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Matt Chinn
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Ok so for those that don't frequent the ffg forums, or don't follow our squadrons play through log on that forum an interesting discussion started after our last HotAC session. One of our members (a gentleman with the call sign Slice) is flying a protectorate fighter, but he is now struggling to find upgrades that he actually wants to put on his ship (we are all around the 20exp mark) other than pilot skill and pilot abilities, now he has two mod slots filled he feels there are no more mods that fit the build he wants (light and fast interceptor).

So I put my tinkering hat on and came up with a slightly mad idea;

I'm proposing that Title cards be made available as Faction specific modifications, also limited to ships with the same size base

Now obviously this opens up alot of options, so I'm proposing that titles applied to ships other than than the one they were intended for cost double there listed cost, with a minimum cost of 3 to account for 0 point titles.

Now we will make the decision on this before our next session next week, but I would like some extra input from the wider community - incase anyone was wondering, we have already pushed HotAC well past what it was originally designed for as we are running a squadron of 8 players from all three factions, including 1 large base.

I look forward to peoples comments

Regards
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Jason Garman
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I wouldn't want to play this variant in my campaign, because it will almost certainly bring up some brokenly powerful combinations for very few points and I think mechanical balance is more fun than crazy, broken freedom. Off the top of my head, every Rebel gets an extra Elite slot from A-Wing title, every Scum ship gets a System slot from Starviper and barrel roll action from Mist Hunter, etc. But since you're already house-ruling so much it's hard to say you shouldn't change things up even more if everyone's having fun with it.

That said, since you can take multiples of Hull Upgrade and Shield Upgrade there are always worthwhile options for your Modification slots, so this doesn't really feel necessary.

Edit: I just noticed you've got Imperial ships too. Imperial titles would be insane together. Extra mod slot from Interceptor, discounted System slot from Advanced, two different amazing Defender titles, free evade action from the Advanced Prototype, a whole extra attack die from the TIE/sf. Holy cow, that is a lot of power to give to a small-base Imperial ship.
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Matt Chinn
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radfordblue wrote:
I wouldn't want to play this variant in my campaign, because it will almost certainly bring up some brokenly powerful combinations for very few points and I think mechanical balance is more fun than crazy, broken freedom. Off the top of my head, every Rebel gets an extra Elite slot from A-Wing title, every Scum ship gets a System slot from Starviper and barrel roll action from Mist Hunter, etc. But since you're already house-ruling so much it's hard to say you shouldn't change things up even more if everyone's having fun with it.

That said, since you can take multiples of Hull Upgrade and Shield Upgrade there are always worthwhile options for your Modification slots, so this doesn't really feel necessary.

Edit: I just noticed you've got Imperial ships too. Imperial titles would be insane together. Extra mod slot from Interceptor, discounted System slot from Advanced, two different amazing Defender titles, free evade action from the Advanced Prototype, a whole extra attack die from the TIE/sf. Holy cow, that is a lot of power to give to a small-base Imperial ship.


Hi Jason,

Thanks for the input, it does mirror some of our concerns as a group. Let mw address a few of them.

Multiple Modifications - according to the HotAC book mods are to be considered unique upgrades, so you cant take multiple shields/hull/stealth devices (if we are reading that rule wrong, please let us know)

uber-stacked ship - the extra titles cost more than normal, and as we are converting them to modifications you are still limited to the number of them on your ship (4 at PS9) and they are still competing with the normal (cheaper) modifications

Fundamentally we will take a vote as a squadron next week, but I'd like to continue the debate here to see if we can either;

1) come up with good arguments to leave things as they are

2) come up with a alternative that doesn't have quite as much impact on the game

3) decide that the idea is good, but the costs need adjusting for balance

4) decide to go with insanity and run with the idea as-is

Regards
 
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Dave Rathbun
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surak2014 wrote:
Multiple Modifications - according to the HotAC book mods are to be considered unique upgrades, so you cant take multiple shields/hull/stealth devices (if we are reading that rule wrong, please let us know)

This is specifically allowed in the rules, for these two modifications. The manual mentions buying multiple hull upgrades on page 12, and I believe the creator has included a FAQ that extended that to shield upgrades as well? I know we're running both hull and shield as allowing multiple copies.
 
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Matt Chinn
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A middle ground option that has literally just come into my head - how about limiting each player to 1 title from another ship (still counting as one of there 4 modifications, still costing double, with a minimum of 3 for the free titles)

Should curb the outright crazy builds whilst still opening up options?

Regards
 
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Jason Garman
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surak2014 wrote:
A middle ground option that has literally just come into my head - how about limiting each player to 1 title from another ship (still counting as one of there 4 modifications, still costing double, with a minimum of 3 for the free titles)

Should curb the outright crazy builds whilst still opening up options?


Limiting each ship to one extra title sounds like a good way to go, if you want to include titles as modifications. Keep in mind that the best titles are more powerful than modifications, so you're increasing how powerful the player ships can be. This might make the campaign too easy, unless you play on a higher difficulty level (ie, play as though you have more ships than you do, or at a higher PS than you really are).

One more tweak: I think that the titles that add an extra die to your attacks (ARC, TIE/sf, Jumpmaster) are too powerful for ships that have 3 or 4 dice naturally. I would recommend limiting those titles to ships that have less than 3 attack dice naturally.
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Matt Chinn
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Limiting the dice adding titles seems reasonable, but at the moment the jumpmaster title would cost 24pts AND only be available to our 1 large based ship IF that ship was a scum ship (and at that point why not just take a JM5k)
 
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Jason Garman
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surak2014 wrote:
Limiting the dice adding titles seems reasonable, but at the moment the jumpmaster title would cost 24pts AND only be available to our 1 large based ship IF that ship was a scum ship (and at that point why not just take a JM5k)


I totally agree. The ARC and TIE/sf are the ones that could cause issues. A 5-dice TIE Phantom would hit ridiculously hard for just 3 points.
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Matt Chinn
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radfordblue wrote:
surak2014 wrote:
Limiting the dice adding titles seems reasonable, but at the moment the jumpmaster title would cost 24pts AND only be available to our 1 large based ship IF that ship was a scum ship (and at that point why not just take a JM5k)


I totally agree. The ARC and TIE/sf are the ones that could cause issues. A 5-dice TIE Phantom would hit ridiculously hard for just 3 points.


Good point (I'm more of a scum player so I have a habit of forgetting some of the imperial stuff) I'm not sure I'll ban those titles out right, or boost the cost significantly

Regards
 
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