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Subject: Should this game really get an expansion? rss

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Greetings Humans. I ask this question after a quick readthrough of the rules and some casual lurking of these forums. While an expansion of this game has been practically confirmed, pending commercial success, I just have to wonder how this game can be fleshed out anymore without bogging the game down. Really, the game does already seem fleshed out, with a humongous amout of tiles to use, and an amazing amount of variety and customizability in the mechanics. While yes, I agree the game could have a few more characters (not saying it NEEDS them), and the 3-4 player scenarios do seem like a necessary addition (which I realize are being worked on), these additions don't really seem enough to warrant a full-blown expansion. Heck, even the designer has said that the game is like "a base game and two expansions in one box", and I agree with that statement. I don't believe that the game can become that much more enjoyable through more expansions, as this game already has many mechanics, and adding more will just bog the game down IMO. I believe the designer should concentrate on making other great games rather than expanding this great game

BTW yes, I do post this topic partly because of my OCD-completionist nature, and don't really feel like buying a bunch of expansions for a game that doesn't really need them.

So what are your thoughts and comments?
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S G
United States
Essex Junction
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I've only played three scenarios, but my early impression is that Earth Reborn sets the bar for gaming value. It should have nearly unlimited longevity because of the rich gameplay arising from straightforward mechanics coupled with the scenario generator system.

In fact, there's so much here that it will take awhile for the gaming public to appreciate just how good this game is.

So I think it's too soon to talk of expansions. For the time being, they should just continue to support the game with the steady stream of materials they've been releasing.

As for expansions, I'd like to see new stuff that truly adds to the gaming experience. Not just "more" for the sake of quantity but things that further develop the Earth Reborn story and the gaming experience that goes along with that....

To be a little more specific, something like further developing the IPS system; this is what makes the game feel so "open" and should empower players to be thoughtful and creative. And a campaign system seems obvious; Earth Reborn deserves something like Descent's Road to Legend, especially as new and unique as Chris would surely make it....



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Puerto Rico
Puerto Rico
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I feel this game does not NEED and expansion. But if one comes I'll be happy to get more map tiles, characters, and equipment.

However if it would also be very cool to have another game from these guys as well. But only if it's similar to ER, but with a different theme (and developed with campaign play in mind maybe?). In any case it's super early to be talking about this. We should re-convene in 6 months.
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Joachim Pehl
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Hartattack916 wrote:
Really, the game does already seem fleshed out, with a humongous amout of tiles to use, and an amazing amount of variety and customizability in the mechanics. While yes, I agree the game could have a few more characters (not saying it NEEDS them), and the 3-4 player scenarios do seem like a necessary addition (which I realize are being worked on), these additions don't really seem enough to warrant a full-blown expansion. Heck, even the designer has said that the game is like "a base game and two expansions in one box", and I agree with that statement.



This is the only thing where the game really could make good use of an expansion.

It is a little boring that there are only two factions even in a 4 player game, two more factions with several characters would really benefit the game (and fitting mission cards). Anything else is not really necessary. Imo I don't know if I want more rooms/equipment since it would dilute the current pool.

Another good thing would be a Scenario book.
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Jared Voshall
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IMO, yes, this game should definitely have expansions. But not in the traditional boardgame sense.
I think that this game would do quite well going with a Miniatures-oriented release plan, where the base game is a complete game, and the expansions don't so much add to the base rules of the game as add more options using those rules. Personally, I feel the range of characters to select from is a touch light for this sort of game, and would definitely love to see at least two more factions, and another 3-4 characters per faction. I would also like to see a variety of other equipment and mission cards, as well as a handful more tiles (a cave set wouldn't be remiss, as well as a couple more specialized rooms), but I think the place where the game will start to sag first is in the character selection (you'll pretty much be seeing most characters in each play through, so you'll quickly learn what they can and can't do, and how they interact with the other characters).
Still, this is quite the awesome game, and definitely tops my list of tactical miniature games that I want to play.
Magius out.
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Joachim Pehl
Germany
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A nice bonus if they are going the miniature route is that, if they make the miniatures detachable from the base, they could print Earth Reborn/Dungeon Twister (mini) expansions. Chris Boehlinger wrote somewhere that they have the same scale. So they could sell 2-4 Minatures, include the same number of bases for both games and the appropriate cards. I assume that the costs of putting the bases and the additional cards there could be somehow negated by the larger print run if those packs works for both games. and probably a single player and 3-4 player scenario on the website for using the new minis.

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Guillermo Hernandez
United States
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I haven't played the game (I plan to). But after reading all the reviews, videos, rules, etc., the game should get expansions.

This game looks and feels like a tabletop miniature game. TTMG are evolving and living entities whose worth is judged on how robust the game is to expansions.
Plus, whenever you have a highly thematic and immersive setting, it just screams for expansion. Such systems are best enjoyed with storytelling potential and campaigns. In fact, that is kind of the purpose of making an Ameri-trash (or in the case French-trash) game.
Now, the French are renowned for creating some fabulous gaming universes, but are notoriously bad at said system maintnance and business.

Now, if the game itself is inherently unstable (i.e. any new characters, scenarios, abilities, make the game unbalanced) then it doesn't need and expansion and probably isn't a good game to begin.

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Guillermo Hernandez
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El Cuajinais wrote:
I feel this game does not NEED and expansion. But if one comes I'll be happy to get more map tiles, characters, and equipment.

However if it would also be very cool to have another game from these guys as well. But only if it's similar to ER, but with a different theme (and developed with campaign play in mind maybe?). In any case it's super early to be talking about this. We should re-convene in 6 months.


??? So why not just do that with Earth Reborn to begin with?
Another game, but similar. ???

So you want to play the same game but with a different dress.\?
Spartan Games does that with their three games; Firestorm Armada, Uncharted Seas, and Dystopian Wars.
They are all the same exact game, but different genres. Sci-Fi, Fantasy and Steam-Punk.
In fact, Uncharted Seas is the most satisfying and developed of the three and feels the most 3d and tangible. Which makes me think, "Why doesn't Spartan just focus on fixing and reinforcing the first game they put out?"


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J B
United Kingdom
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While not desperately required at the moment I could see 6 months down the road a thirst for some new minis growing + some new tiles to shake things up.

Possible new minis.

Norad
Some basic soldiers.
A Sargeant that provides some inspiration to the soldiers.
Maybe a Norad traitor?

Salemite
Some Zombies very basic soldiers maybe a little weaker on combat stats than the existing Zombie Soldiers but you can field more due to lower stats.
Maybe another Salemite unique of some sort.

Tiles
Maybe some bigger room tiles?
Maybe some more external tiles?

Hopefuly the game will take off and these sort of goodies will be produced. I am not terribly fussed about another faction for at least another year but would like to see one down the road. Some fleshing out of the existing ones would be fine for the meantime. A real easy expansion that could be done now is maybe offering some sort of tile pack based on the ones already available. This would allow those who wanted bigger maps to purchase extra tiles without the need for a base set all over again. I would also like to see uniques of different nationalities introduced. Yes I would like a male Brit as he could be me
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Vincent de Wildt
Netherlands
Beverwijk
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I don't see this game at all as a Miniature table top game. The miniatures could have easily been replaced with carton based characters like in arkham horror or dungeon twister I.

The game is so rich because of S.A.G.S, the search mechanism, the interactive board, the storyline behind it, etc, etc. The miniatures are a nice add, nothing more.

For an expansion I would like another faction rather then expanding the existing two. Yes, I know, new factions means new miniatures! But this should make the 3/4 player scenario's even more fun.
As I really liked the story in the scenario book it would be nice to give a nice background story of the new factions.

Also I think more of the same should create fresh new scenario's. So more interactive boardtiles, more items, more scenario goals.
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Brent Lloyd
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League City
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Yes, More Factions, Expand Existing Factions, More Room Tiles, More Story, Campaign System.

The Mechanics do not need more complexity, but the elements that interact with them do if the game is to survive.

Peace
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Jayson Stevens
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An expansion does not have to add new rules.

Intrigue doesn't add new rules to Dominion, for instance, just new cards.

Heroscape has dozens of expansions that are just new figures, no rules.

That being said, the most obvious (and necessary) expansion would be...

2 new factions, enabling true 4 player games, with accompanying scenarios.
More tiles and an expansion for the frame would likely help that.

More equipment and mission cards would be easy to add, especially ones tied to new characters.

A few more NORAD characters. only having 4 is pretty lame.
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Shawn Woods
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Quote:
Large Miniatures cover four map squares. Earth Reborn the
Basic Set contains the first Large Miniature: the powerful
Mammoth MK II, with more to come in future expansions.


I would like to see:
- more characters and miniatures (including another large miniature)
- another set of tiles with a different theme (we already have barracks and wasteland/outdoor), possibly sewers (seems logical since there are already inclusion of sewer entrances) on one side and headquarters on the other (similar to barracks but more of an organized/professional look)
- more equipment and mission cards

Overall, the extra tiles and miniatures would give me enough expansion to continue going for a long time. New tiles = new scenario opportunities. Players like us and I'm sure Ludically will be positing new scenarios online anyways. But it is the components that make them go longer. You can take extra characters for NORAD and Salemites from an expansion and create completely opposing 4 teams. However, I'm really good for anything. Could always do as with the Dungeon Twister scenarios, have small themed scenarios each with some more characters and tiles then provide an expansion focusing on a full 3/4 player expansion (2 extra factions).
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John Cobb
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Prepaint the minis and you got my
 
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Dillon Littlefield
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Just some ideas here:

As for new factions:

- Chinese (after all, they started the whole thing )
- Shadow Forces (adding this to the game just seems irresistible)
- Robot/cyborg (...?)

As for new settings:

- Greenpiece/Coogle floating city (or what's left of it)
- Sewers (already said, but would go well with an ocean city)
- Jungle/lush vegetation (to contrast with current outdoor mud environment)
- Space ship/station (lots of opportunity for cool rooms and escape pods and whatnot)

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Ukko Kaarto
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+1 for the campaign system. Since Mordheim/Necromunda there has not been a great minitures/boardgame with a real campaign system (Descent:RtL is probably great, but way TOO long). Continuity between games would be fantastic. For that reason if there would be a campaign pack with a third (and fourth?) faction, so everyone could pick their favourite.
 
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Scott Mellon
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Another vote for a campaign system like RtL, but hopefully a playtested one with some balance.

New factions, tiles, cards, etc. would also be great.
 
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PM Zen
United States
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Anything that's good - I want more of it.

I haven't gotten through all of the tutorial missions and I'm already hoping for some expansions. Forgive me if I am day dreaming here, but this is my wish list:

- More factions and characters, for sure. 12 more at least, including some low level thug types.
- Prepainted figures, although I am painting mine now.
- A campaign mode. That would be fantastic. My goal is to make an X-com type campaign with this game, with tech trees and researching, but that would require more characters, and allowing for character deaths. That brings me to . . .
- A character generator point system, so you can make your own characters and still be balanced. Maybe even get an app out to help with that, and that would allow you to print the stats out like the character cards, and then you could glue it to some cardboard. I know I am dreaming there, but I bet if there was a point system for creating characters, some enterprising programmer would work on that in their spare time.

-I would also like to see some map sheets printed on paper for some locations that might be worthy of revisiting, such as all those in the included scenarios. That way you could instantly play on the paper map instead of putting together all those tiles. The tiles are great, but for teaching new people on the first scenarios, I think having the maps would be good. Also, if you do any type of campaign, you might want to revisit some places. Paper would speed that up, and is pretty cheap component-wise.

- A few extra rules wouldn't hurt. Are there cover rules? Blow thru damage for someone standing behind a wall or door that just got riddled with bullets? Rules for animals (like guard dogs. No - cybernetically enhanced zombie guard dogs!) that wouldn't require 'commands' per se but act on instinct.
-More mechs.
-Battle suits/Power armor (now I'm just getting crazy, so I'll stop here).


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Dillon Littlefield
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PMZEN: I like the way you think. Unfortunately I don't think we'll be seeing any expansions as I don't think the game sold very well. However, the system could be easily used to make your own game if you were an ambitious game designer. Maybe if we're lucky, someone will design some new content for this game.
 
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Brett Stewart
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Dillosaur wrote:
PMZEN: I like the way you think. Unfortunately I don't think we'll be seeing any expansions as I don't think the game sold very well. However, the system could be easily used to make your own game if you were an ambitious game designer. Maybe if we're lucky, someone will design some new content for this game.

We'll see. Thanks to ZMan selling a bunch of copies at a serious discount this game is getting more attention. It is shooting up the rankings right now and if it were to make top 50 I can see this game getting the sales it needs. I still have hope for an expansion, but no matter what this is an excellent game just the way it is!
 
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Mik Svellov
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Brett_Stewart wrote:
We'll see. Thanks to ZMan selling a bunch of copies at a serious discount this game is getting more attention. It is shooting up the rankings right now and if it were to make top 50 I can see this game getting the sales it needs. I still have hope for an expansion, but no matter what this is an excellent game just the way it is!
Hm. Selling a bunch of copies of the base game at a serious discount doesn't usually lead to a succesful expansion...

Maybe it wasn't Z-man who sold those games at a discount, but the new owner who are getting rid of inventory?
 
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Robert Nicewander
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Chandler
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Great Dane wrote:
Brett_Stewart wrote:
We'll see. Thanks to ZMan selling a bunch of copies at a serious discount this game is getting more attention. It is shooting up the rankings right now and if it were to make top 50 I can see this game getting the sales it needs. I still have hope for an expansion, but no matter what this is an excellent game just the way it is!
Hm. Selling a bunch of copies of the base game at a serious discount doesn't usually lead to a succesful expansion...

Maybe it wasn't Z-man who sold those games at a discount, but the new owner who are getting rid of inventory?


That is not the case. Zev himself posted that he sold a bunch to Tanga to get the word out on EB, and that it seemed to have worked. He said the deal with Tanga was done before he sold the company.
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Scott Mellon
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My store tried to get a copy, and they said Alliance is sold out, so that bodes well for some expansions.
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Chris Bailey
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One character mini expansions would be cool. For instance maybe the Denzel Washington character from Book of Eli or the Road Warrior (Mad Max)
 
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Michael Cook
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California
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I'm just going to pretend I'm Chris Boelinger.


Hi! I'm Chris Boelinger! My new expansion for Earth Reborn will include..

-Radiated Terrain! Don't step on it, and certainly don't stay standing on it. Zombies need not heed this advice.
-A few new buildings, including radiated buildings, and the evil experimentation building for the Salemites!
-Two new factions, Greenpiece and Shadow Forces! Greenpiece favors complete outdoor tiles. Shadow Forces rely on the element of surprise!
-Three large miniatures, including the speeder bike (hope Lucasfilm doesn't sue us!), and a flying greenpiece tower.
-New Shadow Force character "Snake" allows you to do more damage when nobody has you in their line of sight!
-New TEAM S.A.G.S.! Team up with a friend and fight! Norads and Salemites versus Greenpiece and Shadow Forces? How about Shadow Forces and Norads together? The possibilities are endless! (okay not really)
-Revised rules on the Bazooka!!
-A total of 15 whopping characters! Two for Norad, 7 for Greenpiece, 5 for Shadow Forces, and One large miniature for Salemites.
-Can you say "LARGE ZOMBIE!?" Salemites resurrect and fuse many zombies together, making one really big zombie!
-New guns, new equipment.
-New scenarios that aren't tutorials!

-Revised Rulebook
-New Scenario Book
-More dice!
-3 large miniatures
-12 normal miniatures
-15 new character cards and tokens
-15 new equipment cards
-30 new mission cards
-3 new sheets of punchout tokens and tiles.
The first sheet has:
-20 Command Point tokens
-15 Character tokens
-Radiated Goo terrains to place on top of your tiles
The second and third sheets have:
-New buildings both indoor and outdoor reversible. All of these buildings are Greenpiece and Shadow Forces focused (so you'll see their MP cost is towards them, and not salemite or Norad).

All of this retails for $80. Who wants to buy it?
Note- I compared the price for the box and the contents, and my best guess is that all the contents above would cost about $80.
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