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Imperial» Forums » Rules

Subject: Some rules clarifications, mainly regarding "May/Must" rss

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Jason Martin
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So, we noticed that the rulebook and summary cards often contradict each other. In short, which of the rondel spaces are mandatory, and which are optional? Also, can you produce selectively, IE, produce units on 3/5 factories only?

The way we understood, the mandatory actions are:

Factory
Invest
Taxation

and the Optional ones are:
Manuever
Import

Is that correct?
 
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Carlos Ferreira
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Porto Salvo
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There are no mandatory actions. Where did you got that idea?
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Greg Berry
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Anjohl wrote:
So, we noticed that the rulebook and summary cards often contradict each other. In short, which of the rondel spaces are mandatory, and which are optional? Also, can you produce selectively, IE, produce units on 3/5 factories only?

The way we understood, the mandatory actions are:

Factory
Invest
Taxation

and the Optional ones are:
Manuever
Import

Is that correct?


There are no rondell spaces you must land a pawn on (except in 2030 version when the swiss bank player can force a player to stop on the investor space.)

If you pass by the investor space you perform steps 2 + 3 of the investor actions which include paying the player with the investor card and allowing players to buy bonds.

Why did you think there were mandatory places you had to land on?
 
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Jason Martin
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brainst0rm wrote:
There are no mandatory actions. Where did you got that idea?

I suspect I have been misunderstood. By mandatory, I mean that if you land on a space, you have to take the actiopn. Obviously, one can import 1-3 units, but can one import 0? Can one land on factory and NOT buy a factory?

Regarding my second question, can a nation with 5 factories produce 3 units instead of 5?
 
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Romain Jacques
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Anjohl wrote:
So, we noticed that the rulebook and summary cards often contradict each other. In short, which of the rondel spaces are mandatory, and which are optional? Also, can you produce selectively, IE, produce units on 3/5 factories only?

The way we understood, the mandatory actions are:

Factory
Invest
Taxation

and the Optional ones are:
Manuever
Import

Is that correct?


I think you are correct and I will add production as optional, since you can choose which factory produces, I think you can say that none produce.
 
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Greg Berry
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Romain wrote:
Anjohl wrote:
So, we noticed that the rulebook and summary cards often contradict each other. In short, which of the rondel spaces are mandatory, and which are optional? Also, can you produce selectively, IE, produce units on 3/5 factories only?

The way we understood, the mandatory actions are:

Factory
Invest
Taxation

and the Optional ones are:
Manuever
Import

Is that correct?


I think you are correct and I will add production as optional, since you can choose which factory produces, I think you can say that none produce.


You don't have to invest in aything either with investor so that is "optional" in that sense though you do have to pay the two dollars to the player with the investor card and allow appopriate players to buy something if they want to.
 
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Romain Jacques
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gberry wrote:
You don't have to invest in aything either with investor so that is "optional" in that sense though you do have to pay the two dollars to the player with the investor card and allow appopriate players to buy something if they want to.


You dont have to invest, but you must pay dividend even if there are not enough money in the country... So I will not call the action "invest" as optional.
 
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Jason Martin
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Romain wrote:
gberry wrote:
You don't have to invest in aything either with investor so that is "optional" in that sense though you do have to pay the two dollars to the player with the investor card and allow appopriate players to buy something if they want to.


You dont have to invest, but you must pay dividend even if there are not enough money in the country... So I will not call the action "invest" as optional.


Sure, but do you have to produce units? Do you have to build a factory? Which actions are mandatory, and which parts of them are? there are many times when you have no real move, if actions like factory and produce must be fulfilled completely.
 
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Romain Jacques
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As I said, I think you were correct when you asked the question in your first post,the only thing I did was to add production as an optional action.
To sumarize, if the marker of a country stop at:
Production : you decide to produce an unit or not for each factory and you can decide to produce none for all of them, so the action is optional.
Maneuver : you do not have to move any of your unit, so the action is optional.
Import : you can buy zero, one, two or three units, since zero is a legal choice, the action is optional.

Factory : you must build a factory, if there is not enough money in the country you must pay from your pocket, if you do not have the money you can not stop there. In the case where all 5 factories are already buildt, I do not know if you can still stop there doing nothing. The action is mandatory.

Invest : You must pay all dividends to all investors, if there is not enough money in the country you have to pay from your pocket. If there is not enough money to pay yourself, it is fine. The action is mandatory.

Taxation : You must increase the value of the country, give the good government bonus and give the extra money of your taxation to the country after paying your military units. The action is mandatory.

Note: every time you stop at or pass the invest space you trigger the investor card, the player with the card must receive 2 million $, may invest in any country and must give the card to the next player.
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Tim Schwarz
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Is production optional? My reading of the rules only gives the producer an option when there are not enough pieces to produce everywhere (i.e Austria produces in Vienna or Bohemia if there are not army pieces for both factories to produce).
 
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Romain Jacques
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Talltim wrote:
Is production optional? My reading of the rules only gives the producer an option when there are not enough pieces to produce everywhere (i.e Austria produces in Vienna or Bohemia if there are not army pieces for both factories to produce).


From Rio Grande rules page 6:
Production
Each armaments facility and shypyard of a nation may produce one army or one fleet respectively for free. [emphasis mine]
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Jason Martin
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Romain wrote:
As I said, I think you were correct when you asked the question in your first post,the only thing I did was to add production as an optional action.
To sumarize, if the marker of a country stop at:
Production : you decide to produce an unit or not for each factory and you can decide to produce none for all of them, so the action is optional.
Maneuver : you do not have to move any of your unit, so the action is optional.
Import : you can buy zero, one, two or three units, since zero is a legal choice, the action is optional.

Factory : you must build a factory, if there is not enough money in the country you must pay from your pocket, if you do not have the money you can not stop there. In the case where all 5 factories are already buildt, I do not know if you can still stop there doing nothing. The action is mandatory.

Invest : You must pay all dividends to all investors, if there is not enough money in the country you have to pay from your pocket. If there is not enough money to pay yourself, it is fine. The action is mandatory.

Taxation : You must increase the value of the country, give the good government bonus and give the extra money of your taxation to the country after paying your military units. The action is mandatory.

Note: every time you stop at or pass the invest space you trigger the investor card, the player with the card must receive 2 million $, may invest in any country and must give the card to the next player.


I suspect you are correct. Your interpretation makes the most sense to me, essentially just removing factory as a "dead space" move.
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Nate
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I think you might be reading into the "Factory" phase too much. According to the rulebook, "The nation is allowed to build one new factory." It doesn't state that it is required or mandatory. Of course they should've remained grammatically consistent and just said "may."
 
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Jason Martin
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moondeep wrote:
I think you might be reading into the "Factory" phase too much. According to the rulebook, "The nation is allowed to build one new factory." It doesn't state that it is required or mandatory. Of course they should've remained grammatically consistent and just said "may." :)


Ok, if that's the case, then only taxation and invest have mandatory actions. That makes a degree of sense, as having factory "blocked" as a space to land on if you are short on cash doesn't make a ton of sense.
 
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Babis Tsimoris
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why factory should be mandatory? I can't understand this
 
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Nate
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Babis,

Factory isn't mandatory. I think that's what we just agreed to per the wording of "is allowed".
 
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Gabriele Pezzato
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This whole discussion is so puzzling to me. Mandatory? Optional? I know you are talking about what is technically possible or not, but why would someone choose "maneuver" and do nothing? Or choose Production, or Import and then add no units? That seems just a way of wasting an operation. surprise
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J C Lawrence
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Such choices are common in the spin-cycle at the end of the game. They are typically made because the country does not have the funds to jump straight from Invest to Tax, or to slow the spin-cycle so that a different country hits the 25 first.
 
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