Helen Holzgrafe
United States
San Jose
California
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I had four player aids posted here up until today.
Games Workshop required BGG to remove them without even noting what they were. They were player aids, not scans or anything that could allow anyone to recreate this game without purchasing it. They just made it easier to play.
This is a game long out of print and reborn as a Fantasy Flight game now. I urge you to try the new Fantasy Flight version of this game. Versions of these player aids for use with that game are posted there and welcomed by Fantasy Flight as a valuable addition to the experience of their Fury of Dracula.
I am sad that Games Workshop does not want fans for their early games anymore.
Contact me privately via Geekmail if you want to know about the missing aids.
-Helen
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Does GW have the right to have them removed? If FFG is now owner/distributor (an assumption on my part).. shouldn't it be up to them?
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Helen Holzgrafe
United States
San Jose
California
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Who knows. Read some of the other threads and geeklists regarding this issue as all player aids for all Games Workshop games were removed today. Most of these games are long out of print and the aids only helped GW. Somehow they don't see it that way, though.
FFG's Fury of Dracula is a different enough game and the artwork belongs to FFG. I don't expect my aid to be removed for that game. I don't think GW has any rights over FFG's Fury of Dracula.
I could be wrong, though.
-Helen
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Mike Banks
United States
Camp Hill
Pennsylvania
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Wow -- good move, GW.
That REALLY makes me want to get the game...
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Martin Smith
New Zealand
Wellington
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My two game aids for players of Chainsaw Warrior were also removed today, at the behest of GW. It just beggars comprehension, but says something about the company. Maybe they think we make money out of this stuff somehow ...
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Just payback for not voting Space Hulk number one I guess. (This is an obvious joke in case anyone is wondering)
Did they demand removal of any Space Hulk files? I see there are still a few there.
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Nick Case
England
Epsom
Surrey
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Ditto. I got a message saying that a crappy scan of my pretty worn counters for the first Dracula game had been removed at the request of Games Workshop.
Now correct me if I'm wrong but GW stopped publishing games about 20 years ago when they decided to concentrate on Space Ork 5,000 and all its little sibblings (or whatever). Why on earth should they give a Monkey's toss about poor quality images of a game that has been rewritten, revamped and reissued by another publisher where the original componants are effectively redundant.
As for removing player aids that aren't even in the original game, well that is just plain lunacy.
However Games Workshop are a big old enterprise with I'm sure an enormous budget for enforcing their will via legal action, so I definitely wouldn't want to upset them. Although I have all of the now removed files tucked up on my PC, I certainly wouldn't condone anyone mailing to request copies. You certainly shouldn't include your e-mail address in such a mail either. You won't be getting those files from me, I'm way too law abiding (I think that's enough).
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Andrew Hurp
United Kingdom
Aldershot
Hampshire
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Hmm, it does begger belief that they would demand the removal for old games that are now the equivilant of abandonware .. unless Space Hulk has had the effect that a lot of people have been hoping for - someone in GW going "Hmm, maybe we can shift copies of our old games ... better protect that IP, and work on new editions". In typical GW stlye, with the finesse of a sawn-off shotgun, it's a case of remove everything and don't judge anything on it's merits.
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Another factor is the fact that people who spend time playing old GW games aren't out buying new GW games.
The main issue with this sweeping legal action is that they seem to be demanding removal of things they don't have any right to. Either games they no longer own or play aids that don't infringe their copyright.
I for one wouldn't be surprised if someone packaged up every single thing that has been removed and put up a torrent.
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Nick Case
England
Epsom
Surrey
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Hivemind wrote: Another factor is the fact that people who spend time playing old GW games aren't out buying new GW games.
The main issue with this sweeping legal action is that they seem to be demanding removal of things they don't have any right to. Either games they no longer own or play aids that don't infringe their copyright.
I for one wouldn't be surprised if someone packaged up every single thing that has been removed and put up a torrent.
Agreed but what a shame that GW have such a piss poor collection to buy from these days (1?)
Now a Torrent would be a terrible thing for someone to do. That would have mean't that all this effort and bad feeling toward GW would have achieved absolutely nothing wouldn't it?
If someone did find it on Torrent or somewhere then they should flag it up here, just to let parents know not to let their children access such the URL by accident. Or something.
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Eric Jome
United States
Milwaukee
Wisconsin
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Standard practice for the defense of your copyrights is full court press whether you need it or not. It doesn't matter if you aren't interested in producing the game (or book or film or whatever) right now, you might be interested someday. So, for that day, if it were to ever come, you have to do everything you can to keep control now.
Like demand removal of all even possibly infringing materials. There's no need to go through them all and make a rational decision about which ones are not infringing. You just issue a legal threat via email to the site operators and they'll comply - because GW is a big, serious, effective business able to use the courts well. Threats are enough.
For those who've been following GW games for years, this is very, very common. Many websites have been shut down completely over the years in this same manner, for this same reason.
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Eric Brosius
United States
Needham Heights
Massachusetts
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Perhaps all the GW games should also be removed!
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United States
Fall River
Massachusetts
This is how I spent my supporter bonus Geek Gold. With more support I could have had both Over Texts.
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Unfortunately Eric Jome is right. By taking this action GW is maintaining their rights to the games, even if they choose not to produce them. Was there material there that could have passed muster as being legal to have posted, almost certainly. Does BGG have the resources to go through the material and fight this, apparently not. Or at least the will is not there to review the material, it is easier and cheaper to comply with the cease & desist order. I hope I'm wrong on this. Maybe it was easier to comply in the short run and fight to repost any material that passes muster later. We can only hope.
As to remove the games from the site I feel that it would be a mistake to not acknowledge the existence of the games. BGG is supposed to be the definitive source of board game knowledge, that would be hurt by such an action.
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Mark McEvoy
Canada
Ottawa-ish
Ontario
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But it is not unheard of for BGG to remove games entirely by designer/publisher request. Cardchess, Soccer Tactics World, and Ninja Galaxy are all games that have been, at some point, removed from the 'geek by designer request (only to eventually return).
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Eddie the Cranky Monkey
Canada
Edmonton
Alberta
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spizio wrote: BGG is supposed to be the definitive source of board game knowledge, that would be hurt by such an action.
Not any more then their reputation has already been slaughtered by removing non-copyright violating material created and uploaded by users because someone waved a stick at them.
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Was George Orwell an Optimist?
United States
Corvallis
Oregon
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My hand-typed copy of the official errata was removed. The game has a licensed 2nd edition out with an entirely different set of rules, and this edition has been out of print for two decades.
I think it is incredibly petty that GW should go out of their way to prevent lawful owners of the original game from seeing its errata.
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Marshall Miller
United States
Medford
Massachusetts
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I don't complain, I just no longer play their games. Too many other, more accommodating, publishers putting out too many good games to bother with GW. I've been buying a lot of Z-Man games lately I notice.
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Daniel Corban
Canada
Newmarket
Ontario
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Sphere wrote: My hand-typed copy of the official errata was removed. The game has a licensed 2nd edition out with an entirely different set of rules, and this edition has been out of print for two decades.
I think it is incredibly petty that GW should go out of their way to prevent lawful owners of the original game from seeing its errata.
I just came here to re-download that text file and it is gone. Total bullshit.
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MacGilleEathain
Scotland
Miyazaki, Japan (sometimes)
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Sphere wrote: My hand-typed copy of the official errata was removed. The game has a licensed 2nd edition out with an entirely different set of rules, and this edition has been out of print for two decades.
I think it is incredibly petty that GW should go out of their way to prevent lawful owners of the original game from seeing its errata.
Which errata, as far as I can determine, is not available on GW's own website. Talk about biting the hand that feeds.
"But that game is long out of print," they would no doubt argue. Begs the question: why, then, care so much about a hand-typed copy of its official errata and a few fan-created play aids posted to a site dedictated to preserving the memory of your long out of print game (essentially providing you with free advertising and outsourced customer support).
Proving once again that age-old adage: GW are a bunch of... of... well, you get the idea.
mac
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