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Adrian Hague
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Quote:
US President Barack Obama has said Congress made a "mistake" by overriding his veto and pushing through a bill that allows legal action against Saudi Arabia over the 9/11 attacks.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-37503224

A dangerous precedent, or a necessary step? I can understand the families of 9/11 victims wanting justice, but then I can also see the diplomatic ramifications being very far-reaching (both for the U.S. and Saudi Arabia)

Your thoughts, o denizens of RSP?
 
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Moshe Callen
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ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ/ πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν./...
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See here.
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Adrian Hague
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whac3 wrote:

Nuts, missed that.

Thanks Moshe
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Moshe Callen
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ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ/ πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν./...
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AdrianPHague wrote:
whac3 wrote:

Nuts, missed that.

Thanks Moshe

You could always go for a different take on it.
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Captain Nemo
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whac3 wrote:
AdrianPHague wrote:
whac3 wrote:

Nuts, missed that.

Thanks Moshe

You could always go for a different take on it.


Quote:
But Terry Strada, national chair for 9/11 Families United For Justice Against Terrorism, has disagreed that the bill could backfire in the way the White House has warned.
"If we're not funding terrorist organisations and killing people, then we don't have anything to worry about," she said.

Will we see Americans in court over claims of funding the Irish Republican Army?
 
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David desJardins
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hammurabi70 wrote:
Will we see Americans in court over claims of funding the Irish Republican Army?


The bill is about suing foreign governments, not individuals. It doesn't make any changes to the legal grounds for suing individuals.

But I'd certainly be glad to see some of the US backers of the IRA forced to compensate its victims.
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Boaty McBoatface
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And it now looks like I know more then congress, so please contribute to the S Slater for congress he is not a total fuck wit campaign.
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Boaty McBoatface
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DaviddesJ wrote:
hammurabi70 wrote:
Will we see Americans in court over claims of funding the Irish Republican Army?


The bill is about suing foreign governments, not individuals. It doesn't make any changes to the legal grounds for suing individuals.

But I'd certainly be glad to see some of the US backers of the IRA forced to compensate its victims.
I really do hope so, NORAID was sending money to the terrorists for years. The US government alolwoed it, the US courts gave sanctuary to convicted terrorists.
 
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David Dearlove
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DaviddesJ wrote:
hammurabi70 wrote:
Will we see Americans in court over claims of funding the Irish Republican Army?


The bill is about suing foreign governments, not individuals. It doesn't make any changes to the legal grounds for suing individuals.

But I'd certainly be glad to see some of the US backers of the IRA forced to compensate its victims.

Ironically at the time of 9/11 the only voices I heard in the UK who were in favour of the action were not Muslims but right wingers saying that the Americans deserved it exactly because of that support. US governments not cracking down on open collection of money for attacks on an ally did cause a lot of resentment at the time.
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J
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Our government has also directly funded groups like the Contras, Mujahadeen, etc. we could be open to all kind of lawsuits now.
 
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Captain Nemo
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DavidDearlove wrote:

Ironically at the time of 9/11 the only voices I heard in the UK who were in favour of the action were not Muslims but right wingers saying that the Americans deserved it exactly because of that support. US governments not cracking down on open collection of money for attacks on an ally did cause a lot of resentment at the time.


And not only nut-case right-wingers. I met a lot of people who at the time seemed to derive quiet satisfaction that America had got its just reward rather than be appalled at the loss of life, which included a lot of their own countrymen.
 
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David Dearlove
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hammurabi70 wrote:
DavidDearlove wrote:

Ironically at the time of 9/11 the only voices I heard in the UK who were in favour of the action were not Muslims but right wingers saying that the Americans deserved it exactly because of that support. US governments not cracking down on open collection of money for attacks on an ally did cause a lot of resentment at the time.


And not only nut-case right-wingers. I met a lot of people who at the time seemed to derive quiet satisfaction that America had got its just reward rather than be appalled at the loss of life, which included a lot of their own countrymen.

One of the guys I knew was a Royal Marine who had done three tours in NI and wasn't impressed to be shot at with guns bought in America with money from Americans.
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Robert Wesley
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slatersteven wrote:
And it now looks like I know more then congress, so please contribute to the S Slater for congress he is not a total fuck wit campaign.
A-L-L HALF-'numbwits' concur yet these STILL insist their "D" & "R" "ilk" are good for what, precisely? 'Wastrels', then, sure WERE! thumbsdown
 
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AMK
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What authority does an American law really have to another country?

That is, if someone files a legal action against Saudi Arabia, what's to stop Saudi Arabia from just laughing and telling them to screw off?

I fail to see how this law is anything more than symbolic. Am I missing something?
 
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J
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Keele047 wrote:
What authority does an American law really have to another country?

That is, if someone files a legal action against Saudi Arabia, what's to stop Saudi Arabia from just laughing and telling them to screw off?

I fail to see how this law is anything more than symbolic. Am I missing something?

Assets that are in the US could be seized. Saudi Arabia has said they plan to get all their money out of the US in retaliation. We may also have agreements with other countries where the assets could also be seized, but I'm not sure about that.
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David desJardins
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jmilum wrote:
Assets that are in the US could be seized. Saudi Arabia has said they plan to get all their money out of the US in retaliation. We may also have agreements with other countries where the assets could also be seized, but I'm not sure about that.


Additionally, the world oil market is denominated in dollars and relies on many US market participants, so the Saudis would have a significant problem if they can't engage in any economic transactions with Americans because they told the US judicial system to "screw off". And there are plenty of times where they might actually want access to US courts, to enforce their own interests, contracts, etc.
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Captain Nemo
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DavidDearlove wrote:

One of the guys I knew was a Royal Marine who had done three tours in NI and wasn't impressed to be shot at with guns bought in America with money from Americans.


Quite.

The bestman at my brother's wedding died in one of the towers on 9/11; it IS personal.
 
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Boaty McBoatface
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DaviddesJ wrote:
jmilum wrote:
Assets that are in the US could be seized. Saudi Arabia has said they plan to get all their money out of the US in retaliation. We may also have agreements with other countries where the assets could also be seized, but I'm not sure about that.


Additionally, the world oil market is denominated in dollars and relies on many US market participants, so the Saudis would have a significant problem if they can't engage in any economic transactions with Americans because they told the US judicial system to "screw off". And there are plenty of times where they might actually want access to US courts, to enforce their own interests, contracts, etc.
They could do what Iraq tried to do, and sell oil of the markets in local currency.

This in fact cold be seen as a far bigger threat to the us then any other possible sanctions, the US gains huge economic benefit from the dollar being the currency of international trade.
 
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Boaty McBoatface
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hammurabi70 wrote:
DavidDearlove wrote:

One of the guys I knew was a Royal Marine who had done three tours in NI and wasn't impressed to be shot at with guns bought in America with money from Americans.


Quite.

The bestman at my brother's wedding died in one of the towers on 9/11; it IS personal.
I am sure many of us have been affected by terrorism.

The point is that until 11/9 the yanks did not give a fuck about the IRA, and in fact supported them (by the standards now laid down by the USA).
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Captain Nemo
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slatersteven wrote:
hammurabi70 wrote:
DavidDearlove wrote:

One of the guys I knew was a Royal Marine who had done three tours in NI and wasn't impressed to be shot at with guns bought in America with money from Americans.


Quite.

The bestman at my brother's wedding died in one of the towers on 9/11; it IS personal.
I am sure many of us have been affected by terrorism.

The point is that until 11/9 the yanks did not give a fuck about the IRA, and in fact supported them (by the standards now laid down by the USA).


Very true.
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G Rowls
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Are they going to keep going to extend and back date the period it ocvers like the copyright laws?

Looking forwards to seeying all these congressmen defend a lawsuit over 1776.
 
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David desJardins
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growlley wrote:
Are they going to keep going to extend and back date the period it ocvers like the copyright laws?


It's a bit different from that, because the issue is immunity, which is a procedural question, not a substantive one. Under the old law, even if they clearly committed a tort at the time, they can't be sued now. The new law simply allows the suit to proceed, with responsibility still determined under the laws that were in effect at the time.
 
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