Lee Ambolt
Sweden
Lund
Skåne
Ingen Reklam Tack!
Linus Per Ambolt 13.12.2010
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Well, this is a very nice game indeed, a LOT going on and very difficult to really keep track of everything and plan, especially as in 2P game, it ends quite quickly, at least the way we played! (think we were right to use 2 boards for 2 players, seemed like 1 board would have produced more interesting battles though). I know the genesis of this game and am a keen aquariast (very limited!) so really appreciate the theme of this and even though the end result is abstract, and could easily be mistaken for "pasted on theme", I can see that's not the case at all, the interactions are indeed very clever at replicating (in broad terms) how these systems work. Very nice indeed. 4 shrimps do not last long do they!
Anyway, a couple of questions, actually 3
1) shrimp moving
Was a bit confused by the way it is described, OK you can only have 2 shrimps per board, but whats the point of saying you can move your shrimp around anywhere but deep water or on another coral, or if you take it off the board you need an action 4 to put it back. Surely theres always loads of free space to put the shrimp if hes in the way, and I can see there might be clever ways to use the shrimp, the way its worded makes it sound like somehow the shrimp is limited, but it felt in reality like, duh... theres lots of places you can just pick the shrimp up if needed, but how often is it even needed? I just worried that there was something I was missing here...
2) bonus tiles
What are the bonus tiles for, at one point it sounded like they were to be used for the bonus growth space if you grow next to an empty starfish square, but then another sentence sounded like you get that tile from the stock if needed, but then yet another sentence said "in the unlikely event that colour isn't there, you don't place it". Well, with 5 bonus tiles, and 5 colours, how is it "unlikely" that one or more of the colours will be missing from that pile? Again, we felt like we might be missing something....
3) Why are the actions where you spend a cube to place tiles listed as "once only" but then they appear twice, why wasn't there only an action 2, that you could do twice. does this mean at some point the game was different and they just never changed it? Also what was the point of action9, do nothing, why didnt they save 2 squares on the card, andin the rules, and say "do any of these if you like, always do 1 first, and 8 last", with "spend a cube to place tiles as a x2"
again, was just worrying that we missed something
anyway, great game, difficult to think about, but enjoyable.
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Darin
United States
Holland
Michigan
I do not run and hide... I strategically maneuver.
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ldsdbomber wrote: Well, this is a very nice game indeed, a LOT going on and very difficult to really keep track of everything and plan, especially as in 2P game, it ends quite quickly, at least the way we played! (think we were right to use 2 boards for 2 players, seemed like 1 board would have produced more interesting battles though). I know the genesis of this game and am a keen aquariast (very limited!) so really appreciate the theme of this and even though the end result is abstract, and could easily be mistaken for "pasted on theme", I can see that's not the case at all, the interactions are indeed very clever at replicating (in broad terms) how these systems work. Very nice indeed. 4 shrimps do not last long do they!
Anyway, a couple of questions, actually 3
1) shrimp moving
Was a bit confused by the way it is described, OK you can only have 2 shrimps per board, but whats the point of saying you can move your shrimp around anywhere but deep water or on another coral, or if you take it off the board you need an action 4 to put it back. Surely theres always loads of free space to put the shrimp if hes in the way, and I can see there might be clever ways to use the shrimp, the way its worded makes it sound like somehow the shrimp is limited, but it felt in reality like, duh... theres lots of places you can just pick the shrimp up if needed, but how often is it even needed? I just worried that there was something I was missing here...
2) bonus tiles
What are the bonus tiles for, at one point it sounded like they were to be used for the bonus growth space if you grow next to an empty starfish square, but then another sentence sounded like you get that tile from the stock if needed, but then yet another sentence said "in the unlikely event that colour isn't there, you don't place it". Well, with 5 bonus tiles, and 5 colours, how is it "unlikely" that one or more of the colours will be missing from that pile? Again, we felt like we might be missing something....
3) Why are the actions where you spend a cube to place tiles listed as "once only" but then they appear twice, why wasn't there only an action 2, that you could do twice. does this mean at some point the game was different and they just never changed it? Also what was the point of action9, do nothing, why didnt they save 2 squares on the card, andin the rules, and say "do any of these if you like, always do 1 first, and 8 last", with "spend a cube to place tiles as a x2"
again, was just worrying that we missed something
anyway, great game, difficult to think about, but enjoyable.
It sounds as if you have most of it figured out. This game isn't that complicated, except for deciphering some of the rules!
1. I think you have it. Typically, you just move your shrimp aside, do some other actions, then move your shrimp back where you want it -- some time before you do action #10. Usually (always?), you aren't restricted due to lack of available spaces to put the shrimp temporarily.
2. Yes, you use the bonus growth tiles to fill the bonus spaces, but then you replenish from the stock as needed. (I never was sure why keeping them out was important, instead of just digging through the stock each time.) I think the only time you don't place a bonus tile is when there are none left in the stock (bag), but someone else may clarify that. It doesn't matter if none are left out by the board -- you just replenish if needed.
3. Yes, this always was very weird, but I think you've got it right. You can do the place larva/polyp action twice, with the same color or different color (actions #2 and #3). The #9 "do nothing" is just to indicate that all of the actions are optional -- but as you say, that's a weird way to put it.
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Van Willis
United States
Aurora
Colorado
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1) You are right, it is uncommon to be forced to remove a shrimp from the board(s).
2) Right again, it isn't very common for the bonus tiles to be depleted.
3) Separating the actions obviates any questions about being able to use other actions between the cube/tile placement actions.
The rules seem to be written the way that they are to cover all possible scenarios. The graphic design choices work fine for me, they spell out to me what I can and can't do without any extra questions.
Glad you are enjoying the game (and that you answered all of your own questions correctly!).
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Maarten D. de Jong
Netherlands
Zaandam
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ldsdbomber wrote: ... Surely theres always loads of free space to put the shrimp if hes in the way, and I can see there might be clever ways to use the shrimp, the way its worded makes it sound like somehow the shrimp is limited, but it felt in reality like, duh... theres lots of places you can just pick the shrimp up if needed, but how often is it even needed? I just worried that there was something I was missing here...
There are (rare) occasions where shrimp are forced off the board or you have you give up promising corals to accomodate their presence on the rocks, and that's not something you want to happen. You allow at most three other players to claim small to larger corals in the meantime.
Quote: What are the bonus tiles for, at one point it sounded like they were to be used for the bonus growth space if you grow next to an empty starfish square, but then another sentence sounded like you get that tile from the stock if needed, but then yet another sentence said "in the unlikely event that colour isn't there, you don't place it". Well, with 5 bonus tiles, and 5 colours, how is it "unlikely" that one or more of the colours will be missing from that pile? Again, we felt like we might be missing something....
Richard Breese has stated on one occasion he inserted rules to 'foolproof' them and to avoid rules questions from popping up. Although he didn't mention this paragraph, I'm sure it falls under the same heading.
You don't need to lay out the bonus tiles at all; you can just grab them from the supply when needed. With 40 tiles of each colour in play, it is hard to run the supply down to zero, and if such amounts are in circulation the bonus tile won't make that much difference anyway.
Quote: 3) Why are the actions where you spend a cube to place tiles listed as "once only" but then they appear twice, why wasn't there only an action 2...
Right now the actions on the cards are either 'do once' or 'do as often as you want'. Introducing an action you can do twice breaks this symmetry, even though it is all a bit far-fetched. Regrettably the somewhat clever idea of turning 'do nothing' into an action caused more questions than it sought to avoid in the first place as to most people it is rather counterintuitive to conaider doing nothing an actual action.
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Lee Ambolt
Sweden
Lund
Skåne
Ingen Reklam Tack!
Linus Per Ambolt 13.12.2010
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Thanks, maybe we did one thing wrong then because I think we randomly took 5 tiles from the bag as the bonus tiles, but maybe it should be 1 of each type of polyp tile, and hence "restocking" just means always keep 1 of each there (to save you rooting round in the bag), and just top it up (er, from the bag!) when you use one.
thanks guys....
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Tegs
Australia
Canberra
ACT
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ldsdbomber wrote: Thanks, maybe we did one thing wrong then because I think we randomly took 5 tiles from the bag as the bonus tiles, but maybe it should be 1 of each type of polyp tile, and hence "restocking" just means always keep 1 of each there (to save you rooting round in the bag), and just top it up (er, from the bag!) when you use one.
thanks guys....
Yeah, I think the 5 'bonus' tiles are just there to save you from having to root around in the bag during your turn, interrupting the flow of play. The 'rooting around' can be done by another player during your turn, or by you, after your turn is complete. Apart from that reason, I don't think it's necessary to have them available at all.
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J C Lawrence
United States
Campbell
California
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They change the tile-distribution in the bag and thus the probabilities of pulling some tiles.
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