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Navegador» Forums » Strategy

Subject: How to defend against the Worker..Privilege...Building... Strategy? rss

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Don Brandt
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Ok....we played Navegador the other day and one of the players generally went with a worker....privilege....building strategy....with market thrown in with good measure. He pretty much wiped us out. There were 4 players total playing. Besides doing what he was doing to increase the price of buildings and taking just as many privileges, what is a good counter strategy that isn't doing the same thing?
 
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John Farrell
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Aspley
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What sort of building? Churches or shipyards? Where was he getting the money to fund it. Generally, the player to your right playing the same strategy as you will mess up all of your plans.
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Don Brandt
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He is buying churches and factories....funding with market and some with privileges. He bought no colonies, he never sailed and burned his ships to get to market quicker twice. Made big points on factory and church bonuses at end.
 
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Tony Bosca
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...probably burned the ships to get to the privileges?
 
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Tony Bosca
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Either way...

If he didn't have any colonies or never sailed, that's a lot of points out there to divvy up. Colonies, exploration tokens, shipyards, maxing out your workers or ships...

It sounds like you and the other players may have needed to get a few of those churches early on while they're cheap, for a whole host of reasons. If all of the other players kind of split up the other points it might not be enough for 4 of you, so you need to narrow your focus a little bit. Go really hard at something but also play a second "suit" as often it's your complimentary strategy that ends up earning you a decent swing if you do it better than the others.

Also, there could have been some seriously stingy market plays taken against him. Sometimes, although probably rarer than some "creative" players would like to admit, it might be ok to take less money in your dealings with the market to deprive someone of a windfall.

/.02

Hope that helps. Cheers!
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John Farrell
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If he was the only one doing factories he would have had way too much money, as all of the colonies people would have been feeding his strategy.
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Tony Bosca
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Friendless wrote:
If he was the only one doing factories he would have had way too much money, as all of the colonies people would have been feeding his strategy.


I can't really comment on this because I've never played a game (although I've never played with 5) where not one of the other players have considered scooping up a couple of factories....

as a side note, I don't think I've ever won without buying atleast one of everything... I may be wrong on that, but I doubt it.
 
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Tony Bosca
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Out of curiosity, how did the game end? under what condition?
 
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Tucker Taylor
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Friendless wrote:
If he was the only one doing factories he would have had way too much money, as all of the colonies people would have been feeding his strategy.

This. More generally, if you're the only person doing a given thing, you've got a pretty good shot at victory.

There's not really "a good counter stategy that isn't doing the same thing," because the way to stop something from being good in Navegador is to get more people doing it from pretty early on when things are still relatively cheap.
 
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Steve
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blakstar wrote:
Out of curiosity, how did the game end? under what condition?


I've only played this once (with three players). Does it really ever end with all the buildings being bought?

Had a similar thing happen in our game. One player got a church early, then forced phase 2 making it much more expensive for the others to get workers. We never caught up.
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John Farrell
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I think both times I've played it has threatened to end with the buildings being bought, but I don't know whether it actually has. It certainly could.
 
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Walther Gerdts
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Navegador was played for the European Championship of Boardgames in 2011 at Essen (more than 100 players participating). The majority of games there ended with all buildings being bought instead of exploring Nagasaki (although this also happened in cases). It certainly seems to be more likely with experienced players than with newbies.
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P. oeppel
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MacGerdts wrote:
The majority of games there ended with all buildings being bought instead of exploring Nagasaki (although this also happened in cases).


I can't remember what triggered the end in my last games. However, I do remember whichever condition was met first, the other one was very close as well (being in Macao with two ships when the last building was bought or similar).

(I guess you don't have any records about this for the tournament, right?)
 
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Nick Imholte
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I've played about 10 games of this so far, and it's about 50-50 between buildings and exploring to end the game. I'll iterate what others have said: The best strat is to do what no one else is doing. In an average 5 person game, 2 people should be focusing on each of the 5 categories in some combination. If 3 people are fighting over one type of thing, it will be harder on all of them.
 
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Steve
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It's hard for me to imagine that players would have enough Portubucks and workers to buy up all the factories, shipyards & churches. It's also hard to imagine overcoming an opponent's early church advantage since you need plenty of workers for any strategy.

However, as I mentioned earlier, I've played the game exactly once. Looking forward to figuring out things I can't yet imagine. If only this game were on http://boardgamearena.com or had an iPad implementation or something.
 
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Dave Eisen
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My experience has been that both game ending conditions are viable and that buying all the buildings happens a little more frequently than sailing to Nagasaki. Unlike other games of this nature, it's surprising how frequently we trigger one end game condition when the other one is not even close to being finished.

Yes, churches are great and the church/factory strategy is one of the stronger ones out of the box. But churches are expensive and it is hard to get this one started: someone could have done a lot of sailing by the time the church players have started getting their engine rolling.
 
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Kåre Dyvik
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Stavanger
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In one of our games, the end round was triggered by one player reaching Nagasaki, but during that final round, the last building was bought.
 
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Jeff Burgess
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nappeto wrote:
In one of our games, the end round was triggered by one player reaching Nagasaki, but during that final round, the last building was bought.


Played a 5p game this past weekend with the opposite result. 3 people had played 3 times, other two were new.

End condition was buildings being built and Nagasaki was explored during one players last turn.
 
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Aron F.
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done111 wrote:
He is buying churches and factories....funding with market and some with privileges. He bought no colonies, he never sailed and burned his ships to get to market quicker twice.


Wow, this sounds interesting.
At first it doesn't seem possible. The bottom half of the rondel contains Colonies/Privileges/Ships, and of those, only Privileges is useful.

Both colonies and buildings are limited by the number of people you own, and they are opposite each other on the Rondel. I think the purpose for that decision is to keep one person from focusing too much on one or the other.

But, by having cathedrals, it would be easy to skip over colonies/ships, and just do privileges every time, since you'll always have enough people.

I'm very intrigued by this idea. I'm definitely going to try it out sometime!
 
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Mc Jarvis
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You can't go for privileges and churches at the same time within the first few rounds of the rondel, so I suppose one thing you could do is to suck up whichever he doesn't do first. Priviledging costs a dude, and acquiring early churches requires a focus on building up your dudes.

I'll echo what others have said: if you're all focused on doing what he is not doing, then you are the reason he's winning. Navegador is about recognizing the strategies few people are employing and doing them. Doing what the person to your right is not is also very valuable.

Deciding what you will "go into" before seeing how the game plays out is generally foolish. If you don't adapt to the market you'll likely get crushed a fair amount.
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