Peter Karis
Finland
Helsinki
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Hi,
I'd really appreciate some good tips on how to go about beating the game with AH+DH+IH+KiY+LatT configuration. The game feels ridicilousy difficult, even to the point of being impossible. ...and we're not even using the Heralds or the sudden death Act cards from King in Yellow. 
We usually play in a group of 5-6 people.
It was possible to actually win the base game due to several reasons:
- There are only so many unstable locations, so after sealing a few there's a good chance a new gate would appear at a sealed location and is thus cancelled, so there's no new gate or Doom Token. Also a monster surge occurs frequently, which also equals 'no new Doom token, phew!'.
- The Unique Item deck only had so many cards, so finding at least a few of the four elder signs was actually quite probable, and this of course made sealing the gates easier.
- Less new gates and doom tokens means the players have more time to go after money, clues, blessings or weapons from random encounters or the shops.
But now, with the all the mentioned expansions (excluding Heralds and Act cards) here's how it goes:
- There's so many possible gate locations, that a new gate will open in almost every single Mythos phase. In fact, often several new gates will open in a single turn due to encounters. Although drawing a Mythos Card with a location that's sealed or already has a gate is possible, it is not very common at all. This means the Doom track and gate limit will fill up in no time.
- The Unique Item deck has loads of cards, but only the original four elder signs. This means we don't really ever get to see them, let alone use them.
- This could be just me, but it feels like the expansions add a lot of more devastating negative-effect encounter cards to all the decks.
- Because of new gates popping up and the doom track filling up at an alarming rate, the players will see themselves doing absolutely nothing but trying desperately to close the gates. There's no time to go shopping, gather clues, get healed, or do really anything that would benefit the players in the long run.
So, only some 7-8 turns into the game we often find ourselves with LESS health, sanity, items and weapons than what we started with. The great old one is knocking on the door, but we haven't really managed to get anywhere; most of the time has been spent either being delayed, hospitalised or otherwise caught up some hostile encounters or even cornered in a location for several turns by a monster. On top of this, the GOOs from the expansions are just insane, the only way you could possible hope to win one would be that you had all your investigators in full health and packed with clues and shotguns and magic swords from the Unique Item deck etc. But in reality everyone's pretty much already on the brink of dying by the time the GOO appears, so half the team gets wiped out during the initial attack, and the rest will soon follow.
So you catch the drift, yes? Is there some kind of strategy that would actually give us a fighting chance here? I do realise the game is not supposed to be too easy and all that, but since we love the theme and the atmosphere of the game it would be nice to know that it is at least possible to win - rather than starting every game with the spirit-dampening knowledge that we WILL be taking it up the arse once again...
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Rauli Kettunen
Finland
Oulu
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MacKaris wrote: - There's so many possible gate locations, that a new gate will open in almost every single Mythos phase. In fact, often several new gates will open in a single turn due to encounters. Although drawing a Mythos Card with a location that's sealed or already has a gate is possible, it is not very common at all. This means the Doom track and gate limit will fill up in no time.
This is one of the best parts about having DH + IH in the mix, no more "whew, monster surge, free turn from doomers" crap. I normally approach the game (-LatT, +DP (old) + BGotW) that I have 14 turns in which to get 6 seals on the board or the GOO wakes up from the doom track filling. Generally I get 0-2 surges per game, 0-1 bounces on seals, 0-2 gate bursts, rest of the turns are new gates opening. I solo with 4 investigators or we play 2+2 with my friend.
AH is about gates and sealing them, anything that doesn't contribute toward that is wasted time IMO, especially being a monster hunter. With my 4 investigators, each one is expected to be a jack of all trades, taking care of whatever monsters cross their path, sealing at least 1 gate each during the game, etc. Collect 5 Clues -> hit a gate, seal, head to look for more Clues.
Quote: - The Unique Item deck has loads of cards, but only the original four elder signs. This means we don't really ever get to see them, let alone use them.
This is a MUST for me. Base game, you have 4 ES in 39 (?) cards, my current setup has 4 ES in 98 cards, so even seeing 1 ES in a game feels truly special, not a "oh, another ES" like base game often had. For me any game with 2 or more ES tends to fall under the category too easy. As for sealing with Clues, I've won after sealing 8 gates (2 gate burst) all with Clues, so I know ES aren't needed.
Quote: So you catch the drift, yes? Is there some kind of strategy that would actually give us a fighting chance here? I do realise the game is not supposed to be too easy and all that, but since we love the theme and the atmosphere of the game it would be nice to know that it is at least possible to win - rather than starting every game with the spirit-dampening knowledge that we WILL be taking it up the arse once again...
Clues + gates, forget about everything else. Know which gates to go after for sealing, which can be just closed if gate limit is getting close. Two gates, one with a tough monster, other unguarded, dive into the unguarded, no point in risking a battle. If you're taking encounters at any location that you didn't collect Clue(s) from, you're doing it wrong for my money. Cash in trophies for more Clues at Science Building, maybe get a Blessing for the investigator heading into the OWs for the final seal, don't bother with Allies or Deputy. Clues win you the game. AH isn't about upgrading your investigators or having random Arkham Encounters, less encounters you face, the fewer chances you have of getting screwed.
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it's pronounced "em cee crispy"
United Kingdom
Basingstoke
Hampshire
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I agree with much of what Dam says - though I'd be prepared to lose the odd game through having a little more fun and a little less efficiency. There again, I play with 6 or 7 actual people around the table, so the social/co-op is likely to be more significant than playing solo or with one other. One day, I'll have a go solo, but I'll have to hog the only suitable surface in the house for several hours; my family of 5 others might not be pleased!
I couldn't tell from your post, but it almost sounds as though you went from Base to kitchen sink in one step. If you did, you might want to back out a bit and try again later. (I'd certainly recommend Base + DH + Lurker, or swap IH for DH, try adding the IH + DH as your last stage). If you have built up to the full monty then I'd say that you just need to do what you've been doing, but be utterly ruthless when it comes to Clues.
My standard advice is to decide who is going to seal the first gate and get them to 6 clues (one for "insurance") ASAP and only allow others to grab them if they're going to seal gates. When you have clues, don't spend them on anything that isn't either sealing a gate or preventing something happening that directly stops you sealing a gate (no, adding a turn to the process isn't enough to justify burning a clue, off to LiTaS you go!)
Grab the clues from the most unstable Locations first Spoiler (mouseover to reveal): (the player aid from Universal Head will help here - look in the files section) then work through the less stable locations and finally the almost stable locations.
Put seals on the very unstable locations as a priority and don't worry about the least unstable locations unless the gate limit is approaching - in which case seal if you can, close if you can't. This approach helps keep the Monsters at bay so you don't get distracted by the need to keep the streets clean.
With your team of 5-6, you have a little more leeway than Dam does with his team of 4, but only with regard to task flexibility (so somebody can be keeping the streets clean); you will have to keep your eye on the gate limit. Terror level isn't usually a consideration.
Don't, under any circumstances, introduce Miskatonic Horror to your mix until you've got a grip. Miskatonic completely changes the balance of the game to the point where you focus on sealing the quieter locations - because they are less likely to be hit by a gate burst. You just have to deal with spit loads of Monsters as a result of more monster surges on the highly unstable locations. Try it, you'll like it; but not until you're ready.
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James Gregory
United States
Texas
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To continue the discussion... better lifestyle choice suggestions in Arkham...
1. It's about sealing gates. Not about exploring, or wondering what an encounter at the Diner would be like. SEALING GATES.
2. After each Mythos card. Recap the situation... out loud. Two gates open, nobody in them, if we don't get someone in this turn... it could all be over. Yes, that's generally the situation at the end of turn 1. And if you are playing with double gate cards in the deck it can get worse. We have had MANY, MANY TIMES... three gates open at the end of turn 1.
3. Stop wasting clue tokens on stuff that doesn't matter (See Point 1).
4. If you have 6 Investigators... only have 3 collect clue tokens... the rest... they can gird themselves to clear the way for the others to enter gates.
5. "I can't seal a gate goes the cry..." Well send one of those non-clue collecting investigators in anyway to close it. Don't waste a guy who should be collecting... from not getting his quota. That's really the only two roles you need... those collecting 5-8 clue tokens to seal... and the rest... the other guys... the ones who have to sacrifice themselves so Diana Stanley can use her 6 Lore to seal a gate.
6. Professor Rice. 'nuf said (See Point 1).
7. Yes, clue tokens to bring in the Fed's is very worthwhile... if you can stock up Orange, and Purple early (before martial law)... so you can slip in at the end if you have to and Green out the Feds.
8. Don't get behind (See point 2).
9. Find Gate, and any spell that lets you evade should be gold in your mind.
10 Evade. Evade. Evade. The longer we play, the more often we seem to evade. Clue gatherers are about sealing gates... not about fighting... if they have to sure... but they have better things to do than engage cultists.
11. That being said, anything with a green border is probably worthwhile to kill it when you can (if you can...except the Druid... yawn).
12. Assume 50% of the Investigators will not make it through a gate and return in the minimum amount of time. Delays, Devouring, and LiTaS... oh my. We sometimes throw 2 investigators in a gate if the times are desperate enough.
13. Smart sacrifice that generates results is key.
Probably the biggest help I can suggest is point 2. Talk about the next three turns... what's the plan? Where are we going to be with regards to gates open, sealed, and closings.
We write down at the end of every turn the following. Gates open, Terror, Gates sealed, PS Completed (Either way), and Doom Tokens... and then... we discuss. Tough to get behind if you keep reminding yourself every 10 minutes where you are.
Finally, to back up McCrispy wrote... don't get too far ahead with the expansions if you haven't got a grip on team play. Pick YIG or someone else you like... and then pick your investigators... stack the deck in your favor (but not items)... get some wins under you belt... and then go random.
For clue collectors... think speed... anyone who is moving at 3... should not be a clue collector.
Hope there was a point or two that made sense to you. The game should be fun... but its about sealing gates... not exploring, or getting in touch with your inner Rambo/Doc Savage.
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Clint Herron
United States
Elkhart
Indiana
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Also, don't forget that for every big-box expansion you add, you increase the number of gates required to wake up the GOO -- I believe the details for this are in the rules at the beginning of Innsmouth.
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it's pronounced "em cee crispy"
United Kingdom
Basingstoke
Hampshire
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HanClinto wrote: Also, don't forget that for every big-box expansion you add, you increase the number of gates required to wake up the GOO -- I believe the details for this are in the rules at the beginning of Innsmouth. That's not quite how it works. What happens is you handle all limits as though there was one less investigator per additional expansion board after the first. That might increase the gate limit, depending on how many investigators you are playing with. Here's the relevant section of the rules Quote: The rules are unchanged when using more than one
expansion city, except that the number of players should be
counted as being one less for each expansion board in play
beyond the first. So, if six players are playing a game using
both Dunwich and Innsmouth (for a total of two expansion
cities), they are counted as having one less player, for a
total of five players. This modified number of players is
used for such things as the monster limit and the maximum
number of gates that can be open at once, and it reduces
the level of difficulty for the players since they have so
much more ground to cover.
This handicap may not drop the modified number of
players below one, and it is recommended that players play
with more investigators if it would do so.
Finally, if specifically using both Dunwich and Innsmouth
together, increase the number of gates that must be open at
the same time to awaken the Ancient One by one.
No special rules are required to use the smaller expansions
(e.g., Curse of the Dark Pharaoh or The King in Yellow)
in conjunction with the expansion cities.
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Peter Karis
Finland
Helsinki
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Thanks for all the tips. We actually gave it a go last night, focusing on the gates and gathering clues, and sealing only the highly unstable locations.
We won, hands down. 
...well maybe not quite hands down, and I have to say we did happen to have pretty much the optimum circumstances, with Azathoth as the GOO and I was playing the extremely powerful Patrice Hathaway the violinist. This together with some really good luck with the dice was a sure recipe for success.  Until next time...
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Posted Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:13 pm
