Jeremy Kidder
United States
Martensdale
Iowa
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I was playing a four player game late last night and well into a long action chain the player after me drew and played smugglers. The thing is that they had forgotten what I had bought.
Am I obligated to tell them what I purchased (it was a duchy)?
Can they just guess at what I bought until they get it right?
How are we to proceed?
I know this scenario will not happen often for most players, but it has already happened twice in the last week with the people I play with.
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Smugglers is mandatory; if they play it, they are required to gain a card (if a legal target exists) and do not have the option of choosing to gain nothing instead. So when they play Smugglers, you have two options: either tell them what you bought, or stop playing the game right there, since it can't legally proceed any further. I think most people will agree that the former is generally considered proper etiquette and the latter is the height of poor sportsmanship.
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Pere
Spain
La Nucia
Alicante
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But do you have to answer when asked before playing the Smugglers?
- Sorry, I was daydreaming; what did you gain last turn?
- A Province and a Curse! Boy, what a convoluted strategy!
- Guess I won't be playing my Smugglers this turn.
- Sorry, I was daydreaming; what did you gain last turn?
- Cards.
- Can you be more specific?
- Cards from the supply?
- Smugglers, then.
- HA! Enjoy your Curse, sucker!
Is 'cards costing less than $6 gained by my opponent on his last turn' public information?
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Rick Teverbaugh
United States
Anderson
Indiana
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senseless wrote: But do you have to answer when asked before playing the Smugglers?
- Sorry, I was daydreaming; what did you gain last turn?
- A Province and a Curse! Boy, what a convoluted strategy!
- Guess I won't be playing my Smugglers this turn.
- Sorry, I was daydreaming; what did you gain last turn?
- Cards.
- Can you be more specific?
- Cards from the supply?
- Smugglers, then.
- HA! Enjoy your Curse, sucker!
Is 'cards costing less than $6 gained by my opponent on his last turn' public information?
Unless I was in a tournament where something like a trip to Essen was at stake, I'd tell them. It is, after all, a game.
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Nate Cannon
United States
Garland
Texas
I came. I saw.
I lost miserably.
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senseless wrote: Is 'cards costing less than $6 gained by my opponent on his last turn' public information?
The rules state that players are supposed to talk through their turn to let others know what they are doing. Thus, any cards gained are public information.
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Adrian Brooks
United Kingdom
Rugby
Warwickshire
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senseless wrote: But do you have to answer when asked before playing the Smugglers?
Is 'cards costing less than $6 gained by my opponent on his last turn' public information?
Assuming you played properly, and announced your actions as you played, there's nothing in the rules which forces you to tell him again until he plays smugglers, at which point you must.
I'd probably say "Pay attention next time", and tell him; thereafter, I wouldn't.
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Dennison Milenkaya
United States
Washington
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Man, I suggest just leaving Smugglers in the box. You won't miss anything, unless you like playing a strategy game without strategy.
The idea that someone would play Smugglers just to get anything is really weird since adding some random card to a deck is not strategic at all; what's good in this guy's deck might be bad in that guy's deck. Divorce yourself from hoarder mentality!
The top ten problems that I find with Smugglers are:
1. Piles just empty for no great reason.
2. People play some strange Frankenstein facsimile of a strategy instead of playing well.
3. You can build a strong deck capable of buying a couple Golds early on or you can just buy a couple of Smugglers and wait.
4. You will be a little hesitant to buy Gold for you deck, knowing there is a chance that
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Tim Stellmach
United States
Arlington
Massachusetts
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FlatOnHisFace wrote: The top ten problems that I find with Smugglers are:
1. Piles just empty for no great reason.
2. People play some strange Frankenstein facsimile of a strategy instead of playing well.
Those sound like problems with the people you play with. They apparently suck at Dominion.
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Freelance Police
United States
Palo Alto
California
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FlatOnHisFace wrote: 2. People play some strange Frankenstein facsimile of a strategy instead of playing well.
Darn, it! Why does every Dominion thread have to degenerate into a strategy discussion? 
* Your main question is whether to buy Smugglers or Silver. Since Smugglers is a terminal action, it's much less desirable if no +Action cards are on the table.
* Smugglers is less reliable than Silver. Assuming you're going Big Money, you're going to buy more Treasure than terminal actions, which means you're more likely to buy more Silver than Smugglers.
* OTOH, If you have +Actions and +Cards, and the other player is playing a similar strategy, Smugglersn can supplement your strategy. I had a Throne Room and Smugglers, so picked up two copies of Ambassador. We also had Ill-Gotten Gains and a four-player game, so we used Ambassadors to throw Curses around left and right.
Quote: The irritating thing with Smuggler is that their positive effect on the deck is obvious (leeching a freebie) but their negative effect is hidden - it's not obvious that the player who just leeched a Lab could have bought a Gold if he didn't have those Smugglers, or that Smugglers have actually stopped his chain which would net him 13 Coins and +Buy in the end.
I think the card is ok. I've never seen a heavy Smuggler strategy work, barring some cards that synergize well with them (Throne Room, Warehouse etc.). Finding them annoying is more of a psychological effect than an objective observation of their detrimental role on the game.
http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/584874/smugglers-most-annoyi...
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Dennison Milenkaya
United States
Washington
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Damn! If the problem is the people that I'm playing with, we really ought to stop recommending Isotropic.
Freelance, I'm with you on that. It doesn't mean that people won't play them, heavily, to the detriment of themselves and everyone else in the game for reasons that I stipulated.
More importantly, what happened to my other five-and-a-half reasons? My post was cut-off.  I fear people aren't really understanding what causes most of the problems.
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Paul W
United States
Eugene
Oregon
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Of course, the objection boils down to the idea that the play of Smugglers isn't very interesting (but then most Dominion cards don't have choices in their execution), but the purchase of it most definitely is. Deciding when Smugglers is a good purchase is not at all trivial, but it's not random either.
Looking at a board with Smugglers, I'll assess whether I'll have the action to spare to play the card, whether I'd be better served with money to boost me to higher value cards faster, and whether I think my opponent's purchases are likely to benefit the deck I'm planning to build. Based on these, I'll make a purchase decision....Smugglers is neither an automatic nor a 'never' purchase.
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