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Trick of the Rails» Forums » General

Subject: "Soft Lying" and Kickstarter rss

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Mark Gilbertson
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... a question to those here and everywhere, who make excuses for and condone any form of deception, i.e. "soft lying": If you know that something is wrong and do nothing about it, is that still considered "a sin" in our current world? Is it even "wrong" anymore? Has it become "unreasonable" to ask why anyone would have anything to do with a person or company (Kickstarter?) that in essence has a disclaimer "we may or may not do what we say, we may or may not deliver what we promise to deliver, but don't worry, other than not getting what you paid for and were led to believe you were getting, it's a pretty good deal right, a pretty fun game, isn't it? In my 55 years of walking around on this space rock we call Earth, this has been the universally accepted definition of a "rip-off".

OK all of you Kickstarter apologists out there, how about agreeing to this "fair" deal between backers and sellers on Kickstarter before we decide to back or deliver any more Kickstarter projects from now on:

"We, the game designers/developers of Kickstarter, solemnly guarantee upon our word as people of integrity, that we will deliver what our campaign promises to deliver; [disclaimer: However, maybe and quite likely we won't, at least not up to the expectations we delivered in our campaign to sell you our project; and absolutely we will never tell you, the backers of our project, in advance, even when we know in advance of delivery, that we won't be fulfilling all of our promises (exact number to be determined); nor will we allow you the opportunity to accept or back out of our project, as you may decide is best for yourself, based on our neglect, inability, or unwillingness to deliver our project as we represented it to you, the backers of that project]."

"I, as backer of your project, promise to PAY you, the designers/developers, in full, for what you represent your project to be; [disclaimer: However, I may or may not pay you, depending upon whether or not I can convince myself that I'll be happy and satisfied with how closely what ends up in a box on my porch after many long months of patient anticipation actually resembles what I was led to believe it would by the designers/developers of the project]."

Graham Chapman said as King Arthur in Monty Python and the Holy Grail: "On second thought , let’s not go to Camelot. ‘Tis a silly place." Kickstarter now to me is Camelot, and we all get to decide whether to go there or to avoid it, using the knowledge and experience we have of the place. I'll not be going to Camelot or to Kickstarter any time soon,,,
 
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David E
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I think you are being a little melodramatic.

The publishers, in this case, should have been up front when they realized they wouldn't be able to fulfill one of the stretch goals. But this wasn't some scheme they planned to rip backers off - they just made a mistake. Their most serious error was in not communicating that immediately. I don't think it justifies the level of outrage you are trying to generate. (I am betting that an email to the publisher saying "Hey, I really wanted those linen cards and I am disappointed that you failed to deliver those - I would like my money back" would have gotten you a refund.) Nor does it justify treating Kickstarter in general as a snakepit.

If you've had this kind of thing happen to you repeatedly, then I can understand why you won't back any more Kickstarters, but I'll repeat what I said in the other thread, that you've either had extraordinary bad luck or have not exercised much judgment about what projects you back.
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Jason Begy
Canada
Montreal
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AmadanNaBriona wrote:
I think you are being a little melodramatic.

The publishers, in this case, should have been up front when they realized they wouldn't be able to fulfill one of the stretch goals. But this wasn't some scheme they planned to rip backers off - they just made a mistake. Their most serious error was in not communicating that immediately. I don't think it justifies the level of outrage you are trying to generate. (I am betting that an email to the publisher saying "Hey, I really wanted those linen cards and I am disappointed that you failed to deliver those - I would like my money back" would have gotten you a refund.) Nor does it justify treating Kickstarter in general as a snakepit.

If you've had this kind of thing happen to you repeatedly, then I can understand why you won't back any more Kickstarters, but I'll repeat what I said in the other thread, that you've either had extraordinary bad luck or have not exercised much judgment about what projects you back.


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adam wilson

Oklahoma
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I agree that they should have been more upfront about the mistake but I wouldn't call it a rip-off. The lack of a linen finish doesn't affect how the game plays. We are getting a good game at a great price way before most other people. Kickstarter isn't an online store. It's an opportunity to invest in a project.

I learned the hard way not to back high dollar projects simply because there are too many unknowns. I wasn't "ripped off", the product just didn't meet my expectations.

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David desJardins
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AmadanNaBriona wrote:
I think you are being a little melodramatic.


Replace "little" with "very".
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Michael Logan
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I don't blame Kickstarter for things like this, I blame whoever was in charge of a specific campaign. So if it becomes an "unacceptable" situation and nothing is done about it to my liking, I will be done with the person/publisher that is running the campaign (this will extend to non Kickstarter projects as well).
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Steve S
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Rockford
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Considering I have no idea what you're talking about (the linen finish somebody else mentioned, that I didn't even know the game was supposed to have?), I'm thinking this is not that big of a deal.
 
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Ugur Dönmez
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DaviddesJ wrote:
AmadanNaBriona wrote:
I think you are being a little melodramatic.


Replace "little" with "very".


"I think you are being a very melodramatic" ...what?
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