The Hotness
Games|People|Company
Dominion: Dark Ages
Fantastiqa
Mage Knight: Board Game
Mice and Mystics
Eclipse
Among the Stars
Collapsible D: The Final Minutes of the Titanic
Thunder Road
Agricola: All Creatures Big and Small
Lords of Waterdeep
Descent: Journeys in the Dark (Second Edition)
Dungeon Fighter
Virgin Queen
Skyline
The Lord of the Rings: The Card Game
A Game of Thrones: The Board Game (Second Edition)
Twilight Struggle
Dominion
Android: Netrunner
1989: Dawn of Freedom
Agricola
The Big Bang Theory: The Party Game
Total War
Arkham Horror
7 Wonders
Village
Dungeon Command: Sting of Lolth
Wrong Chemistry
The Castles of Burgundy
Ace of Spies
War of the Ring
Through the Ages: A Story of Civilization
Alien Frontiers
Ora et Labora
Le Havre
Kingdom Builder
Twilight Imperium (third edition)
Trajan
Glory to Rome
The Swarm
Race for the Galaxy
Caylus
Battlestar Galactica
Tammany Hall
Small World
Zombicide
Hawaii
Quarriors! Quarmageddon
Power Grid
Space Alert
Recommend
4 
 Thumb up
 Thumb up
3 Posts

No Thanks!» Forums » Strategy

Subject: Need strategy advice for a project rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Wolter Peterson
Netherlands

flag msg tools
Hi there,

For a research project, I am attempting to make a computer opponent for No-Thanks. This opponent should play in a way that closely mimics the way people play the game.
In order to do so I need to collect information on how gamers play No-Thanks. For this, I would like to ask you to answer some questions for me.

There are quite a few questions. You do not have to anwser all off them if you can't. Even answering a few/most of them will greatly help me. Answering more questions does mean more data for me, so I do encourage you to answer all questions.

Thank you,
Wolter

-----------------------------
The questions:

In your opinion, does it matter how many players are in a game? (I.e. do you use a different strategy for different numbers of players?

In what way does your strategy differ for different numbers of players?

If you play differently depending on the amount of players, please take 4 players as the number to base your answers on to the questions below.


Card preference.
What card(s) do you try to pick in the beginning? I.e. do you try to get a low card (10’s), a middle card (20’s) or a high card (30’s) to start with?

Why do you try to start with this card(s)?

How greedy do you tend to play? I.e. how often and how long do you let a card that would produce a sequence with cards you already have “ride” to get more chips on them from other players? What is your criterion for when to do so?

Do you (often) gamble on getting a sequence (e.g., taking the 23 when you have the 25)? What does your choice to do so depend on?

Do you block other players? I.e. do you take a card that is beneficial to another player? And if you do, what is your criterion for when to do so?

Are there other factors that play a role in deciding to take a card or pass on it. that you haven’t mentioned yet?

Next are a couple of questions about the chips.
How do you judge the number of chips currently on the card in the middle? (Pick one answer)
a.Not at all
b.Just an estimate (few, many)
c.Approximation (i.e. It has been round the table 3 times so there should be about 10-12 ships on there)
d.Counting the precise amount

How precisely do you keep track of the chips other players have? (Pick one answer)
a.Not at all
b.Just an estimate (few, many, nearly out)
e.Keeping track of the exact amount

Do you play differently when you are low on chips? If you do, please describe shortly how it is different

All other things being equal, how many chips have to be on a card with a certain value before you take it? With this value being:
5:
10:
15:
20:
25:
30:

Some general questions
How do you decide, after another player has taken the card, whether your earlier decision to pass on it was good or bad?

Does the strategy you use depend on the strategy of other players? I.e. do you play differently when your opponent(s) play risky compared to when they play conservative? (Being conservative is taking few cards and being risky is taking a lot of cards and hoping for a long sequence)

What, do you think, would be the biggest difference between a human player and a computer that “can play” the game?

Are there any other things related to strategies in the game you want to mention?

How much experience do you have with the game?
How Often do you play the game?
a. Hardly ever
b. Few times a year
c. Every month
d. Every week

How would you categorize your level of experience?
a. Expert
b. Intermediate
c. Novice
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Thumb up
  • Last edited Mon Oct 17, 2011 10:20 am (Total Number of Edits: 1)
  • Posted Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:50 am
    • Choose your Dice
      • Roll
      • Comment (Optional)
    • QuickReply
    •  
    • QuickQuote
    •  
    • Reply
    •  
    • Quote
Trudy Buwalda
Netherlands

mbmbmbmbmb
Wolter wrote:
Hi there,

For a research project, I am attempting to make a computer opponent for No-Thanks. This opponent should play in a way that closely mimics the way people play the game.
In order to do so I need to collect information on how gamers play No-Thanks. For this, I would like to ask you to answer some questions for me.

There are quite a few questions. You do not have to anwser all off them if you can't. Even answering a few/most of them will greatly help me. Answering more questions does mean more data for me, so I do encourage you to answer all questions.

Thank you,
Wolter

-----------------------------
The questions:

In your opinion, does it matter how many players are in a game? (I.e. do you use a different strategy for different numbers of players?

Yes, best nr is 4 in my opinion.

In what way does your strategy differ for different numbers of players?

Because the control you have over choices differs I sometimes find it easier to go another round.

If you play differently depending on the amount of players, please take 4 players as the number to base your answers on to the questions below.


Card preference.
What card(s) do you try to pick in the beginning? I.e. do you try to get a low card (10’s), a middle card (20’s) or a high card (30’s) to start with?

A fairly high card with as many coins as possible.

Why do you try to start with this card(s)?
Other high cards are often not interesting for other players, so they cna collect coins as well.

How greedy do you tend to play? I.e. how often and how long do you let a card that would produce a sequence with cards you already have “ride” to get more chips on them from other players? What is your criterion for when to do so?
I'm quite anxious: I'm affraid someone else will take 'my' card. Not really a criterion, more of a gut feeling.

Do you (often) gamble on getting a sequence (e.g., taking the 23 when you have the 25)? What does your choice to do so depend on?

Nope.

Do you block other players? I.e. do you take a card that is beneficial to another player? And if you do, what is your criterion for when to do so?

I did at the beginning. Not any more.

Are there other factors that play a role in deciding to take a card or pass on it. that you haven’t mentioned yet?

Next are a couple of questions about the chips.
How do you judge the number of chips currently on the card in the middle? (Pick one answer)

b.Just an estimate (few, many)
c.Approximation (i.e. It has been round the table 3 times so there should be about 10-12 ships on there)


How precisely do you keep track of the chips other players have? (Pick one answer)
a.Not at all

Sometimes you can see someone get nervous, that gives away they don't have that many chips left.

Do you play differently when you are low on chips? If you do, please describe shortly how it is different

I try to get a card with chips.

All other things being equal, how many chips have to be on a card with a certain value before you take it? With this value being:
5: 2,3
10: 4,5
15: 5,6
20: 6,7
25: 7,8
30: 10,11

Some general questions
How do you decide, after another player has taken the card, whether your earlier decision to pass on it was good or bad?
I don't get the question?

Does the strategy you use depend on the strategy of other players? I.e. do you play differently when your opponent(s) play risky compared to when they play conservative? (Being conservative is taking few cards and being risky is taking a lot of cards and hoping for a long sequence)

Yes, depends on how they play. If they get a lot of cards really early I'll probably sooner take a card.

What, do you think, would be the biggest difference between a human player and a computer that “can play” the game?
There's much going on that a computer couldn't do: the nerves when you're down to your last chips, sorting your cards in a way that other people have a harder time to check whether you have a straight etc.

Are there any other things related to strategies in the game you want to mention?

How much experience do you have with the game?
How Often do you play the game?

b. Few times a year


How would you categorize your level of experience?

c. Novice
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Thumb up
Linda Baldwin
United States
White Plains
New York
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Wolter wrote:
Hi there,

For a research project, I am attempting to make a computer opponent for No-Thanks. This opponent should play in a way that closely mimics the way people play the game.
In order to do so I need to collect information on how gamers play No-Thanks. For this, I would like to ask you to answer some questions for me.

Good luck! I'm a bit in awe of people who make AIs for games.

There are quite a few questions. You do not have to anwser all off them if you can't. Even answering a few/most of them will greatly help me. Answering more questions does mean more data for me, so I do encourage you to answer all questions.

Thank you,
Wolter

-----------------------------
The questions:

In your opinion, does it matter how many players are in a game? (I.e. do you use a different strategy for different numbers of players?

To some degree, yes. With fewer players, I accept that I'm going to take some cards, and I'm more likely to block an opponent's straight. In a larger field, I'm more likely to let someone else "take one for the team."

In what way does your strategy differ for different numbers of players?

With fewer players, I accept that I'm going to take some cards I don't want, and I'm more likely to block an opponent's straight. In a larger field, I'm more likely to let someone "take one for the team."

If you play differently depending on the amount of players, please take 4 players as the number to base your answers on to the questions below.


Card preference.
What card(s) do you try to pick in the beginning? I.e. do you try to get a low card (10’s), a middle card (20’s) or a high card (30’s) to start with?

I prefer to take a low card, if possible.

Why do you try to start with this card(s)?

I don't have a very sophisticated strategy, I just want fewer points.

How greedy do you tend to play? I.e. how often and how long do you let a card that would produce a sequence with cards you already have “ride” to get more chips on them from other players? What is your criterion for when to do so?

To make a sequence, I'm not too greedy. If it connects with two of my cards, I'll take it first time. If it connects with one, I might let it go around once, maybe twice if it's high enough.

Do you (often) gamble on getting a sequence (e.g., taking the 23 when you have the 25)? What does your choice to do so depend on?

Almost never, unless I'm very low on chips or it's a low card (or has a lot of chips on it.)

Do you block other players? I.e. do you take a card that is beneficial to another player? And if you do, what is your criterion for when to do so?

That depends on a combination of things -- size of the card, number of chips, my current points compared to everyone else's.

Are there other factors that play a role in deciding to take a card or pass on it. that you haven’t mentioned yet?

There's not much left!

Next are a couple of questions about the chips.
How do you judge the number of chips currently on the card in the middle? (Pick one answer)

c.Approximation (i.e. It has been round the table 3 times so there should be about 10-12 ships on there)

How precisely do you keep track of the chips other players have? (Pick one answer)

Not at all, really.

Do you play differently when you are low on chips? If you do, please describe shortly how it is different

Sure. I'm less particular about what I take, especially if it has chips on it.

All other things being equal, how many chips have to be on a card with a certain value before you take it? With this value being:
5: 0
10: 2 or 3
15: 4
20: 7
25: 9
30: 15


Some general questions
How do you decide, after another player has taken the card, whether your earlier decision to pass on it was good or bad?

If it improves their score more than it would have hurt mine. But what's done is done; I don't bother second guessing myself.

Does the strategy you use depend on the strategy of other players? I.e. do you play differently when your opponent(s) play risky compared to when they play conservative? (Being conservative is taking few cards and being risky is taking a lot of cards and hoping for a long sequence)

If somebody wants to gamble, I'll happily let them -- and then look to block a long sequence. If they're conservative, I might let a card I want (but don't desperately need) go around the table another time or two.

What, do you think, would be the biggest difference between a human player and a computer that “can play” the game?

Computers can study playing behavior, but they can't read faces, nor do they know the personalities of the other players. Also, many AIs become predictable, to the point that you can anticipate exactly which cards they'll pick up and when, and base your strategy accordingly.

Are there any other things related to strategies in the game you want to mention?

How much experience do you have with the game?
How Often do you play the game?

b. Few times a year

How would you categorize your level of experience?

b. Intermediate
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Thumb up
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.