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Subject: CO2 -> Ethenol rss

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Chengkai Yang
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http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/green-tech/a23417/co...

Reaction can occur at room temp, "The tech involves a new combination of copper and carbon arranged into nano spikes on a silicon surface." Looks like more research is needed to improve efficiency. Ramifications of large scale and easy conversion of CO2 definitely look good for the environment though.
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Michael Pustilnik
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This reaction is endothermic (it requires an input of energy). The energy needed to do this comes from electricity, which could be supplied by green energy sources, but often is not.

Therefore, I don't see this as the solution to global warming. Using corn or sugar to make ethanol uses the sun as the energy source, so these methods of producing ethanol as an automotive fuel are more promising.
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Chengkai Yang
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MikePustilnik wrote:
This reaction is endothermic (it requires an input of energy). The energy needed to do this comes from electricity, which could be supplied by green energy sources, but often is not.

Therefore, I don't see this as the solution to global warming. Using corn or sugar to make ethanol uses the sun as the energy source, so these methods of producing ethanol as an automotive fuel are more promising.


Ah, I didn't see that bit. I guess it'll just retard the amount of emissions then? Still seems useful depending on the amount of energy input required.
 
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Tom McVey
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draxx01 wrote:
MikePustilnik wrote:
This reaction is endothermic (it requires an input of energy). The energy needed to do this comes from electricity, which could be supplied by green energy sources, but often is not.

Therefore, I don't see this as the solution to global warming. Using corn or sugar to make ethanol uses the sun as the energy source, so these methods of producing ethanol as an automotive fuel are more promising.


Ah, I didn't see that bit. I guess it'll just retard the amount of emissions then? Still seems useful depending on the amount of energy input required.


Potentially could be an effective energy conversion for intermittent energy sources like solar and wind.

Probably shoots the field of carbon capture and sequestration in the head.
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Michael Pustilnik
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tmcvey wrote:

Potentially could be an effective energy conversion for intermittent energy sources like solar and wind.

Probably shoots the field of carbon capture and sequestration in the head.


I didn't mean to put this idea down completely. This could be a good idea if solar electricity generation becomes cheaper and more efficient.

There is another issue. Current CO2 levels are still less than 1%, which might be too dilute for the reaction to work. I glanced over the original scientific article, and it looks like the scientists used aqueous solution saturated with CO2. So to use this process on a large scale might require us to extract CO2 out of the air first.
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David Dearlove
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MikePustilnik wrote:
This reaction is endothermic (it requires an input of energy). The energy needed to do this comes from electricity, which could be supplied by green energy sources, but often is not.

Therefore, I don't see this as the solution to global warming. Using corn or sugar to make ethanol uses the sun as the energy source, so these methods of producing ethanol as an automotive fuel are more promising.

Except that the inputs for farming are huge, in terms of diesel fuel, fertiliser and water. Corn (Maize as we call it) is pretty low calorie. Corn for ethanol is just a subsidy for farmers and has reduced US food production drastically. As a means of turning solar energy into fuel it's terribly inefficient.
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Michael Pustilnik
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DavidDearlove wrote:

Except that the inputs for farming are huge, in terms of diesel fuel, fertiliser and water. Corn (Maize as we call it) is pretty low calorie. Corn for ethanol is just a subsidy for farmers and has reduced US food production drastically. As a means of turning solar energy into fuel it's terribly inefficient.


I agree that sugar is much more efficient.
 
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Walt
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The US navy is working on this, or something similar, to use excess nuclear energy on carriers to generate jet fuel, which is a pretty simple hydrocarbon.
 
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What is Ethenol?
 
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borgfather wrote:
What is Ethanol?


Alcohol.
 
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Walt
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MWChapel wrote:
borgfather wrote:
What is Ethanol?

Alcohol.

Specifically, the common alcohol found in beer, wine, and spirits.
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Michael Pustilnik
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borgfather wrote:
What is Ethenol?


The original poster misspelled "ethanol".

Ethenol (CH2CHOH) exists, but would tend to isomerize to acetaldehyde (CH3CHO).
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Christopher Dearlove
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MikePustilnik wrote:
borgfather wrote:
What is Ethenol?


The original poster misspelled "ethanol".

Ethenol (CH2CHOH) exists, but would tend to isomerize to acetaldehyde (CH3CHO).


No, it really doesn't. At least not if left alone to any significant extent. Otherwise all your alcoholic drinks would become somewhat more poisonous.
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Oliver Dienz
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Dearlove wrote:
MikePustilnik wrote:
borgfather wrote:
What is Ethenol?


The original poster misspelled "ethanol".

Ethenol (CH2CHOH) exists, but would tend to isomerize to acetaldehyde (CH3CHO).


No, it really doesn't. At least not if left alone to any significant extent. Otherwise all your alcoholic drinks would become somewhat more poisonous.


Ethen (H2C=CH2) is not the same as ethan (H3C-CH3). Likewise, ethanol is not the same as as ethenol (vinyl alcohol: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinyl_alcohol ). So the drinks would not become poisonous because ethenol does or does not tend to convert to acetaldehyde but because they contain ethanol, not ethenol.
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Michael Pustilnik
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Dearlove wrote:
MikePustilnik wrote:
borgfather wrote:
What is Ethenol?


The original poster misspelled "ethanol".

Ethenol (CH2CHOH) exists, but would tend to isomerize to acetaldehyde (CH3CHO).


No, it really doesn't. At least not if left alone to any significant extent. Otherwise all your alcoholic drinks would become somewhat more poisonous.


The second "e" in "ethenol" indicates the presence of a double bond. As I said, "ethenol" would mostly be in the form of acetaldehyde.

The alcohol that people drink is called "ethanol". The "a" indicates that it has no double bond. Ethanol does not isomerize to acetaldehyde.
 
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Michael Pustilnik
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odie73 wrote:


Ethen (H2C=CH2) is not the same as ethan (H3C-CH3). Likewise, ethanol is not the same as as ethenol (vinyl alcohol: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinyl_alcohol ). So the drinks would not become poisonous because ethenol does or does not tend to convert to acetaldehyde but because they contain ethanol, not ethenol.


This is correct.
 
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Walt
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However, the OP's article is about ethanol.
 
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Michael Pustilnik
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Tall_Walt wrote:
However, the OP's article is about ethanol.


Right. He just misspelled it in the title.
 
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MWChapel wrote:
borgfather wrote:
What is Ethanol?


Alcohol.


Why would you misquote me?

borgfather wrote:
What is Ethenol?
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Walt
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borgfather wrote:
MWChapel wrote:
borgfather wrote:
What is Ethanol?


Alcohol.


Why would you misquote me?

borgfather wrote:
What is Ethenol?

He just thought he was correcting a typo since the OP's article is about ethanol.
 
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Christopher Dearlove
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odie73 wrote:
Dearlove wrote:
MikePustilnik wrote:
borgfather wrote:
What is Ethenol?


The original poster misspelled "ethanol".

Ethenol (CH2CHOH) exists, but would tend to isomerize to acetaldehyde (CH3CHO).


No, it really doesn't. At least not if left alone to any significant extent. Otherwise all your alcoholic drinks would become somewhat more poisonous.


Ethen (H2C=CH2) is not the same as ethan (H3C-CH3). Likewise, ethanol is not the same as as ethenol (vinyl alcohol: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinyl_alcohol ). So the drinks would not become poisonous because ethenol does or does not tend to convert to acetaldehyde but because they contain ethanol, not ethenol.


All I can say is duh. Didn't read you carefully enough, made an idiot comment. I don't do thumbs (there's a reason why) so GG will have to do.
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Matthew Schoell
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So, could this be wearable and then the CO2 you exhale converts to ethanol you drink...
 
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Doc Mage wrote:
So, could this be wearable and then the CO2 you exhale converts to ethanol you drink...

Or just ethanol vapour you breathe back in. Genius.
 
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Walt
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Doc Mage wrote:
So, could this be wearable and then the CO2 you exhale converts to ethanol you drink...

Unfortunately, you need to add energy to go from CO2 to ethanol.

However, if you kill back your gut bacteria with antibiotics, then consume beer with live fermentation bacteria, they can colonize you. Then you just eat carbohydrates and get drunk.

http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/09/17/223345977/aut...
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Ethenol.



Ethanol.





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