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Empires in Arms» Forums » Rules

Subject: Moving a corps into another major country city... rss

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KO Koerner
Germany
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Hi everybody,

I do have another question concerning the rules of Empire in Arms:

-can I move into another major countries city, when own corps are in that city;

let me explain:

-I still have peace with France, but in an french city are 5 Spanish (and portuguese) fleets;

-I am at war with Spain

-in that city with the spanish fleets are multible french corps but not a single spanish one

-lets say I gain forcible access into french territory (paying one pol. point) and march into the french city with the spanish fleet in the harbor

MAY I enter the french city, or can France deny me access (I believe not so);
What happens to the french corps? Do they have to leave the city?
If the french have to leave the city, can I then either burn the spanish fleets or make them leave the harbor.

Can anyone help me, it would be awesome if you could post the number of the rule as well, because I couldn't find it in the rules.

Thanks in advance,

sincerly Trixer
 
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Oscar Oliver
Saint Lucia
Terrassa
Catalonia
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Let's see... step by step... city cannot be besieged because there are no enemy troops inside (Fleets are no troops). French troops are simply ignored if in the field.

If there is no french garrison at all and you are willing to spend a PP (and risk a French DOW) you can detach and force the enemy fleets out of port.

If there is some French garrison, but city is not full ... to be able to force the fleets out rule 6.2.6 says that the port must become enemy-controlled. You cannot take control of the city because French garrison forbides it :

Quote:
10.3.2 CITY OCCUPATION: The nationality of a city garrison determines who controls the city for combat purposes, regardless of the major power formally controlling the province or minor country in which the city is located. For example, a Russian garrison in a French port city allows the Russian player to determine if the port's harbour defences are used against attacking fleets.
10.3.2.1: If a city has a garrison consisting of army factors from more than one major power, control is with the major power formally controlling the province or minor country. If no army factors of the major power formally controlling the province are present, control for combat purposes can be decided by mutual agreement among the players with army factors present or, if agreement is impossible, by competitive die rolls with no modifiers. If garrisons in in the same city suddenly find themselves at war due to a declaration of war, immediately determine city control by trivial combat between the hostile garrison forces.
10.3.2.2: If there is no garrison, the city is controlled by major power or neutral minor country which controls the territory in which the city is located-port cities without garrisons may not use their harbour defences.


Don't risk a free French dow when all your potencial allies are in enforced peace. France always wins if he can manage enforced peace periods. Hope it helps.
 
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KO Koerner
Germany
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Thanks alot Oscar Oliver,

that was very helpful, very helpful indeed.

But since I am not the brightest star in the Sky, I do have some follow up questions:

-so if there is NO french garrison in the city, I can just move into the city and force the fleets out, right?!?

-if there is some garrison in the city, but only a couple and I can send in more troops than the french, can I then still force out the fleets or is a single unit of french garrison enough, to nullify my efforts to make the fleets leave?!?
(edit: reading rule 10.3.2.1 again in the morning, I think it answers that question: any size french garrison in the city forbides me to use the cannons aka drive out the fleets, dislike^^)

-since you stated rule 6.2.6, I read on and found:
6.2.6.1: If the port is blockaded by an enemy fleet at the time, the fleet in the port is scuttled instead and all its fleets and ships are lost. Alternately, if desired, the blockaded fleet(s) may choose to fight the blockading fleet(s), with the wind gauge automatically going to the blockading fleet(s). The blockaded fleet(s) remains in the blockade box if it wins the combat. The blockaded fleet(s) must be scuttled if it loses the naval combat.

Does that mean, the owner of the pushed out fleets can decide to sink the fleets immediately or try to fight, (probably loosing, vs. Nelson and worse winds) loosing some political points and then loose all fleets?!?

By the way, a dow is even wanted, because then I can support the GB troops in sweden, which is french unfortunately (see the other topic, in this forum, the thread right beneath this one^^)

Hoping for good answers, enjoy your weekend,

sincerely Olaf.
 
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Ken
United States
Crystal Lake
Illinois
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Teofilus wrote:
If there is no french garrison at all and you are willing to spend a PP (and risk a French DOW) you can detach and force the enemy fleets out of port.


Late to the game, but this isn't correct. When using forcible access, you cannot detach garrisons:

"Forcible access operates under the same restrictions as access through neutral minor countries (see 10.3.1.1)."

10.3.1.1: Any major power may move forces and trace supply through a neutral minor country. A major power may not also build depots and/or occupy cities in a minor country unless that major power is at war with or controls that minor country.

There's no way to force the fleets to sail without the French granting formal access that includes the ability to garrison cities.
 
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Ken
United States
Crystal Lake
Illinois
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JagdTrixer wrote:
Does that mean, the owner of the pushed out fleets can decide to sink the fleets immediately or try to fight, (probably loosing, vs. Nelson and worse winds) loosing some political points and then loose all fleets?!?...


Yes. The owner chooses whether to scuttle or not. If not, then you fight, exchange PP, and then they scuttle if they lost. If the latter happens, they also lose points for scuttling. Gets pricey fast.
 
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