Don Barree
United States
New Jersey
General Bonkers says the War on String may be unwinnable. Detractors worry that his statements will embolden string.
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I've been considering playing this game PBEM after I get a little more experience with VASSAL and I was wondering if this title lends itself well to PBEM. I'd appreciate hearing from anyone whose played UKC using VASSAL or Cyberboard. There are other games that are probably better suited to email gaming but this is one I have an especially hard time getting to the table so I thought PBEM might be the way to go.
Thanks in advance for any responses.
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Chris Montgomery
United States
Joliet
Illinois
Dear Geek: Please insert the wittiest comment you can think of in this text pop-up. Then times it by seven.
The Coat of Arms of Clan Montgomery - Scotland. Yes, that's a woman with the head of a savage in her hand, and an anchor. No clue what it means, but it's cool.
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I'm in two PBEM games now, and it works reasonably well. There is a slight delay in the game when conducting interceptions, but otherwise, it flows just fine. The more difficult part, which plagues face-to-face play as well, is seeing the names of spaces - my opponents and I off-set the markers and counters so that the place names are visible.
Highly recommended if f-2-f opponents are scarce!
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Chris Stimpson
United States
Westminster
Colorado
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I'm also in a pbem game of UKC which is working well. The only oddity is that each player can see the other player's player card, so can see the strength of his opponent's brigades.
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Chris Montgomery
United States
Joliet
Illinois
Dear Geek: Please insert the wittiest comment you can think of in this text pop-up. Then times it by seven.
The Coat of Arms of Clan Montgomery - Scotland. Yes, that's a woman with the head of a savage in her hand, and an anchor. No clue what it means, but it's cool.
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I didn't know that the command displays are supposed to be secret information - I'm pretty sure the information on the command display is public. A quick scan of rules doesn't say anything about the displays being hidden that I have seen.
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Alpha Mastrano
Indonesia
Heidelberg
Victoria, Australia
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16.0 Fog Of War: You cannot examine your opponent's Brigades (on the Command Display, on the map or the stacks of unrecruited Brigades) except when laid out for Battle or when attempting to place a Siege Marker. You can request and require the number of Brigades in each Army (and your opponent must furnish this information), but not which Brigades and at what strength.
We put bombardment counters under each general to show how many brigades he has (and save some time!) and trust each other not to peek.
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Chris Montgomery
United States
Joliet
Illinois
Dear Geek: Please insert the wittiest comment you can think of in this text pop-up. Then times it by seven.
The Coat of Arms of Clan Montgomery - Scotland. Yes, that's a woman with the head of a savage in her hand, and an anchor. No clue what it means, but it's cool.
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Then I am surprised to see that the Vassal program allows you to see your opponent's display. Thanks!
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Alan Richbourg
United States
Arlington
Texas
I seez u be makin ur beeg move
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Starting my first ever Vassal game tomorrow, with Unhappy King Charles, after soloing it (without Vassal) this week. The Fog of War rule mentioned above seems pretty significant to me, so I think I'll use the screens at http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/46022/ukc-brigade-screens whenever I can play this face-to-face.
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Charles Vasey
Scotland
Mortlake, London
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cmontgo2 wrote: I'm in two PBEM games now, and it works reasonably well. There is a slight delay in the game when conducting interceptions, but otherwise, it flows just fine. The more difficult part, which plagues face-to-face play as well, is seeing the names of spaces - my opponents and I off-set the markers and counters so that the place names are visible.
Highly recommended if f-2-f opponents are scarce!
I've played many games and not knowing the names of my target areas has never plagued me, the same went for the testers. Where is it giving you difficulties?
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Charles Vasey
Scotland
Mortlake, London
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cmontgo2 wrote: Then I am surprised to see that the Vassal program allows you to see your opponent's display. Thanks!
I hate people looking at my counters, so I try and get it in the rules. some battles may only be explainable if both sides were a bit woozy on the other side's numbers (probably their own too).
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Charles Vasey
Scotland
Mortlake, London
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chargetheguns wrote: Starting my first ever Vassal game tomorrow, with Unhappy King Charles, after soloing it (without Vassal) this week. The Fog of War rule mentioned above seems pretty significant to me, so I think I'll use the screens at http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/46022/ukc-brigade-screens whenever I can play this face-to-face.
The idea of being able to see the chart (but not check the items) was it gave you a chance to verify Brigade numbers. The screens would prevent that. But whatever works for you is best.
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Charles Vasey
Scotland
Mortlake, London
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Charles Vasey wrote: cmontgo2 wrote: I'm in two PBEM games now, and it works reasonably well. There is a slight delay in the game when conducting interceptions, but otherwise, it flows just fine. The more difficult part, which plagues face-to-face play as well, is seeing the names of spaces - my opponents and I off-set the markers and counters so that the place names are visible.
Highly recommended if f-2-f opponents are scarce! I've played many games and not knowing the names of my target areas has never plagued me, the same went for the testers. Where is it giving you difficulties?
As Cromwell said "No one rises so high as he who knows not whither he is going".
Now that's historical design!(he lied)
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Chris Montgomery
United States
Joliet
Illinois
Dear Geek: Please insert the wittiest comment you can think of in this text pop-up. Then times it by seven.
The Coat of Arms of Clan Montgomery - Scotland. Yes, that's a woman with the head of a savage in her hand, and an anchor. No clue what it means, but it's cool.
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Charles Vasey wrote: cmontgo2 wrote: I'm in two PBEM games now, and it works reasonably well. There is a slight delay in the game when conducting interceptions, but otherwise, it flows just fine. The more difficult part, which plagues face-to-face play as well, is seeing the names of spaces - my opponents and I off-set the markers and counters so that the place names are visible.
Highly recommended if f-2-f opponents are scarce! I've played many games and not knowing the names of my target areas has never plagued me, the same went for the testers. Where is it giving you difficulties?
In a face-to-face game, it's not a problem at all, but in a Vassal log file, when your opponent moves a general, or a brigade, or anything, there is a log entry, and it usually identifies the move by space. So I find myself backing up and replaying the log until I can SEE the counter move on the map. Failing that, I have to go through each space until I find the one I am looking for.
This is as much a problem for PC conversion as it is for movement. When you hover over a space an a unit is present, the name of space appears and this is useful, but if there is no unit, then the PC marker obscures the name, and there is no pop-up.
So something as simple as my opponent saying "LN in X spaces raids W, Y, and Z spaces" will require me to zoom all the way out on the map to see as much of it as possible, then watch for what spaces flip as I advance the log file.
It's not a huge problem, but it would be nice to either have a hover pop-up for all the spaces on the map, or simply have the space names printed outside the space.
Thanks for an excellent game Charles - I feel like a nutter complaining about something like this, but it was the only real complaint I had with the Vassal Module.
Cheers.
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Alan Richbourg
United States
Arlington
Texas
I seez u be makin ur beeg move
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Charles Vasey wrote: chargetheguns wrote: Starting my first ever Vassal game tomorrow, with Unhappy King Charles, after soloing it (without Vassal) this week. The Fog of War rule mentioned above seems pretty significant to me, so I think I'll use the screens at http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/46022/ukc-brigade-screens whenever I can play this face-to-face. The idea of being able to see the chart (but not check the items) was it gave you a chance to verify Brigade numbers. The screens would prevent that. But whatever works for you is best.
I caught the Examine vs. Hidden distinction elsewhere on BGG after writing this, and assume that's why the Vassal mod has left all this revealed. However, I feel personally disadvantaged (and we can't have that now) if good eyesight is a useful skill, and I'm comfortable with double blind when face-to-face at least (as in 1805: Sea of Glory). I'm good therefore with Hidden and the thicker variety of Fog of War. At any rate it reduces the wasted time spent on squinting at my opponent's player card.
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Chris Stimpson
United States
Westminster
Colorado
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The way around this (and it's clunky, I know) would be for:
* each player to include in each logfile a current brigade count for each of his generals on the map, without specifying brigade value; eg:
Charles: 4
Rupert:3 + siege train
Byron: 2
reinf: Maurice
Unemployed: Newcastle + 1
* both players to agree not to even click on the other's Player Card button.
You'd think, though, that if the program can screen out each player's hand from the other, it could do the same for the Player Card.
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Charles Vasey
Scotland
Mortlake, London
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cmontgo2 wrote: Charles Vasey wrote: cmontgo2 wrote: I'm in two PBEM games now, and it works reasonably well. There is a slight delay in the game when conducting interceptions, but otherwise, it flows just fine. The more difficult part, which plagues face-to-face play as well, is seeing the names of spaces - my opponents and I off-set the markers and counters so that the place names are visible.
Highly recommended if f-2-f opponents are scarce! I've played many games and not knowing the names of my target areas has never plagued me, the same went for the testers. Where is it giving you difficulties? In a face-to-face game, it's not a problem at all, but in a Vassal log file, when your opponent moves a general, or a brigade, or anything, there is a log entry, and it usually identifies the move by space. So I find myself backing up and replaying the log until I can SEE the counter move on the map. Failing that, I have to go through each space until I find the one I am looking for. This is as much a problem for PC conversion as it is for movement. When you hover over a space an a unit is present, the name of space appears and this is useful, but if there is no unit, then the PC marker obscures the name, and there is no pop-up. So something as simple as my opponent saying "LN in X spaces raids W, Y, and Z spaces" will require me to zoom all the way out on the map to see as much of it as possible, then watch for what spaces flip as I advance the log file. It's not a huge problem, but it would be nice to either have a hover pop-up for all the spaces on the map, or simply have the space names printed outside the space. Thanks for an excellent game Charles - I feel like a nutter complaining about something like this, but it was the only real complaint I had with the Vassal Module. Cheers.
I'd not played it in VASSAL, but I do see the problem. Offset looks like the only answer.
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James Woodall
United States
Houston
Texas
Look like a guy with a plan?
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The module does have a little button that will hide the markers and leave the map open, if you need help looking for a location. I haven't really used it because this hasn't been that big of an issue.
I have however been cheating against Alan because I've ignored the Fog of Rule war in our PBEM game. Unfortunately I moved too far away for frequent face to face matches. In which I would definitely not cheat by looking through his markers, but would cheat in any other way possible should he leave the room. 
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Alan Richbourg
United States
Arlington
Texas
I seez u be makin ur beeg move
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some games have more Fog of Rule than others
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James Woodall
United States
Houston
Texas
Look like a guy with a plan?
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haha - indeed!
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Michael
United States
Fairfax Station
Virginia
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cstimpson wrote: The way around this (and it's clunky, I know) would be for:
* each player to include in each logfile a current brigade count for each of his generals on the map, without specifying brigade value; eg:
Charles: 4
Rupert:3 + siege train
Byron: 2
reinf: Maurice
Unemployed: Newcastle + 1
* both players to agree not to even click on the other's Player Card button.
You'd think, though, that if the program can screen out each player's hand from the other, it could do the same for the Player Card.
Another option is to allow for the units to be flipped just like cards with only the owner being able to flip them back. Then they could stay flipped (fogged out) on the player card and the other player could still see the number of the units with a LN or general.
I've posted this suggestion before and have even emailed GMT about, but never got a response. Joel, if he was inclined, could probably make the change in just a few minutes.
Either way, it's an amazing game and well worth playing on Vassal.
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General Bonkers says the War on String may be unwinnable. Detractors worry that his statements will embolden string.
