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Black Orchestra» Forums » Rules

Subject: Question regarding Terminology rss

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Paulo Renato
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I run through Rahdo's Runthroughs and make right what once went wrong (via annotations)
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Hey again



In this card (or any other card with the same text) does the word Any mean all the Conspirators receive the benefit (or penalty) or does it mean that from all that can be affected we chose one to be affected?

The word ANY can be read in both ways in that context and my group played that everyone was affected but Rahdo played that only one was affected.

what is the correct way?

cheers
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James Mathias
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Any in this context means 1 of any of the conspirators.
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Paulo Renato
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jmathias wrote:
Any in this context means 1 of any of the conspirators.


It can be read both ways... really wish the terminology was written in a way that was 100% clear...

They could have easily said:
All if was for everyone
or
One conspirator if it was for just one!

then there would be no interpretation left to the players
 
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Game Salute
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Any is always meant as "choose one of the valid targets".
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Paulo Renato
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Game Salute wrote:
Any is always meant as "choose one of the valid targets".


thanks for the official confirmation
 
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James Mathias
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Muse23PT wrote:
jmathias wrote:
Any in this context means 1 of any of the conspirators.


It can be read both ways... really wish the terminology was written in a way that was 100% clear...

They could have easily said:
All if was for everyone
or
One conspirator if it was for just one!

then there would be no interpretation left to the players


In the context of the sentence "Lower the Suspicion of any conspirator in Berlin by 1" They are giving you an open choice from a specific group, Conspirators in Berlin. Of that group you may chose any one of them to lower their suspicion by 1. You cannot choose all of them.
 
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Paulo Renato
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jmathias wrote:
Muse23PT wrote:
jmathias wrote:
Any in this context means 1 of any of the conspirators.


It can be read both ways... really wish the terminology was written in a way that was 100% clear...

They could have easily said:
All if was for everyone
or
One conspirator if it was for just one!

then there would be no interpretation left to the players


In the context of the sentence "Lower the Suspicion of any conspirator in Berlin by 1" They are giving you an open choice from a specific group, Conspirators in Berlin. Of that group you may chose any one of them to lower their suspicion by 1. You cannot choose all of them.


Probably that's an easy thing for an English native speaker to infer... but for any (see what I did there? ) other person that English is not the mother language it can cause problems getting it the way it should be...

because it can easily be read both ways... If someone says "Any person in the Patio can have cake", to me it can be read that all the people that are in the Patio can have cake... it can also be read that you have to choose only one of the people in the Patio to have cake.

It would have been, at least to me, much more clear to write:
"Lower the Suspicion of A conspirator in Berlin by 1"
or
"Lower the Suspicion of One conspirator in Berlin by 1"

"Any" is vague and is open to interpretation
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Philip duBarry
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Good points, Paulo. See above for the "official" interpretation. However, if people do it the "wrong" way, it probably won't mess things up too badly.
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Paulo Renato
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pdubarry wrote:
Good points, Paulo. See above for the "official" interpretation. However, if people do it the "wrong" way, it probably won't mess things up too badly.


Thanks Philip
 
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Kiran Wagle
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Muse23PT wrote:
If someone says "Any person in the Patio can have cake", to me it can be read that all the people that are in the Patio can have cake... it can also be read that you have to choose only one of the people in the Patio to have cake.


Interesting. I suspect this is the difference between subject and object: "Any [or all] person[s] on the patio can have cake" vs "Take the cake from any [one] person on the patio." As a native English speaker, I would interpret the word 'any' differently if it was the subject rather than the object.

If a game said "take a coin from any player" would you think this means you get one from each player?

~ Kiran <entropy@prismnet.com>
 
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Paulo Renato
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KWagle wrote:
Muse23PT wrote:
If someone says "Any person in the Patio can have cake", to me it can be read that all the people that are in the Patio can have cake... it can also be read that you have to choose only one of the people in the Patio to have cake.


Interesting. I suspect this is the difference between subject and object: "Any [or all] person[s] on the patio can have cake" vs "Take the cake from any [one] person on the patio." As a native English speaker, I would interpret the word 'any' differently if it was the subject rather than the object.

If a game said "take a coin from any player" would you think this means you get one from each player?

~ Kiran <entropy@prismnet.com>


I would say it was a valid interpretation... I realize now that I might be wrong due to that whole subject and object grammatical view but like I said, if there's a way to write a rule that leaves no room for interpretation then write the rule that way.

Writing the Rule with the "ANY" instead of "A" or the clear "ONE" can be misleading, specially if you aren't a native speaker and that slight (but important difference) escapes you... I'm not saying that we can't read it the way it was supposed to, I'm saying that it leaves room to be read the way my group read it and it would be best if that was avoided
 
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Tim Kelly
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Muse23PT wrote:
KWagle wrote:
Muse23PT wrote:
If someone says "Any person in the Patio can have cake", to me it can be read that all the people that are in the Patio can have cake... it can also be read that you have to choose only one of the people in the Patio to have cake.


Interesting. I suspect this is the difference between subject and object: "Any [or all] person[s] on the patio can have cake" vs "Take the cake from any [one] person on the patio." As a native English speaker, I would interpret the word 'any' differently if it was the subject rather than the object.

If a game said "take a coin from any player" would you think this means you get one from each player?

~ Kiran <entropy@prismnet.com>


I would say it was a valid interpretation... I realize now that I might be wrong due to that whole subject and object grammatical view but like I said, if there's a way to write a rule that leaves no room for interpretation then write the rule that way.

Writing the Rule with the "ANY" instead of "A" or the clear "ONE" can be misleading, specially if you aren't a native speaker and that slight (but important difference) escapes you... I'm not saying that we can't read it the way it was supposed to, I'm saying that it leaves room to be read the way my group read it and it would be best if that was avoided


I would have had the same interpretation problems you had. Glad Philip and Game Salute are active here! Hoping to try this out on Thursday.
TK
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