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Legendary: A Marvel Deck Building Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: Scheme Twist Question rss

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Chieh-Li Lee
United States
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I find the Scheme Twist mechanism a little strange. If the game ends when you draw the last Scheme Twist card:

1. What if all the Scheme Twist card somehow all ended up at the top of the deck? It would certainly make it an uninteresting and short game.
2. What's the point of having more cards after the last Scheme Twist as those cards would never be used?

Any insight or response would be greatly appreciated.
 
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Andrew Brown
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1: is unfortunate but unlikely to happen that often

2: i'm not sure what you're asking. if you put the last Scheme Twist at the very bottom of the deck, you'll know absolutely when the end of the game is. by randomising it (and having an unknown number of cards underneath it), there's more of a sense of urgency to finish the encounter because you can't count the cards and know when you'll lose

3: i know you didn't have a 3, but not all schemes end when you draw the last twist
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Chris Waits
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That's definitely something that can happen in this game, and it's rough, but it's a random element of a card game. It's meant to keep the tension up.

If this really bothers you, shuffle the villain deck with no twists, then make piles with 1-2 scheme twists each, shuffle those, and restack. That will keep it random without having a clump of them early.
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Chieh-Li Lee
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Thank you for your response.

The game ends anyway when the deck runs out no? So if putting the last scheme twist exactly at the bottom would just be redundant.

I like the idea of distributing the scheme twist more evenly throughout the deck. I don't mind the game ending prematurely but I don't think the last scheme twist should be too random that it could just render half of the deck useless. I think shuffling it into the last few cards is a much better idea.
 
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Lonny x
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jellylee2020 wrote:
Thank you for your response.

The game ends anyway when the deck runs out no? So if putting the last scheme twist exactly at the bottom would just be redundant.

I like the idea of distributing the scheme twist more evenly throughout the deck. I don't mind the game ending prematurely but I don't think the last scheme twist should be too random that it could just render half of the deck useless. I think shuffling it into the last few cards is a much better idea.


You could always add more scheme twists to increase the chances of one being on the bottom.devil That being said I've never played a game where every single scheme twist is on the top. Also, for most schemes evil does not win when you run out of scheme twists.
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Adam Steele
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1) The game does end when the villain deck runs out, but if the scheme is not on a timer, this can end up meaning it results in a draw instead of a loss.
2) Depending on the scheme, getting a bunch of twists early on can actually be helpful. If all they do is reference a thing that doesn't exist yet, that just made the game easier.
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Michael Green
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Organous wrote:

2) Depending on the scheme, getting a bunch of twists early on can actually be helpful. If all they do is reference a thing that doesn't exist yet, that just made the game easier.


It's like when the Villain gets over-confident and reveals his plan to the Heroes:

He had me and what does he do? He starts monologuing...
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Justin H

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dr00 wrote:
not all schemes end when you draw the last twist


What he said. Plus that;s what you get when everything is randomized. I've played plenty of other games where you "fight the deck" and have lost very early as well.
 
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Davy Ashleydale
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It depends on how much randomness you like in a game. The way you build the deck of cards in Pandemic is to deal the deck out into 5 roughly equal piles and put one Outbreak card in each pile. That tends to spread them out a little and it makes them more predictable. You could still get two in a row, but if that happens, you know you're not getting another one in the next ten cards or so.

But I embrace the randomness of Legendary. I like it when the game is extremely unpredictable and that perhaps the last several cards won't even make it into the game because they are below the last Twist.

You may be the type of person that would rather have a little more predictability and less chaos in a board game. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

However, it's extremely unlikely that all of the Twists end up at the top of the deck. You may as well criticize Poker because it's technically possible that one player will always be dealt all of the Aces.
 
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Jerome Nowak

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randomlife wrote:
It depends on how much randomness you like in a game. The way you build the deck of cards in Pandemic is to deal the deck out into 5 roughly equal piles and put one Outbreak card in each pile. That tends to spread them out a little and it makes them more predictable. You could still get two in a row, but if that happens, you know you're not getting another one in the next ten cards or so.

But I embrace the randomness of Legendary. I like it when the game is extremely unpredictable and that perhaps the last several cards won't even make it into the game because they are below the last Twist.

You may be the type of person that would rather have a little more predictability and less chaos in a board game. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

However, it's extremely unlikely that all of the Twists end up at the top of the deck. You may as well criticize Poker because it's technically possible that one player will always be dealt all of the Aces.


The difference is, in Poker, the cards are shuffled and then dealt out to all players one at a time, til everyone has a full hand. The villain deck is shuffled and then not touched (unless a card ability has you do so), so the cards being in order in the shuffled deck will always be in order. In a shuffled poker deck, if all the aces are together, one player WILL NOT receive all of them.

I think its nice to have randomness, but I really hate spending an hour or more setting up a game and playing, and then having it be lost with no way for me to even have won the game in the first place, with the way the decks were set up.
 
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Dan Harrow
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jnowak415 wrote:
The difference is, in Poker, the cards are shuffled and then dealt out to all players one at a time, til everyone has a full hand. The villain deck is shuffled and then not touched (unless a card ability has you do so), so the cards being in order in the shuffled deck will always be in order. In a shuffled poker deck, if all the aces are together, one player WILL NOT receive all of them.

I understand the point you are making and it is extremely disappointing to draw your scheme twists in a row and lose the game before you even really get started.

But, I'd also like to be a bit pedantic and point out that the odds of the four aces being in a row and the odds of the four aces being exactly three cards apart and, as such, all dealt to the same player are exactly the same.
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Jerome Nowak

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XeyneGaming wrote:
jnowak415 wrote:
The difference is, in Poker, the cards are shuffled and then dealt out to all players one at a time, til everyone has a full hand. The villain deck is shuffled and then not touched (unless a card ability has you do so), so the cards being in order in the shuffled deck will always be in order. In a shuffled poker deck, if all the aces are together, one player WILL NOT receive all of them.

I understand the point you are making and it is extremely disappointing to draw your scheme twists in a row and lose the game before you even really get started.

But, I'd also like to be a bit pedantic and point out that the odds of the four aces being in a row and the odds of the four aces being exactly three cards apart and, as such, all dealt to the same player are exactly the same.


Youre right.
 
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