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Subject: The Donald - "I will keep you in suspense" rss

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Andre
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http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/24/politics/donald-trump-election...

The real facts behind the election process. Not that I believe any recounts will be required in this election (that will actually affect the outcome), but I find this article interesting, in that CNN and other news agencies have spent an inordinate amount of time on Trumps comments regarding the concession of the election. An inordinate amount of time that is unnecessary, given the fact in the article. His ultimate "concession" is not required. In Trumps mind, I believe he is attempting to de-legitimize the Clinton Presidency, and given her high unfavorable rating, he is making it more difficult for the die-hard Trump fans, to accept a Clinton Presidency. I do feel, however, that the news coverage of his statements went way overboard, in terms of hand-wringing and claims he was thwarting democracy.
 
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Moshe Callen
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How is that not undermining US democracy?
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C Bazler
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I don't think it's his lack of concession but precisely his attempt to de-legitimize the Clinton Presidency that thwarts our democracy, by instilling doubts and paranoia about a rigged election in the populace. That is an extremely dangerous position to be promoting, and does directly represent a threat to the peaceful transference of power.

The moment our own people begin to doubt the fairness of our democratic process, our democracy is unquestionably damaged.
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Andre
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whac3 wrote:
How is that not undermining US democracy?


If his concession is not required in reailty, he is simply exercising his right to free speech, no? It does not matter that the speech may be incendiary, or may, in some people's opinion, undermine the democratic process. Fomenting doubt in the democratic process by way of speech, may not be right in sompe peoples minds, but I would not go so far as to suggest that he does not have the right to do it. Now that, I would consider to be non-democratic.
 
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David Hoffman
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If he doesn't concede, and then further goes on to launch "Trump TV" or whatever it'll be, he can jump right in with big ratings by beating the, "Hillary stole the election from me" story right out of the gate.

If he insists her presidency is illegitimate, well, that just gives the GOP something to bitch about for the next four years, and an excuse to obstruct everything she wants to do.

Oh, also, it's an insult to the country and everything we stand for. Yay.
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Moshe Callen
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abadolato01 wrote:
whac3 wrote:
How is that not undermining US democracy?


If his concession is not required in reailty, he is simply exercising his right to free speech, no? It does not matter that the speech may be incendiary, or may, in some people's opinion, undermine the democratic process. Fomenting doubt in the democratic process by way of speech, may not be right in sompe peoples minds, but I would not go so far as to suggest that he does not have the right to do it. Now that, I would consider to be non-democratic.

As GC has said, it's the attacks on the foundations of democracy that are the problem, not his giving or not giving a concession speech.
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Josh
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There is a big difference between 'I may not give a speech' which the OP is focusing on, and 'I may not accept the results as legitimste' which is what Trump is promoting.
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Drew
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ohbalto wrote:
If he insists her presidency is illegitimate, well, that just gives the GOP something to bitch about for the next four years, and an excuse to obstruct everything she wants to do.

Oh, also, it's an insult to the country and everything we stand for. Yay.


20 members of the House refused to accept the results of the 2000 election when it came time for the House to certify the vote.

Hillary (then a Senator from New York) refused to acknowledge the results two years later, and while she was secretary of State implied that Jeb helped his brother steal the election.

There are your people who, post-election, delegitimized the presidency.

Who cares if The Donald will keep you in suspense. Who cares? Members of your party did and still do refuse to acknowledge the legitimacy of President George W. Bush.

Fainting couches are to your left.
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Pontifex Maximus
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Drew1365 wrote:
ohbalto wrote:
If he insists her presidency is illegitimate, well, that just gives the GOP something to bitch about for the next four years, and an excuse to obstruct everything she wants to do.

Oh, also, it's an insult to the country and everything we stand for. Yay.


20 members of the House refused to accept the results of the 2000 election when it came time for the House to certify the vote.

Hillary (then a Senator from New York) refused to acknowledge the results two years later, and while she was secretary of State implied that Jeb helped his brother steal the election.

There are your people who, post-election, delegitimized the presidency.

Who cares if The Donald will keep you in suspense. Who cares? Members of your party did and still do refuse to acknowledge the legitimacy of President George W. Bush.

Fainting couches are to your left.


This is Gore's concession speech

http://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/14/us/43rd-president-his-rema...

"Almost a century and a half ago, Senator Stephen Douglas told Abraham Lincoln, who had just defeated him for the presidency, ''Partisan feeling must yield to patriotism. I'm with you, Mr. President, and God bless you.'' Well, in that same spirit, I say to President-elect Bush that what remains of partisan rancor must now be put aside, and may God bless his stewardship of this country."

If you cant see the difference between this and what Trump is selling then you really do have your head so far up Trump's posterior that you are cut off from reality
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Rusty McFisticuffs
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whac3 wrote:
abadolato01 wrote:
If his concession is not required in reailty, he is simply exercising his right to free speech, no? It does not matter that the speech may be incendiary, or may, in some people's opinion, undermine the democratic process. Fomenting doubt in the democratic process by way of speech, may not be right in sompe peoples minds, but I would not go so far as to suggest that he does not have the right to do it. Now that, I would consider to be non-democratic.

As GC has said, it's the attacks on the foundations of democracy that are the problem, not his giving or not giving a concession speech.

Yeah. The question he dodged wasn't about whether he'd give a speech, it was whether he would accept the outcome of the election after saying it was rigged, that it was not a legitimate vote.
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Rusty McFisticuffs
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Drew1365 wrote:
Hillary (then a Senator from New York) refused to acknowledge the results two years later, and while she was secretary of State implied that Jeb helped his brother steal the election.

There are your people who, post-election, delegitimized the presidency.

Gosh, it does sound like Hillary did it too! Now, that first one--was her refusal a clear statement broadcast to millions of Americans, or was it a throwaway one-liner in private? I'm guessing it must be the former, if you're saying it's comparable to what Trump's doing.
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C Bazler
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Drew1365 wrote:
ohbalto wrote:
If he insists her presidency is illegitimate, well, that just gives the GOP something to bitch about for the next four years, and an excuse to obstruct everything she wants to do.

Oh, also, it's an insult to the country and everything we stand for. Yay.


20 members of the House refused to accept the results of the 2000 election when it came time for the House to certify the vote.

Hillary (then a Senator from New York) refused to acknowledge the results two years later, and while she was secretary of State implied that Jeb helped his brother steal the election.

There are your people who, post-election, delegitimized the presidency.

Who cares if The Donald will keep you in suspense. Who cares? Members of your party did and still do refuse to acknowledge the legitimacy of President George W. Bush.

Fainting couches are to your left.


That's weird. It was a long time ago, but for some reason I don't remember Al Gore claiming for weeks before the election that corruption in our government and media was going to deprive him of a win, and that the entire system was rigged against Democrats.

I'll tell you what: this year, if an electoral tie, broken only by one state's votes, which itself were determined by the difference of only a few hundred votes and a Supreme Court decision, leads to Hillary Clinton's win, I'll understand if Trump supporters express their disappointment, provided Trump graciously concedes the way Al Gore did.

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Chris Binkowski
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cbazler wrote:
I don't think it's his lack of concession but precisely his attempt to de-legitimize the Clinton Presidency that thwarts our democracy, by instilling doubts and paranoia about a rigged election in the populace. That is an extremely dangerous position to be promoting, and does directly represent a threat to the peaceful transference of power.

The moment our own people begin to doubt the fairness of our democratic process, our democracy is unquestionably damaged.


The perception of fairness in our democracy has already been damaged. Rigged elections is just the end of a long line of injustices.
 
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C Bazler
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Sarxis wrote:
cbazler wrote:
I don't think it's his lack of concession but precisely his attempt to de-legitimize the Clinton Presidency that thwarts our democracy, by instilling doubts and paranoia about a rigged election in the populace. That is an extremely dangerous position to be promoting, and does directly represent a threat to the peaceful transference of power.

The moment our own people begin to doubt the fairness of our democratic process, our democracy is unquestionably damaged.


The perception of fairness in our democracy has already been damaged. Rigged elections is just the end of a long line of injustices.


Yeah, I feel so bad for you disenfranchised Republicans. 248 Republican Representatives in the House and solid control of the Senate. How have you survived so long with such injustice?

It's bad enough Hillary is rigging the election. She has also rigged every poll, from every major news outlet (including Fox News), for the past several months. She's quite a powerful woman.

shake

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Drew
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Thanks for the rent-free space in your head. Would have been nice if you'd cleaned it up a bit before you rented it out, though.
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Heh. This was a fun thread to revisit, considering the post-election attempts to de-legitimize the Trump Presidency. It is, as mentioned above, "an extremely dangerous position to be promoting, and does directly represent a threat to the peaceful transference of power.

The moment our own people begin to doubt the fairness of our democratic process, our democracy is unquestionably damaged."


What a difference a month makes, eh?
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Robert Wesley
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Re: The Donald - "I will keep you in suspense now with Depends."
He will NOW keep you A-L-L: "in Depends"; for your repeated 'shat yourselves'-times from his 'occupancy' during the oncoming years. coal
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Rusty McFisticuffs
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Drew1365 wrote:
considering the post-election attempts to de-legitimize the Trump Presidency.

I see what you're saying, but I'm not sure I agree that changing his mind on each of his campaign promises is a deliberate attempt to de-legitimize his presidency.
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Oh my God They Banned Kenny
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Drew1365 wrote:
Heh. This was a fun thread to revisit, considering the post-election attempts to de-legitimize the Trump Presidency. It is, as mentioned above, "an extremely dangerous position to be promoting, and does directly represent a threat to the peaceful transference of power.

The moment our own people begin to doubt the fairness of our democratic process, our democracy is unquestionably damaged."


What a difference a month makes, eh?


It sure can be entertaining when reality shatters their carefully construction alt-reality and they're left scrambling to construct a new one.
 
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deadkenny wrote:
Drew1365 wrote:
Heh. This was a fun thread to revisit, considering the post-election attempts to de-legitimize the Trump Presidency. It is, as mentioned above, "an extremely dangerous position to be promoting, and does directly represent a threat to the peaceful transference of power.

The moment our own people begin to doubt the fairness of our democratic process, our democracy is unquestionably damaged."


What a difference a month makes, eh?


It sure can be entertaining when reality shatters their carefully construction alt-reality and they're left scrambling to construct a new one.

oh wait so clinton has NOT accepted the results of the election yet - my reality is indeed shattered
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Steve Cates
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What's really crazy is that he didn't even say he wouldn't accept it just that "I'll leave you in suspense." It's just a non-answer either way. That was considered a threat to democracy. Now the Trump's "not my president" movement is a celebration of democracy.
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Steve Cates
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ironcates wrote:
Now the Trump's "not my president" movement is a celebration of democracy.

yes - utilizing the right to protest is a celebration of democracy
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Steve Cates
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single sentences wrote:
ironcates wrote:
Now the Trump's "not my president" movement is a celebration of democracy.

yes - utilizing the right to protest is a celebration of democracy
Yes, I was pointing out the left's hypocritical position. I don't think Donald's comment was a threat to democracy.
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casey r lowe
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ironcates wrote:
Yes, I was pointing out the left's hypocritical position. I don't think Donald's comment was a threat to democracy.

it is only hypocritical if you think an ordinary citizen disagreeing with the election result is the same as the candidate disagreeing with it
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Robert Wesley
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Drew1365 wrote:
considering the post-election attempts to de-legitimize the Trump Presidency.
kuhrusty wrote:
I see what you're saying, but I'm not sure I agree that changing his mind on each of his campaign promises is a deliberate attempt to de-legitimize his presidency.
shake Pres.TRUMP had yet 'declared' DENYING that he was NOT either *Secret* nor OPENLY "Muslim"! surprise
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