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brendon 306
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When Sudden Pitfall (Shadow: If the defending character is an ally, discard it from play) or Undisturbed Bones (Shadow: Discard the defending character from play) is dealt as a shadow card do you?:

a) discard a character and the enemy attacks as if it was an undefended attack (since the defending character is discarded)

or:

b) discard a character and the enemy does not attack

I have been playing the first way (a), but it seems a bit harsh. How do you play these as shadow effects?
 
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Patrick Brennan
Australia
St Ives, Sydney
NSW
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It's a). You've been playing correctly.
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Jamie Riehl
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Eau Claire
Wisconsin
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Ouch. I was totally cheating on those.
 
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Rauli Kettunen
Finland
Oulu
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Those shadow effects really, really make you think twice before blocking with an ally in KD. Lose that ally and you're looking at a dead hero to boot, since most Enemies attack for at least 4 undefended.
 
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John Farrell
Australia
Aspley
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Dam the Man wrote:
Those shadow effects really, really make you think twice before blocking with an ally in KD.


But that's the only strategy I know!
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And it still works 8 out of 10 times, even in KD. For the 2 out of 10 that don't, just cancel the shadow effect or use A Burning Brand (stupidly powerful on KD with all those "add this to the staging area" shadow effects).
 
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Rauli Kettunen
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Oulu
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Fizeront wrote:
And it still works 8 out of 10 times, even in KD. For the 2 out of 10 that don't, just cancel the shadow effect or use A Burning Brand (stupidly powerful on KD with all those "add this to the staging area" shadow effects).


What about when you have five Enemies engaged in Seventh Level and four of them gets "add Goblin X to the staging area" shadow effect yuk ? Burning Brand is nice, but you have to have it in play and only works for one Lore character per BB. And not all decks use Lore or Spirit.
 
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Bart Rachemoss
United States
Silver City
New Mexico
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"All" does not imply "at least one".
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Dam the Man wrote:
What about when you have five Enemies engaged in Seventh Level and four of them gets "add Goblin X to the staging area" shadow effect yuk ?

Thalin
Rain of Arrows
Gondorian Spearman
Swift Strike
Quick Strike
 
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Stan Hilinski
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Laurel
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Sudden Pitfall, which I think discards the defender from play (I think you have it reversed), is the nastiest encounter card I've seen. It has the potential to kill 2 heroes at once. First, it can kill a defending hero. Now you have an undefended attack, and many attacking Orcs bump up to 5 attack when the attack is undefended, which is enough to kill most heroes. There goes the second one. I think there is only one in the deck, so I watch for it to show up in the discard pile.

It is encounter cards like this that have made me pay more attention to "Shadow Management" when I build decks.
 
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Rauli Kettunen
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Oulu
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BitJam wrote:

Thalin


Had him tagging along the Tactics deck first, then in the Dwarf deck (mostly for Eastern Crows in Mirkwood cycle), but Gimli took his place in the Dwarf deck.

Quote:
Rain of Arrows


Need Brand or Legolas for that, plus it pretty much blows otherwise.

Quote:
Gondorian Spearman


In decks, but once you've paid your 2 Tactics resources for him, you have nothing left for the two cards below. Nor are you guaranteed to have him in play thanks to the annoying Treacheries.

Quote:
Swift Strike
Quick Strike


Former hasn't been in my decks in ages, 2-cost is tad steep (Tactics is the minor sphere in two decks, major in only one, but Eagles cost an arm and a leg in that one). And there is always the having them in hand issue to deal with too. You get five Enemies by turn 2 (hell, turn 1 is possible in 2-player if you get Orc Horn Blower), you won't have resources for half of those things, let alone getting most of them into hand.
 
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Bart Rachemoss
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Dam the Man wrote:
You get five Enemies by turn 2 (hell, turn 1 is possible in 2-player if you get Orc Horn Blower), you won't have resources for half of those things, let alone getting most of them into hand.

I didn't realize you were talking about five enemies by turn 2 nor did I know that you were going to insist on having only one Tactics hero in your deck. I was just responding to the problem you posed of having 5 enemies in the staging area and somehow preventing most of them from drawing shadow cards. I'm sorry I misunderstood.

Dam the Man wrote:
BitJam wrote:
Rain of Arrows

Need Brand or Legolas for that, plus it pretty much blows otherwise

There is also Horseback Archer, Haldir, Silverlode Archer, Vassel of the Windlord, and even Dunedain Cache. I admit that a two card combo by turn 2 is not reliable. OTOH, if you have a lot of low HP enemies, you get a lot of bang for your buck with Rain of Arrows especially if you are using some of the other cards I mentioned to inflict direct damage before shadow cards are resolved.

ISTM this is how the game works. You find out the strengths and weaknesses of the encounter deck (or decks) and then you construct a deck to counter the strengths and exploit the weaknesses. The theme I was suggesting was direct damage to enemies. I agree that any one card that is part of the theme will, as you say, blow. They only work when you use them together. Out of the 19 enemy cards in the Seventh Level 15 have 2 or fewer hit points. If you use Thalin and some other direct damage cards you should be able to kill most of these enemies before they get a chance to draw a shadow card. For example Thalin plus Rain of Arrows can kill off 80% of your enemies before they even get a chance to attack. OTOH using just Thalin or just Rain of Arrows only allows you to kill off 2 of the 19 enemies (10%) before they attack.

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Rauli Kettunen
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BitJam wrote:
did I know that you were going to insist on having only one Tactics hero in your deck.


When spreading two Core Sets + one copy each of Mirkwood + KD packs into five decks, without duplicating any heroes (so each deck can be paired with another deck), having two decks with Tactics majority doesn't really seem worth it, you do want somebody questing as well.

Quote:
ISTM this is how the game works. You find out the strengths and weaknesses of the encounter deck (or decks) and then you construct a deck to counter the strengths and exploit the weaknesses.


I don't cherry-build for each quest, I've kept the basic four decks from the moment I made the decks (ripping their idea fully from a thread on BGG). With each AP, cards have been replaced with the new cards and a few heroes have been swapped aroud and with KD I added the Dwarf deck (or Leftover deck as it uses many of the cards that were just collecting dust). But I prefer, no, want my decks to play against any scenario and be able to beat them. I want to just pick up a deck, pair it with another deck, grab a quest and play. Deck-building holds almost no interest for me, cherry-building even less.
 
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Bart Rachemoss
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Silver City
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Please play and deck build however you want. I really wasn't trying to tell you what to do I was merely trying to answer a question you asked. I had no idea you had so many additional constraints. I'm not saying constraints are bad. I really like the house rules jrd23 created to make the game harder and I have a lot of respect for people who try to make "one deck to rule them all" including your version of only making a few changes. My point is that it seems rather silly to ask a question and then reject answers based entirely on hidden information that was not part of the question. It is frustrating for everyone.
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