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Subject: the feedback loop of the abuser (re: Trump & the RSP trolls) rss

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fightcitymayor
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As I perused my typical libertarian reading for the day (obviously wearing my top-hat & monocle & lighting expensive cigars with $100 bills) I came across this nice little article relating how the "You're making me do it!" excuse is the trick of abusers everywhere:

Quote:
One of the most common characteristics of abusers that I noticed when I worked with people with disabilities was the attitude that the client's resistance to the abuse was itself thought of as justification for the abuse. Once that feedback loop is established, control is justified through both acquiescence and resistance, and there's nothing the client can do (behavior wise) to escape. The same holds true for abusive relationships, prisons, police, or any other kind of authoritarian regime. The broader message is "Your resistance to my behavior is the reason I behave this way in the first place."

Remember this over the next four years when you hear the trope "See this is why Trump won."
If you call his appointees racist, that's why Trump won.
If you boo Mike Pence, that's why Trump won.
If you protest in the streets, that's why Trump won.
If you insult him or his supporters, that's why Trump won.
It's a rhetorical tool for neutering resistance. Always ask what function it serves.
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BJ
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You are full of poisonous refuse and insane foolishness.
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I had not supposed or expected your arrogant spirit to seek such a ridiculous and childish reason for lying; you should have better reasons.
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You're victim blaming.
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Dennis Mann
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fightcitymayor wrote:
As I perused my typical libertarian reading for the day (obviously wearing my top-hat & monocle & lighting expensive cigars with $100 bills) I came across this nice little article relating how the "You're making me do it!" excuse is the trick of abusers everywhere:

Quote:
One of the most common characteristics of abusers that I noticed when I worked with people with disabilities was the attitude that the client's resistance to the abuse was itself thought of as justification for the abuse. Once that feedback loop is established, control is justified through both acquiescence and resistance, and there's nothing the client can do (behavior wise) to escape. The same holds true for abusive relationships, prisons, police, or any other kind of authoritarian regime. The broader message is "Your resistance to my behavior is the reason I behave this way in the first place."

Remember this over the next four years when you hear the trope "See this is why Trump won."
If you call his appointees racist, that's why Trump won.
If you boo Mike Pence, that's why Trump won.
If you protest in the streets, that's why Trump won.
If you insult him or his supporters, that's why Trump won.
It's a rhetorical tool for neutering resistance. Always ask what function it serves.


The liberals would be much better served if they attempted to figure out why their Queen got hammered in the Electorial College count instead of bitching about conservatives.
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Trey Stone
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Lesson, "Stop being an asshole to people who disagree with you. Every time you do, give a fucks die by the bushel."
 
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Chris
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I like how the side that planted protesters at Trump rallies, hires professional protesters and is staging violent riots is accusing the other side of being abusive. Then says this: "Your resistance to my behavior is the reason I behave this way in the first place."

Oh the irony.
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bjlillo wrote:
You're victim blaming.


Haha, Juanita thumbed that. Do you feel dirty?
 
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Trey Stone
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galad2003 wrote:
I like how the side that planted protesters at Trump rallies, hires professional protesters and is staging violent riots is accusing the other side of being abusive. Then says this: "Your resistance to my behavior is the reason I behave this way in the first place."

Oh the irony.


"STOP MAKING ME HIT YOU AND BREAK YOUR STUFF!!!"
 
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fightcitymayor
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And right on cue, the first 4 responses are all from RSP rightwingers with whom the article has struck a very definite nerve.
I believe my work here is done for the day, so I will go back to my readings.

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casey r lowe
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tstone wrote:
Lesson, "Stop being an asshole to people who disagree with you. Every time you do, give a fucks die by the bushel."

that means you have committed give a fucks genocide
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Dennis Mann
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fightcitymayor wrote:
And right on cue, the first 4 responses are all from RSP rightwingers with whom the article has struck a very definite nerve.
I believe my work here is done for the day, so I will go back to my readings.



Bullshit. I am an avowed moderate, and **surprise***, I didn't vote for Trump. Nice attempt at stereotyping. (I supporting the Trump presidency, however, and I am glad that he won).
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Pontifex Maximus
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galad2003 wrote:
I like how the side that planted protesters at Trump rallies, hires professional protesters and is staging violent riots is accusing the other side of being abusive. Then says this: "Your resistance to my behavior is the reason I behave this way in the first place."

Oh the irony.


Let's see your side has the candidate who regularly lied about Muslims in order to whip up religious hatred against a religious minority. But yet you are the victim? Sorry, not our irony as much as your bigoted idiocy at work here
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Chris
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fightcitymayor wrote:
And right on cue, the first 4 responses are all from RSP rightwingers with whom the article has struck a very definite nerve.
I believe my work here is done for the day, so I will go back to my readings.



So you accuse right wingers of being abusive, we respond (because that is what one does in an internet forum)and you say you won because we responded....


Christ your side's brains have short circuited from Trump winning. Ok guys, no one on the right can respond until at least 4 people on the left respond from now on. shake

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Christopher Bird
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utoption2 wrote:
The liberals would be much better served if they attempted to figure out why their Queen got hammered in the Electorial College count instead of bitching about conservatives.


because the American electoral system is an anti-democratic institution that was designed to serve the needs of thirteen independent demi-nation-states that distrusted the ability of the general public to self-govern and believed they needed overwatch by elites, and as a result of institutional inertia has not changed from that

that was pretty easy, how about next we attempt to figure out why people like Coldplay
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Dennis Mann
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galad2003 wrote:
fightcitymayor wrote:
And right on cue, the first 4 responses are all from RSP rightwingers with whom the article has struck a very definite nerve.
I believe my work here is done for the day, so I will go back to my readings.



So you accuse right wingers of being abusive, we respond (because that is what one does in an internet forum)and you say you won because we responded....


Christ your side's brains have short circuited from Trump winning. Ok guys, no one on the right can respond until at least 4 people on the left respond from now on. shake



You're right Chris, we gotta be "Fair and Balanced." shake
 
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BJ
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You are full of poisonous refuse and insane foolishness.
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I had not supposed or expected your arrogant spirit to seek such a ridiculous and childish reason for lying; you should have better reasons.
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she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
You're victim blaming.


Haha, Juanita thumbed that. Do you feel dirty?


I don't know who Juanita is, so I guess not.
 
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Dennis Mann
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mightygodking wrote:
utoption2 wrote:
The liberals would be much better served if they attempted to figure out why their Queen got hammered in the Electorial College count instead of bitching about conservatives.


because the American electoral system is an anti-democratic institution that was designed to serve the needs of thirteen independent demi-nation-states that distrusted the ability of the general public to self-govern and believed they needed overwatch by elites, and as a result of institutional inertia has not changed from that

that was pretty easy, how about next we attempt to figure out why people like Coldplay


Let's simplify it, Christopher, since you missed the main point. Hillary and company (i.e. the Liberals and Hillary supporters) need to get off their high horses and quit bitching and figure out what factors led to losing the election according to the rules that everybody agreed to play by.
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bjlillo wrote:
she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
You're victim blaming.


Haha, Juanita thumbed that. Do you feel dirty?


I don't know who Juanita is, so I guess not.


Juanita is Junius. Dan committed a typo recently while typing on his phone so I have adopted it.
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BJ
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You are full of poisonous refuse and insane foolishness.
badge
I had not supposed or expected your arrogant spirit to seek such a ridiculous and childish reason for lying; you should have better reasons.
mbmbmbmbmb
she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
You're victim blaming.


Haha, Juanita thumbed that. Do you feel dirty?


I don't know who Juanita is, so I guess not.


Juanita is Junius. Dan committed a typo recently while typing on his phone so I have adopted it.


Ahh. The only Juanita I know is the pseudonym my dad gives to pollsters who call him. She's a transvestite, Mexican, Jill Stein voter.
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Bitter and Acerbic Harridan
bjlillo wrote:
she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
You're victim blaming.


Haha, Juanita thumbed that. Do you feel dirty?


I don't know who Juanita is, so I guess not.


Juanita is Junius. Dan committed a typo recently while typing on his phone so I have adopted it.


Ahh. The only Juanita I know is the pseudonym my dad gives to pollsters who call him. She's a transvestite, Mexican, Jill Stein voter.


Sounds like Junius.
 
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Dennis Mann
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she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
she2 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
You're victim blaming.


Haha, Juanita thumbed that. Do you feel dirty?


I don't know who Juanita is, so I guess not.


Juanita is Junius. Dan committed a typo recently while typing on his phone so I have adopted it.


Ahh. The only Juanita I know is the pseudonym my dad gives to pollsters who call him. She's a transvestite, Mexican, Jill Stein voter.


Sounds like Junius.


I should ask him directly, but let's see if I got this right:

Juanita = Junius = Trey = TS?
 
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Jasper
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mightygodking wrote:
that was pretty easy, how about next we attempt to figure out why people like Coldplay
Easy, they make middle of the road lowest common denominator shitty popsongs. People like that.
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Lee Fisher
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Venga2 wrote:
mightygodking wrote:
that was pretty easy, how about next we attempt to figure out why people like Coldplay
Easy, they make middle of the road lowest common denominator shitty popsongs. People like that.


I thought that was Nickelback.
 
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Jasper
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lfisher wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
mightygodking wrote:
that was pretty easy, how about next we attempt to figure out why people like Coldplay
Easy, they make middle of the road lowest common denominator shitty popsongs. People like that.


I thought that was Nickelback.
They're thick as flies on shite.
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Chris Binkowski
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Sorry if I spoke and quoted truth harshly here.

But if you ignore it, you'll wish for these days again once you see what comes after:

"If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God." Hebrews 10
 
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Christopher Bird
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utoption2 wrote:
Let's simplify it, Christopher, since you missed the main point. Hillary and company (i.e. the Liberals and Hillary supporters) need to get off their high horses and quit bitching and figure out what factors led to losing the election according to the rules that everybody agreed to play by.


First off, "everybody agreed" is kind of a stretch because the nature of institutional inertia is not so much "everybody agrees to do this" but rather "so long as a small minority of people refuse to change then people are stuck with it" - I mean, if you wanted to amend the Constitution to get rid of the Electoral College tomorrow, it could be blocked by the legislatures of the smallest thirteen states, which represent just under four and a half percent of the US population (and it likely would since the EC gives those states more power than they otherwise would have). If you want to instead suggest that it would instead be blocked by the thirteen smallest strongly-Republican states - since the current system strongly favours the GOP - then it's about six and a half percent instead. This is why RSP and pretty much every other political discussion group under the sun regularly acknowledges that the EC is stupid and antidemocratic but also that it's never going to change.

Second, I don't see that it's a matter of "high horses" to say that the current electoral system favours conservatives, because it does; the current liberal/conservative divide is also almost entirely an urban/rural divide, and the American electoral system favours rural voters, always has. Liberals prefer to live in cities and conservatives prefer to live in more rural areas, and that's fine, except for two basic facts: 1.) there are actually more liberals than conservatives and 2.) the American electoral system is designed to give rural voters more power (by virtue of the Electoral College and the Senate).

And third, this is the core problem with your premise: you're starting from the position that the game is rigged in favour of conservatives and liberals just have to deal with it and that's okay. You want to have a conversation about the Clinton campaign's failures, but the Clinton campaign's chief failure was "not getting an unprecedented amount of votes like Barack Obama did" because Hillary Clinton is currently leading in the popular vote count by approximately two million votes and will end up with a lead of in between two point five and three million votes. She will literally have gotten more votes for President than every white male Presidential candidate in history, but because she lost by about a combined 100,000 votes in Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania - IE, .0003% of the population.

As a result of this loss, which happens only because of rules that the right will generally admit are anti-democratic, the right is now saying "welp, tough, the game favours our positions, so now you libs gotta come to our side and give our positions that you disagree with support, even though there's, you know, less of us than you." These are, ironically, generally the same sort of people who disdain the concept of "privilege."

The right answer is for the left to say "no, fuck you."

(Incidentally, this should serve to remind us that Barack Obama was an insanely talented, once-in-a-generation politician. He didn't have to just win, he had to win by huge margins.)
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