michael dorazio
United States
tyngsboro
Massachusetts
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Really? Not even in the top 100?
Notre Dame and Ra on top of this badboy?
Booooooooooooooooooo.
Can I get a witness?
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Tristan Hall
England
Manchester
Google 'NinjaDorg Fantasy Quest'
Google 'NinjaDorg Fantasy Quest'
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Preach on, brother.
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Scott Caldwell
United States
Oklahoma City
Oklahoma
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Preaching to the choir.
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Mike
United States
Olathe
Kansas
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It is hard to believe, is it not?
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Brent Lloyd
United States
League City
Texas
Canadian Game Design Award: http://www.fallcon.com/design
Canadian Game Design Award: http://www.fallcon.com/design
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I agree, the ranking is sad.
I would bet it is due to the price. It is an expensive game to initially purchase.
Personally, I think it is well worth the price, especially when you add in all the free stuff available.
For the un-initiated thought, high entry bar.
Peace
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Mike
United States
Olathe
Kansas
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At one time it was an expensive game to get into comparitively. But gosh, now look at all the $100+ games that are making big splashes. Soon we will miss the days where a game was around $70.
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James
United States
Midlothian
Virginia
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It's bad and it's good. It is bad, certainly, as I want Richard and the DotR team to be shockingly wealthy as a result of the sales of their games. The quality of the products they've put out as well as the product support should be rewarded. I've done my part by purchasing every expansion of DotR and Arkham Horror available!
It's good in another way, though, as I think DotR is one of those games that currently is being "found" on BGG. I regularly see it recommended on "what to buy" forum threads. I regularly see new threads posted by gamers who have discovered the game and are enjoying it to the maximum and recommending it to their friends. I don't see much of the "cult of the new" hype or the luster of a high ranking that both too often end in gamers who aren't suited for this game picking it up and posting threads complaining of the game not matching the expectations they had created with little investigation of the game experience offered.
The hope, of course, is that it continues to do well and be on the radar sufficiently so this can continue to happen. With more expansions in the works, I am optimistic that this will continue to be one of the best "word of mouth" games on BGG, with gamers who will appreciate it finding it, loving it, and passing the word on to others.
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Mike
United States
Olathe
Kansas
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You make a good point Bro' Jim! I feel the same way about Claustrophobia. Awesome game that did not get the "lift off" it deserved. But, it keeps hanging around and drawing in more converts all the time just like DotR. Both are great games and will always be in my collection!
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John Poskin
United States
Sauk Village
Illinois
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Amen
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James
United States
Midlothian
Virginia
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Thanks, Mike. Claustrophobia was exactly the comparison that came to my mind, too.
I know this will come off as snobby, but I have to acknowedge how I found the games. I think for both it was the quality of work of the forum participants that was a major force of persuasion for me. It wasn't just that they were effusive in their praise, it was that they were able to identify exactly the elements of these games that came together to make such terrific experiences and express them in articulate fashion. Clearly, these were people who thought about games and they appreciated these titles so much; these were endorsements. This is the word of mouth that drew me to DotR.
When I go some game pages and see seven reviews on the main game page that all say, in one way or another, "u gotta gett this game is sooooo awesum weeee!!!!!!" those reviews just create more of a hurdle to overcome in considering the game seriously. The game they're discussing could be terrific, but I have to fight the urge to click away before investigating further.
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Mike
United States
Olathe
Kansas
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Claustrophobia and DotR have some really dedicated fans that do a tremendous amount of work answering rules questions, play testing new ideas, creating variants and scenarios, posting interesting articles, etc. I think that is also a testament to just how great these games are how much people really love them. I am not sure very many games in the top 100 receive that kind of treatment by such dedicated fans. Just saying.
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Colorcrayons
United States
Maplewood
Minnesota
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TheDarkKnight wrote: You make a good point Bro' Jim! I feel the same way about Claustrophobia. Awesome game that did not get the "lift off" it deserved. But, it keeps hanging around and drawing in more converts all the time just like DotR. Both are great games and will always be in my collection!
Heh. When I was reading Jim's post Claus came to mind to me as well.
I beleive that Claus has had more success through various factors though as both are roughly the same age.
Availability is the main one. I have never seen this available in any local shops until I went to village games in Anoka MN. Price is another.$80 is noting to sneeze at even though you do get a nice mountain of plastic inside.
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Glen Graham
United States
Carmichael
CA
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LordHellfury wrote: [q="TheDarkKnight"]
Availability is the main one. I have never seen this available in any local shops until I went to village games in Anoka MN. Price is another.$80 is noting to sneeze at even though you do get a nice mountain of plastic inside.
Yes, it was at my local shop for almost $100 after tax. I usually like to support them, but I just couldn't this time when I could get it from Amazon for $50.
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Matt Smith
United States
Orion
Michigan
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cradleofmilk wrote: Really? Not even in the top 100?
Notre Dame and Ra on top of this badboy?
Booooooooooooooooooo.
Can I get a witness?
Word.
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Purple Paladin
California
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Really, it's that "low"??? I really never look at what rank a game is, as I go by video and forum reveiws. But I just assumed this game was in the top 25ish.
It's our groups favorite game by far; played pretty much every game night.
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michael dorazio
United States
tyngsboro
Massachusetts
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Lot of good points here, and it does strike me as a "word of mouth" game. I guess Arkham has the FFG thing going for it (and I too have every expansion and love the game), but as mentioned - plenty of people have probably picked that one up and found it didn't fit them. Not the case with DotR, I imagine.
Claustrophobia is high on my wishlist.
Here's a mostly off-topic recommendation for Dungeon Twister (at least the original series - don't have the new one) while I'm at it. Also has a strong fan base and word of mouth aspect.
More importantly, I'm starting up a DotM game in five minutes ... "Onslaught". My oldest kid provided me with a random draw for my solo game:
Gorgutt
Sapphire (dragon expansion)
Varkolak
Balazarg
with Onyx as Agent
Rogue
Ranger
Sorceress
Paladin (original - as I don't own the errant)
Creating a custom Special Card pool and gonna make it fairly tough.
Wish me luck, cuz it's only my seventh game or so.
(edited for Sapphire detail)
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Drew
United States
Chalfont
Pennsylvania
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Thunder wrote: I agree, the ranking is sad.
I would bet it is due to the price. It is an expensive game to initially purchase.
Personally, I think it is well worth the price, especially when you add in all the free stuff available.
For the un-initiated thought, high entry bar.
Peace
I don't get why so many people complain about the price of DOTR.
DOTR on Amazon $56 (List Price $84.99 (Eagle Games))
Agricola on Amazon $50 (List Price: $70 (Z-man))
The Dwarf may look like a steroid chugging teenager, but a white wooden cube looks nothing like a sheep.
Oh and if you buy DOTR from Eagle Games for $85 with free shipping you get not only one, but two sets of minis and they throw in the paint job for free.
All in Price from Eagle Games
$85 DOTR
$48 Hero Expansions 1, 2, 3
$60 Dragons
$2 Errant Paladin
$0 Barbarian
-----
$195 -- includes all painted minis
($153 Amazon with shipping and buying the Paladin from BBG, no painted minis except for the Dragons)
All in Price from Z-man
$70 Agricola
$40 Farmers of the Moor
$40 The Goodies (X, O, CZ, L Decks)(Price from CoolStuff)
$20 Gamer's Deck
------
$170
($140 from Amazon, Goodies from CoolStuff)
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Mike
United States
Olathe
Kansas
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Funny that Dungeon Twister was mentioned. It is one of my all time favorite games. It gets less respect than it deserves as well. Its creation was a stroke of pure brilliance!
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michael dorazio
United States
tyngsboro
Massachusetts
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His Earth Reborn is fantastic too. When you are playing the last scenarios, there is a LOT to think about. Only played the first five or so scenarios, and there is already plenty going on.
Anyhow, I just bit the big one in my game of DotR. The "Onslaught" scenario allows for initial tainting and overruns. Brutal. At the end of the third individual hero's turn (not even a full round), eleven of the crystals were on the board. Completely ridiculous. Had to get the Sorceress on that, and soon. But the real crotch-kick was rolling three or four "1"s against Gorgutt. I had already wasted Ballz and Varkolak, pushed back Sapphire, and thought I might win it all. Nope.
Used one Royal Blessing (four heroes)
Used five random Globals (2 bad, 3 good)
-quests of the council, came up
-the healing touch, came up
-visions of amarak, nope
-inns closed, nope
-enemy elite troops, nope
Got lucky with the Globals, for sure.
Special Card Pool:
-battle fury
-spell of purity
-all is quiet
-dark vision
-lightning storm
-local information
-experienced guides
-battle strategy
-strong defenses
-elven archers
-hammer of valor
-king's guard attack
-cavalry sweep
-magic gate
-militia secures area
Chose to use both cards for each general and seven others. Battle Srategy is a huge card, and I felt cheesy for using it, but whatever. Each hero started with two random Special Cards per the scenario. The other seven were shuffled into the deck before each hero received four more cards at random (also per scenario).
Darkness Spreads Cards:
-All standard cards for the four generals
-Dark Magic
-Assault on Monarch City
-Monarch City x 2
-Orc War Party x 2
-Orc War Patrol x 4 (that's what did me in)
-All is Quiet x 0 (tough guy)
Four hours to set it up, play it, check on a sad toddler, type this garbage up, and put it away.
Next game is the same, but random Global draw.
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Roland W. est. 1984
Germany
Unterriexingen
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Very expensive in germany. I am the only one I know who owns a copy^^ because of this (even many people enjoyed it)
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Chris Ferejohn
United States
San Francisco
California
Pitying fools as hard as I can...
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Comic Sans = NO TOP 100 FOR YOU!
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Mike Forrey
United States
Yoe
Pennsylvania
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The game also suffers from being wildly random and one bad die roll/card draw away from a no win situation. I mean it's great if that's what you want but most top games have some measure of control in them where DoTR has very little. Even Arkham horror has more control in it.
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Tristan Hall
England
Manchester
Google 'NinjaDorg Fantasy Quest'
Google 'NinjaDorg Fantasy Quest'
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bearn wrote: Even Arkham horror has more control in it.
That is patently untrue.
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Mike
United States
Olathe
Kansas
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bearn wrote: The game also suffers from being wildly random and one bad die roll/card draw away from a no win situation. I mean it's great if that's what you want but most top games have some measure of control in them where DoTR has very little. Even Arkham horror has more control in it.
Winning is not the only way to have or enjoy a/this game. Sometimes the close games where victory was so close are the most exciting.
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michael dorazio
United States
tyngsboro
Massachusetts
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Weird. I feel like I have several ways to work around "bad" draws and "bad" rolls in DotR. Special Cards, Hero ablities, Quest Rewards, and Royal Blessings are things that come to mind right away. Plus, I can work toward defeating the two generals who are closest to Monarch City - fighting the one who is in the lead right when it's time to take him down. Haven't felt a lack of control at all. Same goes for Arkham, and I've played that one about fifty times.
But the guy who talks about a lack of control in DotR does have good taste otherwise. Through the Ages, Dominant Species, etc. His top seven [i]is p[/i]retty killer. Guess I can let the post slide ...
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