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Mike Batty
United Kingdom
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My brother (Batz) bought Notre Dame for me and I'm very glad he did because I think it's a great game! I've only played it with two players and normally score in the 60's but I've also scored in the 70's about a dozen times and my highest score is 81.
After reading the articles on BGG I've concluded that there are some noteable differences between 2 player and 3+ player strategy. So without further ado, here are my thoughts on Notre Dame strategy with emphasis on 2 player games.
General strategy
In my opinion the general strategy of accumulating resources first and points later remains the same for 2 player games. My favourite strategy is to get 4-6 cubes into the Park by mid-game or to build up my cubes in the Residence. My score of 81 came when I was able to combine both of these strategies. On that occasion I managed to get all my cubes by the end of the second round of period A. To achieve this my moves were:
Period A
Round 1
- Trusted Friend to Cloister
- Carriage (cube and two points)
- Fool (Carriage to Cloister)
Round 2
- Cloister
- Cloister
- Minstrel (3 cubes from Cloister to Hospital)
That left me the rest of the game to collect the coins I needed and build up my cubes in the Residence. The cubes in the Bank were moved to the Park in Period B via the minstrel.
Normally I tend to avoid the prestige point people cards in favour of the resource cards in periods A and B.
Period A strategy
In a 2 player game I believe the order of importance for action cards is different than a 3+ player game. My order of preference when determining which action cards to keep in round 1 is as follows:
1. Hospital
2. Cloister
3. Bank
4. Trusted Friend (to Cloister)
5. Notre Dame
6. Carriage (for a cube and 2 points)
7. Park
8. Hotel
9. Residence
Building up a presence in the Hospital is very important because failing to do so will thwart your plans to accumulate cubes and coins. Getting 3-4 cubes into the hospital as early as possible will mean that rats will rarely be a problem. I prefer to keep the Trusted Friend out of the Hospital if it can be avoided because, if placed in the Hospital, he tends to remain tied up for the rest of the game.
Each section of your borough becomes more powerful with the number of cubes added. It is for this reason why I place the acquisition of cubes over coins. Once you've exhausted the general cube supply you can then move the redundant Cloister cubes via the Minstrel.
If I'm concentrating on acquiring cubes then I will normally pay the Money Lender to keep a healthy coin supply. During the game I will aim to obtain 12 coins (enough to pay nine people cards and three Notre Dame moves). If I manage to obtain more than 12 coins then that is a bonus because I can donate more money to Notre Dame later in the game.
The reason why I placed the Notre Dame card fifth on the list in a 2 player game is for the following reason. If you choose to give away Notre Dame then you sacrifice all influence over this action. Your opponent has the freedom to keep your Notre Dame card and play it or wait for their own to be drawn on a subsequent round. Either way, they can keep you out by holding onto both Notre Dame cards.
My final thought for period A concerns the Park. I don't like playing this in the first round because you reduce its value by being unable to move the rat counter back. I prefer to move cubes to the Park later in the game and if I can get one cube into this section by the middle of Period B I'm happy.
Period B strategy
I like to look on period B as a transition between accumulating resources and points. By this point in the game your resource situation will largely have been determined by the order of the action cards. If you still need a resource in period B you don't need to panic because I believe the action cards for this period are the weakest in terms of points. Even if the Guild Master or Beggar King offer 6+ points I will normally pay the Minstrel over them.
Period B is my favourite time to use the Minstrel and when he appears during the same round as the Advocat I rub my hands in delight! The Advocat is my least favourite person card because he will rarely offer more than three points. Forgoing any of the grey period B person cards in favour of the Minstrel will normally pay dividends by the end of the game. Placing three redundant cubes from the Cloister/Bank into the Park via the Minstrel will give you a handsome return. If you managed to get a single cube into the Park earlier in the game it will bring the total up to four. For the remainder of the game you will then get a 2 point bonus every time you collect points. As the emphasis swings strongly towards gathering points in period C then this bonus will soon overtake the points you declined from the Beggar King/Guild Merchant.
Period C strategy
Period C is when your patience pays off and where you earn the majority of your points. If you have concentrated on accumulating resources up to this point and used the Minstrel then you should have 3+ cubes in the Park and Hospital. Normally you will also have 3+ cubes in another section or will have once the first round of actions are complete. It is for this reason why you should bear in mind the Mayor person card as early as the beginning of period B. I always aim to have 3 sections containing at least 3 cubes by this point to give me 9 points plus bonuses when the Mayor is played.
In a 2 player game I think it is a lot easier to predict which action cards your opponent will reject. If they haven't concentrated on accumulating resources then they will often return to you the Residence and Carriage. If they have accumulated resources then a quick glance towards their borough should tell you which cards they are likely to keep. It's normally very difficult for your opponent to prevent you from pursuing a Residence or Carriage end game strategy and simultaneously look after their own affairs. Therefore looking at their borough will determine whether to go for the Residence or Carriage.
So there we have my thoughts on what I think is a terrific game. Luck does play a part but the variety of strategies on offer normally allows you to salvage something with good play. Even when you do get a bad run of cards its always fun trying to make the best of the situation while frantically trying to keep everything under control!
Mike
PS My brother is:
Ian B
United Kingdom
Edinburgh
Scotland
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peter mumford
United States
Somerville
Massachusetts
ceci n'est pas une pipe
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Very impressive strategy piece.
Do you see any value in the hotel, or is that just a sort of booby prize if you are stuck?
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It's funny, after we talked about it, Peter, I tried a Hotel strategy with Anna, getting four cubes on it. Seemed to work for a while there. I did end up winning.
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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Notre Dame is one of my favorite games. It's not easy to play well, particularly for new players.
The Hotel is decidedly a booby prize. Cary what were your scores in that game? I can't imagine they were very high. Win or lose, the hotel is by far the worst location.
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High 50's. Note, we played with the expansion cards.
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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Yea, don't get mad at me, but that's pretty low for a winning score.
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Yeah, but again, the expansion changes it up a bit.
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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Were you using only expansion cards or did you mix them in randomly? We haven't found it to have that much of an effect, but I admit to not playing as much with the expansion, and I mix mine in.
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Mix. Also, Anna and I were both playing a very heavy denial game.
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Posted Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:01 pm
