$18.00
GeekGold Bonus for All Supporters: 103.83

6,518 Supporters

$15 min for supporter badge & GeekGold bonus
41.1% of Goal | left

Support:

Recommend
6 
 Thumb up
 Hide
7 Posts

Pax Renaissance» Forums » Rules

Subject: The survivors of a religious war. rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Cole Wehrle
United States
Austin
Texas
flag msg tools
designer
"Work as if you live in the early days of a better nation"
mbmbmbmbmb
I think there may be a small contradiction in the rules.

In a Religious War, like any battle, the surviving pieces must move to the map card.

However, in at least two instances (bishops and neighboring believing knights), those pieces cannot move. Does this mean the map card might be empty in some instances when the aggressor wins?

Also, follow up question:
Here's the situation from last night. There was a single Reformation knight in Hungary and two Catholic Rooks in the HRC. There is a Reformation religious war (with one agent on the card). The only adjacent believer is the reformation knight in Hungary.

This means in the war you have 2v2, which seems like a wash that favors the defender. HOWEVER because the knight in Hungary cannot be taken as a casualty, it would seem that the Reformers win the day. Is this true? (and then, following the original question, would the believing knight in Hungary be moved to the HRC?)

Thanks!
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stefano Tine'
Italy
Genoa
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
Cole Wehrle wrote:
I think there may be a small contradiction in the rules.

In a Religious War, like any battle, the surviving pieces must move to the map card.

However, in at least two instances (bishops and neighboring believing knights), those pieces cannot move. Does this mean the map card might be empty in some instances when the aggressor wins?

Also, follow up question:
Here's the situation from last night. There was a single Reformation knight in Hungary and two Catholic Rooks in the HRC. There is a Reformation religious war (with one agent on the card). The only adjacent believer is the reformation knight in Hungary.

This means in the war you have 2v2, which seems like a wash that favors the defender. HOWEVER because the knight in Hungary cannot be taken as a casualty, it would seem that the Reformers win the day. Is this true? (and then, following the original question, would the believing knight in Hungary be moved to the HRC?)

Thanks!


Where does it says that adjacent knights used in a Religious War (or Campaign) can not be taken as casualties?

I think they can and so, in you example, the 2 Catholic Rooks and the agent in HRC as well as the the knight in Hungary are all killed, and the religious war would not be successful.

In answer to your original question, yes, it's always quite possible that as result of a one shot there is a regime change (or map card flip) but no ruling class left alive. For example in RW or Campaigns when at least one Knight from the invading empire is still standing. Or in Peasant's Revolts when only bordering concessions are still standing.



3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Marius van der Merwe
United States
St. George
Utah
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I am just learning the game myself, so take my interpretation for what it is worth.

Did you mean to say Rooks instead of Bishops? The rules say that Bishops never fight in battles.

Not all surviving pieces from a battle need to move to the target map card, only the surviving agents and repressed tokens used as attackers.

The way I understood the rules, and applying it to your example, the knight in HRC cannot move (as you note), but can be taken as a casualty. So the Agent and HRC Knight will both get removed as casualties (together with the two Catholic Knights) and the Reformers will not win the day.

Edit: Did not see that someone else replied before I did, but it looks as if we are in agreement.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rich James
United States
Plano
Texas
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
First, I'm not sure about your point regarding bishops. They don't fight in any battle.

Regarding the specific Reformation battle you described, it is indeed 2 v 2 and both sides lose 2 pieces. The Reformation knight in Hungary is killed. Had it been 2 v 1, you could have chosen to kill either the agent (if it was a valid attacker) or the knight. If you killed the knight, the agent could be placed on the conquered territory. If you had killed the agent, the knight stays where it was in Hungary, so potentially the HRE would be empty.

Edit: double Ninja'd! ninjaninja
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Cole Wehrle
United States
Austin
Texas
flag msg tools
designer
"Work as if you live in the early days of a better nation"
mbmbmbmbmb
Gotcha re: bishops. I'll find the rules citation re crusading adjacent Knight he e when I get w moment.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ken Sinn
Canada
Toronto
Ontario
flag msg tools
mbmb
As others have said, Bishops do not partake in the battle.

Yes, there will frequently be situations where a religious war will leave a newly-acquired kingdom completely defenseless.

In a 2v2, the defenders would win -- you always must have at least one surviving attacker.

Quote:
Glossary
Battle

The attacking Tokens are victorious if they have at least one survivor.


Neighbouring knights can be used as attackers during a religious war, and they can be chosen as casualties. They will not be moved as part of battle resolution.

Quote:
K. RELIGIOUS WARS
K1. Crusade, Reformation, or Jihad One-Shot.

These Agents, plus all Knights, Rooks, and Pirates on or bordering the Map Card of the same color as the color of the Agents of the card played, plus any Knights of the same color in Adjacent Empires (these Tokens do not move, but can inflict or be taken as casualties), are the attackers.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Andy Mesa
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
mooken wrote:
Neighbouring knights can be used as attackers during a religious war, and they can be chosen as casualties. They will not be moved as part of battle resolution.

Quote:
K. RELIGIOUS WARS
K1. Crusade, Reformation, or Jihad One-Shot.

These Agents, plus all Knights, Rooks, and Pirates on or bordering the Map Card of the same color as the color of the Agents of the card played, plus any Knights of the same color in Adjacent Empires (these Tokens do not move, but can inflict or be taken as casualties), are the attackers.

Ok, cool. I thought this was the case when Cole and I were discussing it yesterday morning.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.