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ONUS! Rome Vs Carthage» Forums » Rules

Subject: "Cannot charge" and melee engagement rss

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Stephan Beal
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Hi, all,

Unit X takes an action which prohibits Charging but brings his front section(s) into contact with Unit Y, so X does not (cannot) engage in melee with Unit Y. Thus units X and Y are in physical contact but not engaged.

On Unit Y's turn...

a) must Unit Y be explicitly activated by an Order card to engage Unit X in melee, or is engagement "free" because both units are in contact? (My assumption is that Y may engage X "for free" (without an Order card) on Y's turn.)

b) if explicit activation of Unit Y is required to enter melee with Unit X, this implies that Unit Y may move freely because it is not engaged (e.g. it may use the All-Direction Movement to escape from Unit X (remember that All-Direction movement is only allowed by units which are not in combat)).

In a large battle, it seems like keeping track of which units are "engaged" vs "in contact but not engaged" could become problematic. Thus my assumption is that units which are in (frontal) contact with an enemy are always considered "engaged", even if they cannot Charge when they come into contact.

:-?
 
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Hi Stephen,

In the example you describe unit Y must be activated with an order. After that, unit Y can engage in combat or move somewhere else.

If unit Y is not activated it can´t combat. In the following turn unit X must be activated to engage in combat or move somewhere else.

If you play very large battles you can use the activation counters, for example, to indicate the units in contact but not engaged that require activation. Any other counter that you find suitable will do, as well.
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Stephan Beal
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onusgame wrote:
In the example you describe unit Y must be activated with an order. After that, unit Y can engage in combat or move somewhere else.

If unit Y is not activated it can´t combat. In the following turn unit X must be activated to engage in combat or move somewhere else.


Unit Y requiring an explicit activation seems to contradict page 27 (first paragraph):

Quote:
During this phase, all the combats of units that were previously in contact are resolved since they do not need to be activated to continue with the engagement.


(emphasis added)

At the start of Unit Y's turn, it is "in contact" with Unit X, so "previously [before this turn] in contact" applies.

That implies that Unit Y can activate "for free" to attack Unit X because Unit X came into contact with Unit Y on Unit X's turn (but did not charge, thus could not attack). However...

That same paragraph also says that Unit X can attack on the turn it comes "into contact" with Unit Y:

Quote:
Then, players will resolve the combats of the units that were activated during the current turn, as well as units that moved into contact with enemy units.


(emphasis added)

That sentence implies that:

a) Unit X may attack Unit Y on X's own turn even if X does not/cannot Charge. It only requires that X comes "into contact" with Y.

b) There is effectively no difference between "coming into contact" and "charging" except for special cases which apply only when charging (e.g. Onrush or Arrow Tip).

So... page 27's first paragraph seems to say that units which "cannot charge," but "come into contact" with an enemy on their turn may attack in that turn's melee phase, but cannot use any Charge-specific abilities (e.g. Onrush, Arrow Tip) because they "cannot charge."

That... makes complete sense to me, actually. i have been struggling with the idea that units may come into contact without engaging in melee, but if page 27's English translation is correct, they may engage in melee when they come into contact even if/when they cannot use "only when charging" abilities.

Some abilities and movement options say that the unit "cannot charge," so i have always assumed that there must be some functional difference between the "contact" and "charging." (e.g. page 18 prohibits charging if a unit pivots backwards or pivots 360 degrees.) However, my current understanding (based on page 27) is now that "cannot charge" only prohibits the use of Charge-specific abilities, and does not prohibit engaging in melee on that turn. That makes more logical sense to me than my previous understanding (that "cannot charge" also means "cannot engage in melee").


onusgame wrote:
If you play very large battles you can use the activation counters, for example, to indicate the units in contact but not engaged that require activation. Any other counter that you find suitable will do, as well.


That seems reasonable enough. i have lots of blank plastic tokens in different colors which i could use for this. However, based on page 27's first paragraph, i won't need to unless a unit chooses not to engage in melee with an enemy it is "in contact" with. (Presumably a unit may choose to not engage, but i don't see a rule which explicitly specifies that.)
 
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