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Dominant Species» Forums » Rules

Subject: Scoring then Extinction rss

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Peter Gibson
New Zealand
Auckland
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Only played 3 games so far.

I can't see anything in the rules to stop a player from placing species on a terrain tile where they will become extinct during the end of turn activities due to a lack of matching elements in order to score that tile before they die.

I can understand the situation of being on a tile and having those elements removed by some other action or card and then scoring before extinction, but sending 'suicide species' out in order to score from a tile that you ordinarily would have no business being on seems a bit gamey to me.

Am I correct in thinking that this move is legal?

BTW, I understand that my opinion on whether this is gamey or not is irrelevant so I don't need any lectures please.

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Luke Stirling
Australia
Southbank
Victoria
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Endangered species are ineligible from scoring a tile I believe.
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brian
United States
Cedar Lake
Indiana
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paralipsis wrote:
Endangered species are ineligible from scoring a tile I believe.

You score them. They will just be extinct at the end of the round. Which means they are a one and done for scoring purposes as opposed to putting them somewhere they can support them and scoring multiple times hopefully. Plus when they go extinct, they are out of the game giving you that much less to work with.
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Peter Gibson
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Thanks, that's what I thought and how we played it.

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Luke Stirling
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Southbank
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You're right. I'm confusing Dominance with scoring. blush
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Dave Eisen
United States
Menlo Park
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ColtsFan76 wrote:
paralipsis wrote:
Endangered species are ineligible from scoring a tile I believe.

You score them. They will just be extinct at the end of the round. Which means they are a one and done for scoring purposes as opposed to putting them somewhere they can support them and scoring multiple times hopefully. Plus when they go extinct, they are out of the game giving you that much less to work with.


Still the right answer sometimes. Generally when it gives you second place on a sea tile for 5 points.
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Yours Truly,
United States
Raleigh
North Carolina
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There must have been a moment at the beginning, where we could have said no. Somehow we missed it. Well, we'll know better next time.
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oskacat wrote:
sending 'suicide species' out in order to score from a tile that you ordinarily would have no business being on seems a bit gamey to me.


If by "gamey" do you mean "un-thematic"? Otherwise, I'm not sure (and am curious) what "gamey" means.

To help with the theme, realize that animal behavior is not always adaptive. Animals are constantly making trade-offs, and balancing pros and cons. Sometimes some will win out, other times it turns out to be a mistake. For example, if resources are scarce, perhaps a predator will follow a prey into a hostile environment, trading off food resources for quality environment. In such cases, some may end up dying. (After "eating the prey" i.e. scoring )
 
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
United States
Sunnyvale
California
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Yes, I know a proper 18XX tile should have a tile number.
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The fossil record is full of species that thrived for a while before going extinct. How many VP did the Trilobite player get?
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Jack Smith
United Kingdom
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It is an expensive way to grab points although that depends on the stage of the game, the tile scored and the relative player scores. It may also be a certain card changes their extinction status anyway. I've deliberately killed species to my advantage knowing I was going to pick the Hibernation card.

I also have no issue with it at all, it's quite thematic really. Of all species ever in existence something like 99.999% died out before today yet thrived while they existed so would be eligible for points.
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Brad Miller
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Morganza wrote:
The fossil record is full of species that thrived for a while before going extinct. How many VP did the Trilobite player get?


Lots. And on big time 9 point tiles as well.
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Jack Smith
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Windopaene wrote:
Morganza wrote:
The fossil record is full of species that thrived for a while before going extinct. How many VP did the Trilobite player get?


Lots. And on big time 9 point tiles as well. :D


Yes, and us Homo Sapiens would get very few points. Actually I'm not sure we would get any yet. Although in the game context we would get a lot more as it represents a very short period of time.
 
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
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Sunnyvale
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Halfinger wrote:
It is an expensive way to grab points although that depends on the stage of the game, the tile scored and the relative player scores. It may also be a certain card changes their extinction status anyway. I've deliberately killed species to my advantage knowing I was going to pick the Hibernation card.


Competition also factors in.
 
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Daniel Corban
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JohnnyDollar wrote:
oskacat wrote:
sending 'suicide species' out in order to score from a tile that you ordinarily would have no business being on seems a bit gamey to me.


If by "gamey" do you mean "un-thematic"? Otherwise, I'm not sure (and am curious) what "gamey" means.

While gamey elements are frequently un-thematic, the terms are not interchangeable. When something is "gamey", it feels outside the spirit of the game, often taking advantage of a perceived loophole in the rules. Something un-intuitive, but technically legal.

I'm trying to recall a specific example, but I cannot at the moment, despite having this feeling many times over the years. Magic: The Gathering is frequently subjected to gamey plays, but it is called "rules lawyering" there.
 
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Chris Berger
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Volo
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dcorban wrote:
While gamey elements are frequently un-thematic, the terms are not interchangeable. When something is "gamey", it feels outside the spirit of the game, often taking advantage of a perceived loophole in the rules. Something un-intuitive, but technically legal.

I'm trying to recall a specific example, but I cannot at the moment, despite having this feeling many times over the years. Magic: The Gathering is frequently subjected to gamey plays, but it is called "rules lawyering" there.


The problem with "gamey" in this context is that it's pretty subjective. One person's "exploitation of the rules" is another's "just part of the game". The best example I can think of is starvation in Stone Age. Being able to ignore feeding your people in exchange for a 10 point penalty feels gamey because you're skipping the whole upkeep part of the game, and if you are efficient in the rest of the game, you can gain more than 10 points with that efficiency. It feels like it's "against the spirit of the rules", but don't bring that up in the Stone Age forums...
 
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Daniel Corban
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Ontario
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Thank you. That Stone Age strategy is a great example.

Having one person feel it is outside the spirit and another feel it is perfectly fine would be an exact definition of "gamey".
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