, that she didn't want to play for some time after that, I had fun, since you troll, but she had - 100 fun factor.

Then we had another one or two ballanced games, but then she got zombies+robots, vs me who got pirates+ lepricorns. This game she obliterated me, and said, yea, I had fun, but it's pointless, you had 0 chance to win.

Then I got aliens+wizards, vs her ninja+dino, and she went mad after this one, and said, yea, I am throwing aliens out of the game! No one is gonna play them, they ruin the game and are completely OP. I play something ,you return it to my hand and so on...
Actually this game was more or less even,I was on 12 pts and she was on 12 pts, but I was trolling her with that return minion and playing/drawing bunch of cards. So she plans something ,and then I ruin it with return minion. Final nail to the coffin was, when she was winning on one 5pt base that would put her in the lead, but I changed that base to the base that has winner get 2pt and 2nd guy 3pt, and pulled another of her minions from another base so that this base scores and she wins, thus getting less pts and me winning. ANd this was game over for aliens, bye bye from the game -.-


I m ean, I like the game, but half of the factions seem so strong , while other half seem sub par. So even with blind pick, there is chance that someone gets strong combination and other guy gets lemon, and it's gg from the very start...

SHe also said, yea, I am gonna get expansion. SHe likes that one awesom level over 9000. But it's not oyur fault might be better. After all, you do get 5 faction.


 
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Andre Oliveira
Brazil
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Factions have different power levels, as you can see here - basically, zombie, robots and aliens are top tier (in that order).

That's why I created these paste ups buffs for weaker factions and some adjustments for stronger ones (not necessarily straight out nerfs).

All that being said, here are some useful considerations:
1 people tend to play faster after some games (card memorization goes a long way)
2 in a 2x2 game you try to make most points out of your plays, if your opponent has a lead on a base, play your minions elsewhere while preventing that player from scoring that base alone (another reason why ninja shinobi is so great is to prevent that)
3 don't blind pick. this game is supposed to be drafted 1-2-2-1 - I'd recommend picking a pool of 5 random factions for the draft.
4 awesome level over 9000 is a good xpack with most factions being mid tier (about dinosaur/wizard strength) but their gameplay styles feels more distinct. It's your fault has most factions on par of alien power (strong side).
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Chet C.
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Shanghai
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Even though you already got the game, I'll cast my vote. Smash Up is great for two players that know the factions. Randomly/blindly choosing factions will result in some very unbalanced games. Picking your factions is a huge part of the strategy and fun, especially in 2-player games where balance is critical. Andre's suggestion of 1221 pick out of 5 random factions is a great way to keep things balance and interesting while not replaying the same factions every game.

The benefit of 3-player games is that balance issues are minimized by players ganging up against the leader.

I really enjoy the idea of 2v2, but have yet to find rules that don't create severe imbalance. (Elves, Dragons, and Tonados are imbalanced if partners are effected by each others' cards; Elder Things, Spies, and Tricksters (!) are imbalanced if cards do not affect the partner.)

A strength of Smash Up is that the scoring mechanism gives points to 2nd and 3rd place, so you're never too far behind.

Like Andre mentioned, you should not always play on the same base. Once you think your opponent is probably going to win that base, start playin on a different base. This forces your opponent to waste a lot of resources to close the base that they are winning. Meanwhile, you can take the lead on one or even two other bases.

Also, sometimes the best option is to not play a card. This can help you to be more powerful later. This is especially true if playing a card would put the base 3-7 power from breaking and giving more points to your opponent.

Keep learning the factions an your 2-player games will become more fair and more fun!

Lastly, I suggest It's Your Fault over Awesome Level 9000. The IYF factions are more fun, more polished, and more universally balanced than AL9000. (All 5 IYF factions are almost always a viable pairing, whereas Ghosts and Plants from AL9000 have many bad pairings.)
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