$10.00
Recommend
29 
 Thumb up
 Hide
71 Posts
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 

Wargames» Forums » General

Subject: If you were starting all over . . . rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
The one and only (but one of two in BGG)
United States
Minnesota
flag msg tools
Games are not movies or stories; they're vehicles for creative decision making.
badge
"Desire makes everything blossom; possession makes everything wither and fade." (Marcel Proust)
mbmbmbmbmb
If you were starting this hobby all over again from scratch, knowing what you know now, what would you want to purchase as your very first wargame?

That question is from
James Ryan
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmbmbmb


It's too good a question to leave at the end of a list of questions. It deserves its own thread. So, here it is.

How 'bout it? What game would you start with?
14 
 Thumb up
1.05
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The one and only (but one of two in BGG)
United States
Minnesota
flag msg tools
Games are not movies or stories; they're vehicles for creative decision making.
badge
"Desire makes everything blossom; possession makes everything wither and fade." (Marcel Proust)
mbmbmbmbmb
Back in 1970, I bought my first historical wargame, The Battle of the Bulge (after a friend and I had dabbled at Kriegspiel and Waterloo a bit). I still think that's a pretty good choice.

I'd certainly start with an operational-scale game--a wargame where I'm re-creating a battle or campaign, not a whole war or a low-level skirmish. I'd save tactical and strategic wargames for later.

I'd also choose a game on a subject that interests me--a battle or campaign that I'd like to read a book or watch a documentary about.

I'd steer clear of wargames with cards, just as a personal preference. I generally dislike cards in my games.

Back in 1970, I picked Bulge because my dad had fought in that battle and I'd heard about it all the time I was growing up. Today, there are other good choices, so I might start with Bitter Woods (fourth edition) or Ardennes '44. Or maybe just zero in on my dad's part of the campaign and go with Bastogne: Screaming Eagles under Siege.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rob Ryan
United States
Las Vegas
Nevada
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Stalingrad Pocket (second edition) or another game in the SCS.
8 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Proudly annoying Capitalists since 1959
Cuba
Santa Clara
flag msg tools
Heaven has no rage like love to hatred turned, Nor hell a fury like a woman scorned
mbmbmbmbmb
The Campaign for North Africa

6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Cpl. Fields
South Africa
Hopelessly Surrounded
Isandlwana, Zululand
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
A Victory Lost. Great game, graphically pleasing, and manageable rules that introduce most of the major elements of board wargaming.
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric Walters
United States
Chesterfield
Virginia
flag msg tools
"...the art of manoeuvering armies...an art which none may master by the light of nature. but to which, if he is to attain success, a man must serve a long apprenticeship." -- G.F.R. Henderson
mbmbmbmbmb
This depends on so many things. Here's my pick list:

My first multi-player/game club title: Friedrich

My first air warfare game: Buffalo Wings

My first tactical ground warfare game: Band of Brothers: Screaming Eagles

My first naval warfare game: Flying Colors

My first WW II operational game: Rommel in the Desert

My first WW II strategic game: Axis Empires: Totaler Krieg!

My first Napoleonic battle game: Napoleon's Triumph

My first Civil War battle game: South Mountain

My first ancients battle game: Raphia
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric Lai
Hong Kong
Happy Valley
None
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Case Blue
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
jeff miller
United States
West Jefferson
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
In a way I did start all over when I got back into the wargaming hobby about three years ago. I bought a new copy (3rd edition) of Napoleon: The Waterloo Campaign, 1815 that I had fond memories of from way back, and I used the information here on BGG to retro-fit the armies to the original version. I much prefer the original battleboard also, because it has a really nice Napoleonic warfare feel to it. In three years time I have acquired on average about one game a month and my collection is filling in rather nicely. I do have too much multi-player stuff though, because I can rarely get several people to sit down at one time for a game.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The one and only (but one of two in BGG)
United States
Minnesota
flag msg tools
Games are not movies or stories; they're vehicles for creative decision making.
badge
"Desire makes everything blossom; possession makes everything wither and fade." (Marcel Proust)
mbmbmbmbmb
jeff miller wrote:
In a way I did start all over when I got back into the wargaming hobby about three years ago.

Hmm . . . now that you mention it, so did I, at about the same time.

And I started with a Napoleonic game too: Waterloo 20.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Dorosh
Canada
Calgary
Alberta
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
Tactical Wargamer's Journal
mbmbmbmbmb
Patrick Carroll wrote:
How 'bout it? What game would you start with?


I got involved in board wargaming because I was literally 8 years old and they had a book of games right in the school library. I kept with it because the games were available in mainstream toy stores, where as a child I happened to spend a lot of time anyway. PanzerBlitz and Afrika Korps looked like mature and fun second steps to take, having gotten tired of Monopoly and Mouse Trap. I kept involved because of some Squad Leader players in the chess club in high school.

Board wargames are now physically available in only one location in my city - of one million people - that I can think of, off-hand. While they have a good selection of military books, I'm not sure I'd ever have been persuaded to give any of the games a second glance, or even visit the store, if I'd never heard of games until today.

I regret to say, left to my own devices, I'd probably have just gone straight for the computer games. Most "recruiting" seems to be done person to person. I got involved that way, and 20 years ago, I tried to involve others that way by sitting them down and introducing them to Squad Leader or Ambush.

All that being said, if it was a case of being recruited at this stage of life, it would have been up to whomever was recruiting me to spark some kind of interest in me. I don't think I would have come to find any of the board games interesting on my own. I do now because of the nostalgia and past experiences invested in the whole scene.

Come to that, WBRP kind of 'recruited' me a couple years ago, in that I went over to his place and he walked me through a game of Combat Commander. It really did bring back memories of those care-free high school Squad Leader sessions. Honestly, I don't think the title itself would be as important as the ability to bring back that kind of experience. I'd worry less about which game, as who I could experience it with.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bill Wood
United States
Eden
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
If I had to pick just one to get started with - man that is hard - there are so many good ones.

Yom Kippur

It is is easy to find, at a low cost, has all the basics of classic wargaming, and plays pretty quick and is easy to learn.

Further, it leads you to other games using the same system.

And the newbie may find it a bit prescient, thus interesting in its subject matter.

It presents really well, has highly mobile units, lots of tanks and stuff blows up a lot.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Paradis
Canada
Ste-Thérèse
Québec
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmbmbmb
I hesitate between two (very different) games.

Totaler Krieg!

And

Squad Leader

As both have excellent replay value.

Gee.... I really can't decide. cry

Ok, ok, ok... Make it Squad Leader.

OF COURSE, I understand the question as if I had to start from scratch but still having played all the games I played.

IF the question was, right now, what would be my first new wargame ever (I suppose that I never played any before), then I would have to chose:

Memoir '44

If I am limited to "real" counter/hex wargames, then I would choose:

The Russian Campaign (fourth edition)

Fo the record, my first wargame was: Luftwaffe
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Wendell
United States
Twin Cities
Minnesota
flag msg tools
All the little chicks with crimson lips, go...
badge
Hey, get your stinking cursor off my face! I got nukes, you know.
mbmbmbmbmb
Tough decision because if I were starting over, I obviously wouldn't know what I know now!

If I could teleport back to my teen years when I got started with all this tomfoolery, I would have at least told myself to get Russian Civil War 1918-1922 (first edition). My teenaged game group would have eaten that up.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Paradis
Canada
Ste-Thérèse
Québec
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmbmbmb
wifwendell wrote:
Tough decision because if I were starting over, I obviously wouldn't know what I know now!

If I could teleport back to my teen years when I got started with all this tomfoolery, I would have at least told myself to get Russian Civil War 1918-1922 (first edition). My teenaged game group would have eaten that up.


Right!

When I think of my teenage years, the game we played most was this one:

Kingmaker

12 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Wendell
United States
Twin Cities
Minnesota
flag msg tools
All the little chicks with crimson lips, go...
badge
Hey, get your stinking cursor off my face! I got nukes, you know.
mbmbmbmbmb
licinius wrote:
wifwendell wrote:
Tough decision because if I were starting over, I obviously wouldn't know what I know now!

If I could teleport back to my teen years when I got started with all this tomfoolery, I would have at least told myself to get Russian Civil War 1918-1922 (first edition). My teenaged game group would have eaten that up.


Right!

When I think of my teenage years, the game we played most was this one:

Kingmaker



Kingmaker was our most-played wargame, followed closely by Swords & Sorcery and then at a somewhat greater distance, Rise and Decline of the Third Reich and Wizard's Quest. All multi-player wargames. (But D&D was way ahead of them all back then...)
8 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Warren Bruhn
United States
Roseburg
Oregon
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Haring wrote:


I thought of that one, since I have a 30 year old copy. However, the group of grognards that I play with are veterans of multiple long games of World in Flames (with almost all of the bells and whistles), Empires in Arms, War Between the States, Terrible Swift Sword, the Longest Day, and Europa. When I broke out my 30 year old copy of Campaign for North Africa and suggested that we play it they just laughed at me!
cry

What's the point of having a game take up space on the shelf just to get a few laughs whenever I suggest to a group of hard core monster wargamers that we should play it?


But, oddly, it does fit much of what I would want in a first wargame:

1. It's huge! Would first want either a big game or big system (ASL). Knowing what I know now (referring to the OP question), light games just sit on my shelf unplayed.

2. It's multi-player. Love playing with a big group of guys in a big long running game rather than playing short two player games. If I had it to do over again I'd probably shuck most of the short two player games as being nearly useless. It's the extended long term social experience around a big project that makes wargaming worth the trouble.

3. It's complex. A game that includes air, land, sea, logistics, and management of command teams is a project worth starting. I've found that, to some extent, games that involve work involve reward.

On the other hand, a huge glorious game is useless without players. And CNA doesn't have the positive reputation of World in Flames or Empires in Arms or Euro Front II or The Devil's Cauldron. Without a good rep, there's just no way to gather the players necessary to give it a go.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
ian morris
United Kingdom
lichfield
staffordshire
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb


I'd be hard-pressed to come up with a better starter game than the one I actually started on : The Russian Campaign. One of the finest games ever made, IMO.

If we're talking about current games, then something from the SCS series would be good, probably Bastogne: Screaming Eagles under Siege.





5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian Gannon
United States
Indianapolis
Indiana
flag msg tools
hexencounter.blogspot.com
mbmbmbmbmb
I would jump right into the OCS rulebook. It can be a little intimidating at first but the OCS world abides by a certain logic.

Once you've got that logic squared-away, even the monster games, though extremely time-consuming, have a very inviting "flow" to them. The hours just disappear.

Have yet to find another game system that delivers that amount of enjoyment.

6 
 Thumb up
0.05
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Warren Bruhn
United States
Roseburg
Oregon
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
wifwendell wrote:
Kingmaker was our most-played wargame, followed closely by Swords & Sorcery and then at a somewhat greater distance, Rise and Decline of the Third Reich and Wizard's Quest. All multi-player wargames. (But D&D was way ahead of them all back then...)


Multi-player games rule! The games that I enjoyed the most in my first couple of decades of wargaming (1972 to 1992) were all played with groups of 3 to 7 players:

Squad Leader + Cross of Iron
Richtofen's War
3rd Reich
Wooden Ships & Iron Men
Yaquinto's Ironclads + expansion
King Maker
Samurai
Mighty Fortress
Conquistador
Stellar Conquest
Speed Circuit
Gunslinger
Terrible Swift Sword
Axis & Allies
Excalibre
Pax Britannica
Empires in Arms

The games that I bought recently include GMT's Sword of Rome and Paths of Glory, both 2010 reprints, along with a third copy of Empires in Arms, unpuched copies of the old Squad Leader & Cross of Iron, and a copy of Merchants & Marauders (Z-Man). Over the last couple of years I've been playing mostly Sword of Rome, Pax Britannica, Empires in Arms, Friedrich, Here I Stand, The Devil's Cauldron, and various light mostly multi-player games such as Merchants & Marauders.
arrrh

Any one of those would be a good first purchase if I (knock on wood) lost my whole collection. But if that really happened my first gut instinct would be to try to find another copy of Empires in Arms.
ninja

Even the two player games that I love such as GMT's Paths of Glory and VG's The Civil War are games that I need to somehow adapt to multi-player functioning before I can get them to the table. Two player games just don't do it for me anymore. A wargame should be a party!
cool

Of the newer products that I've seen, The Devil's Cauldron from MMP is the most impressive. Have played 3 sessions of a grand campaign of that so far, and it's a blast. Have had 4 or 5 players per session, six different players in total, with various spectators showing up to take a look, including some who are playing World in Flames in the same room.
devil
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sim Guy
United States
Albuquerque
New Mexico
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm not 100% sure it would be a wargame... If I was looking around at the gamers in the area, BGG, CSW, and such, it could very easily end up being something like A Game of Thrones (first edition) or Twilight Imperium (Third Edition) - a little more 'gamey' than war games, but they'd probably fit the bill.

Once I saw enough of wargames, though - and I am not prone to snap decisions - I would either want something big on all of WWII: John Prados' Third Reich, Advanced European Theater of Operations/Advanced Pacific Theater of Operations, World in Flames Master Edition. I'd have to think more on exactly which one. -OR-

The other possibility is an expandable tactical series on the order of Panzer Grenadier or World at War. Again once I narrowed my choice I'd try out the games to see what I liked best.

When I first started wargaming in a group, our games were Richthofen's War, PanzerBlitz, and The Game of France, 1940: German Blitzkrieg in the West. I own them all, and still get nostalgic when I pull them out. But I probably would not get any of them if I was starting over today. Only my PanzerBlitz, which I have heavily modded gets regular play these days. Better games on all of these subject exist today, from multiple publishers.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Warren Bruhn
United States
Roseburg
Oregon
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Garfink wrote:


Coming from a person who says he has owned nearly 1900 games, and whose intellectual and spiritual pursuits are most impressive, I'll take the recommendation for Case Blue soblue Very Seriously!sauron
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Cornelissen
United States
San Antonio
Texas
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
licinius wrote:

Given the historical significance of these two games, I think it would be tough to come up with a better choice.

Of course, if you couldn't find a decent copy of The Russian Campaign, you could always get No Retreat! The Russian Front.

2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Hall
United States
Harrisburg
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
As it turns out I just did start over, and my first new purchase was
Scratch One Flat Top, although many years ago my first purchase was Blitzkreig and I would probably go with that if I had to do it over, as it got me hooked on the hobby.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
BJ
Canada
London
Ontario
flag msg tools
"Yeah I killed women and children, killed everything that walks or crawls at one time or another and I'm here to kill you Little Bill"
badge
"It's a Sicilian message. It means Luci Brasi sleeps with the fishes."
mbmbmbmbmb
Hannibal: Rome vs. Carthage
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
J.L. Robert
United States
Sherman Oaks
California
flag msg tools
designer
Follow me if you want to play wargames!
mbmbmbmbmb
B-17: Queen of the Skies
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.