Moshe Callen
Israel
Jerusalem
I like to exchange ideas but I have no interest in a pissing contest.
If you want me to review your game, just GM me and send me a copy. Abstracts, wargames and euros equally welcome. No party or dexterity games please.
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Morganza wrote: whac3 wrote: The separate roles of women and men are solely because men and women have distinct obligations in terms of mitzvot. The roles of men and women are separate merely because men and women are different? That's what it sounds like to me.
I'd not put it that way. The obligations are different. So for example, my wife can ligt shabbat candles for me but I don't light them for her because she has the primary obligation. Similarly, I can make kiddush for her but she doesn't for me because in that respect mine is the greater obligation.
It's division of labor. Fundamentally it's no different than the fact that primarily I do the cooking, washing of dishes and of clothes andmy wife primarily is the one to hang out the clothes to dry, to wash the floor and to fix things about the house.
Neither set of mitzvot is better or worse than the other. So the idea of them being "unequal" doesn't make snese to me-- and more importantly my wife feels she is in every way equal from what she has told me.
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peter mumford
United States
Somerville
Massachusetts
ceci n'est pas une pipe
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Moshe, you used to live in Texas, and now Israel?
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
United States
Sunnyvale
California
Just imagine the red offboard up here. I'll create it Real Soon Now...
Yes, I know a proper 18XX tile should have a tile number.
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whac3 wrote: It's division of labor. Fundamentally it's no different than the fact that primarily I do the cooking, washing of dishes and of clothes andmy wife primarily is the one to hang out the clothes to dry, to wash the floor and to fix things about the house.
You and your wife have decided, as equals, which chores belong to whom, but the obligation of davenning is permanently allocated to you because you are male. That's a fairly big difference.
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Moshe Callen
Israel
Jerusalem
I like to exchange ideas but I have no interest in a pissing contest.
If you want me to review your game, just GM me and send me a copy. Abstracts, wargames and euros equally welcome. No party or dexterity games please.
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photocurio wrote: Moshe, you used to live in Texas, and now Israel?
Yes, although I've been other places as well. I call myself from Texas in rough terms but for example wasn't born there.
Any reason you ask?
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Moshe Callen
Israel
Jerusalem
I like to exchange ideas but I have no interest in a pissing contest.
If you want me to review your game, just GM me and send me a copy. Abstracts, wargames and euros equally welcome. No party or dexterity games please.
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Morganza wrote: whac3 wrote: It's division of labor. Fundamentally it's no different than the fact that primarily I do the cooking, washing of dishes and of clothes andmy wife primarily is the one to hang out the clothes to dry, to wash the floor and to fix things about the house. You and your wife have decided, as equals, which chores belong to whom, but the obligation of davenning is permanently allocated to you because you are male. That's a fairly big difference.
That depends on how you look at things. You're looking for inequality, and os of course you find it. My wife and I look for equality within halakha, and so of course we find it too.
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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The hand doesn't complain about not getting to wear shoes, and the foot doesn't gripe about not holding utensils.
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"I'd like her to hold MY utensil!"
Sorry, just thought I'd inject a little S into the R of this RSP thread.
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
United States
Sunnyvale
California
Just imagine the red offboard up here. I'll create it Real Soon Now...
Yes, I know a proper 18XX tile should have a tile number.
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Tim mentioned that his review thread of The Manhattan Project got locked after it descended into nasty politics, and Cary suggested
garygarison wrote: Looking forward to your review of Roe v. Wade: The Card Game.
(I have to admit I thought this was funny, at first.)
There were a few more comments, including a coathanger comment, and belatedly I suggested that the discussion was out of line.
Morganza wrote: *cough* Let's keep the politics out of it *cough*
Besides, isn't Roe v. Wade an area control game?
Then
garygarison wrote: In all seriousness, where's the politics in this discussion? Insensitive I'll grant. Black humor I'll grant. But I see nothing overtly supporting or denigrating any political position, other than perhaps the politics of reviewing a game with political undercurrents.
But this is more than just political undercurrents, and even more than just a hot-button moral issue. The politics of abortion have become THE litmus test for right-wing politics in this country; the ostentatiously-religious right has lost on gay rights but is gaining ground on restricting reproductive freedom.
Any discussion of abortion gets into politics; it's inevitable.
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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Morganza wrote: ostentatiously-religious right
???
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
United States
Sunnyvale
California
Just imagine the red offboard up here. I'll create it Real Soon Now...
Yes, I know a proper 18XX tile should have a tile number.
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The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion.
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Jesse Dean
United States
Orlando
Florida
Pound for pound, the amoeba is the most vicious predator on Earth!
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My girlfriend describes herself as an independent but virtually always votes Democrat, at least on a national level because of the fact that reproductive rights and women's rights are her #1 issue. She is not completely happy with the Democrats track record on them by any stretch of the imagination, but she considers national level Republicans to be so much worse on those issues that she functionally votes a straight Democratic ticket in national elections.
I am similar in my general voting preferences, but my reasoning for it is somewhat different.
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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Morganza wrote: The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion.
I'd call that hypocrisy. Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? That seems a pretty broad brush.
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Morganza wrote: Any discussion of abortion gets into politics; it's inevitable.
But we really weren't discussing abortion. I was using Roe v. Wade as comedic fodder.
Similarly, I trust I could reference Larry Flynt in a one-liner without accusations of bringing up the politics of pornography.
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United States
Missoula
Montana
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out4blood wrote: Morganza wrote: The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion. I'd call that hypocrisy. Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? That seems a pretty broad brush.
All people opposed to homosexual "lifestyles" are bigots.
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out4blood wrote: Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites?
Wait a sec, before we drift off into that, what's your stance on abortion, Tim? My assumption in our GCL was that regardless of your stance, you have the sophistication and maturity to riff on Roe v. Wade. Is that a fair assessment?
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
United States
Sunnyvale
California
Just imagine the red offboard up here. I'll create it Real Soon Now...
Yes, I know a proper 18XX tile should have a tile number.
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out4blood wrote: Morganza wrote: The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion. I'd call that hypocrisy. Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? That seems a pretty broad brush.
(Emphasis was not in my original; added here.)
No, of course not. One of my first exposures to right-wing Christianity was the very nice gentleman who had volunteered to drive me home from a night-school math class every night (the class voted to adjust the official meeting time, and I objected because the proposed later end time was after the last bus towards my home...) who was deeply concerned for my soul because I had not accepted Christ as my personal saviour. He was *wrong*, but was in no way a hypocrite.
The people who make a profound display of religious beliefs for personal or political gain, those are the ones who I have a problem with.
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Morganza wrote: Besides, isn't Roe v. Wade an area control game?
This is freaking brilliant, by the way.
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Jerry Hagen
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
age agree eek egg erg gag gage game gamer gee geek gem germ keg kegger mag mage meek mega merge reek rem
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Independent as commonly used in US politics is such an overloaded term as to lose much of its meaning. It encompasses voters truly torn between Democrats and Republicans, voters who are left of the Democrats, voters who are right of the Republicans, voters who don't fit very well on a single left-right axis like libertarians, and also the completely apathetic.
Most horse-race polls break down "Democrats/Republicans/Independents" and call it a day.
ETA: inspired by Jesse's post which is now a few posts up.
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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garygarison wrote: out4blood wrote: Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? Wait a sec, before we drift off into that, what's your stance on abortion, Tim?
Personally, I think it's a terrible tragedy, and I could never make that choice. As a follower of Jesus, I am pricked by the pro-life arguments, but I believe in the literal pneuma, and I also offer the controversial Exodus 21:22 as food for thought. As a libertarian, I don't think that secular government needs to be making laws about it, although behavioral issues with single-parent children raises some legitimate claims for the state to consider. And legality ultimately has nothing to do with it being right or wrong.
Quote: My assumption in our GCL was that regardless of your stance, you have the sophistication and maturity to riff on Roe v. Wade.
Yes, but perhaps not the wit! 
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Tim Seitz
United States
Glen Allen
VA
Like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be recovered, so we must die. But God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. 2 Sam 14:14
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tscook wrote: out4blood wrote: Morganza wrote: The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion. I'd call that hypocrisy. Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? That seems a pretty broad brush. All people opposed to homosexual "lifestyles" are bigots.
Or devout?
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United States
Missoula
Montana
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out4blood wrote: tscook wrote: out4blood wrote: Morganza wrote: The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion. I'd call that hypocrisy. Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? That seems a pretty broad brush. All people opposed to homosexual "lifestyles" are bigots. Or devout?
Just because someone is a devout adherer to a bigoted belief doesn't make them not a bigot.
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Thomas Cowart
United States
Durham
North Carolina
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out4blood wrote: ... I believe in the literal pneuma...
I've never heard this phrase ("literal pneuma") before. What does it mean and how does it affect your view on abortion?
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Ari
United States
San Francisco
California
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ggeorgemcfly wrote: out4blood wrote: ... I believe in the literal pneuma... I've never heard this phrase ("literal pneuma") before. What does it mean and how does it affect your view on abortion?
pneuma is the spirit or soul... from that you can make an educated guess as to how it affects his view (Most likely against abortion).
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
United States
Sunnyvale
California
Just imagine the red offboard up here. I'll create it Real Soon Now...
Yes, I know a proper 18XX tile should have a tile number.
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tscook wrote: out4blood wrote: Morganza wrote: The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion. I'd call that hypocrisy. Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? That seems a pretty broad brush. All people opposed to homosexual "lifestyles" are bigots.
I'm opposed to the "homosexual lifestyle" -- I think the queers should settle down and get married.
Well, at least the ones in Argentina, Belgium, Canada, Iceland, the Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Spain, South Africa, Sweden, Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York, Vermont, and DC.
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Ari
United States
San Francisco
California
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Morganza wrote: tscook wrote: out4blood wrote: Morganza wrote: The people who talk about how religious they are instead of actually following the precepts, traditions, and practices of their religion. I'd call that hypocrisy. Are you suggesting that all those opposed to homosexual lifestyles are hypocrites? That seems a pretty broad brush. All people opposed to homosexual "lifestyles" are bigots. I'm opposed to the "homosexual lifestyle" -- I think the queers should settle down and get married. Well, at least the ones in Argentina, Belgium, Canada, Iceland, the Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Spain, South Africa, Sweden, Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York, Vermont, and DC.
Bigot! 
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