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Subject: [Extras] The TIE Fighter Expansion rss

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Michael Ptak
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Since I find myself creating a few more custom ordinance and expansion cards based on the computer games, I thought about floating a thread that contains all of these things in one place. TIE Fighter was great, and I couldn't help but think of the things it introduced to Star Wars when it was released, but never made it into Canon.

I also find that the computer games have a lot of things that naturally slide in well to the Tabletop game. It's fortunate that CPU usage was kind of sticky back then, because simulating capital ships with a few amount of turrets works just as well on the tabletop as it did back then. Hence why I think the Platform and capital ship rules I'm writing (and will hopefully release soon) would work well.

Anyway, now I'm going to post some custom cards. Think of them as mockups, because I haven't had time to pretty up the artwork.


Everybody's heavy ordinance rockets from TIE Fighter. I think they're under-rated here actually since two of them should be able to take out a Corellian Corvette!

This card actually uses a gameplay gimmick. Presently in my capital ship rules, Capital ships (and platforms) never roll agility dice for any reason. So something like the Proton Rockets are great against stationary and slow-moving installations (which they were), but foolhardy to use against even Stormtrooper transports.


Another notable weapon from TIE Fighter. The intention is that it cancels the fighter's next opportunity to perform a shooting action- be it at a target that just fired or a target that would fire afterward. I'm thinking this should be changed to a missile, but, opinions?


About the only thing missing from this card is representing SLAMs. The template I'm using has no equivalent for the boost function yet. Still, here it is for thoughts and feedback.
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Owen Thayer
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Why is the missile boat so expensive to deploy? 32 pts for a craft with almost no attack power and the same hitpoints as a TIE Advanced seem a little steep... even with the 4 agility dice, it's hard to imagine spending a third of your squad's points on a ship like this, especially when you figure decking the thing out with missiles will boost the cost to 48pts total...

I could see this thing going the way of the Y-Wing in terms of points: 18pts for a basic model, up to 25pts for the top pilot. You may want to push the points even lower, because after all: once this thing runs out of missiles, it's not going to be doing any damage to anyone.
 
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Sebastian Grawan
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Why not lower the points costs of the Missile Boat somewhat or at least give it 2 missile upgrades for free?

Could it be that there is no model available (from any source) for the missile boat? Is it too EU to have ever been release as a real model?

EDIT: BTW I love how you try to include more Tie Fighter (PC game) stuff into the X-Wing game. Classic cool!
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Michael Ptak
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Hmm... if possible I'd like to keep the text box clear for specific pilot abilities. I think I need to further amend the Missile boat card to add not just the boost function, but for a new equipment card too (so the jamming beam can be equipped).

I think the greatest point expense comes from the high dodge value, which after thinking about it I should probably tone down- the missile boat is fast, not nimble

The point costs come from a user who has reverse-enginered a formula that makes up all the costs for the pilot cards used in the game so far. I think its what, 8 points per dodge dice over 2?

The reason I did the missile boat (and I wanted to do the T-Wing as well, not enough time), was because it's one of the least likely TIE-Fighter/X-Wing craft to get a treatment by FFG. It's hardly appeared in any Star Wars media outside of the game it featured in. The Defender, on the other hand...

Needless to say I'd be overjoyed if it wasn't the case, but I'd expect it to be expensive for how amazing it was in the game.

Do folks have an opinion on the Ordinance?
 
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john roberts
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Many Y-wings will die to my heavy rockets!!!
 
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Michael Ptak
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That's if you can get a torpedo-carrying platform to hold them. The Empire doesn't have any until the TIE Bomber shows up

It's kind of interesting how X-Wing discriminates between missiles and Torpedoes, since in TIE Fighter you could switch between the two no matter what platform you were flying. This means converting TIE Bombers into missile trucks...

Still it means fighters are restricted on what they can carry. So no X-Wings kited out as dogfighters with concussion missiles.
 
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Daniel Leister
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I love the inclusion of the heavy rockets! Brings back memories of shooting these at close range to knock out almost anything. But I don't think it makes sense that a freighter gets as much extra defense against them as a tie fighter. How about giving the defender double their normal agility roll?
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Michael Ptak
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Rockets were nearly useless against anything other than stationary platforms and capital ships...

If by freighter you mean the YT-1300, remember that they were one of the fastest large ships in the game. They'd easily dodge and out-run heavy rockets.

BFF-1s on the other hand....
 
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Joseph Woodworth
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not sure you need a target lock for rockets - I think they should function without them. *edit* do to the nature of the rockets, you might instead make their range one... right up on a fighter was the only way to hit, and even then, they could dodge. Longer range only worked for the large ships that moved slowly - but since they weren't guided, you could still miss

To include free upgrades on a ship like the missile boat, you could color one or two of the missile upgrade slots green to represent it comes preloaded... I don't recall its agility being so high.

 
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Michael Ptak
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The ideal use for the rockets are against capital ships and installations which, as I said, would not use dodge dice under my rules, and so do a ton of damage. You would be firing these things at maximum range to prevent the target from firing back and knocking you down, so basically range 3.

However when engaging anything other than something slow-moving or stationary there's a good chance they dodge. So anything not a capital ship gets 3 Dodge dice, which on top of the rest of a fighter's natural dodge dice, should be good enough to avoid serious damage.

Unless you're a Y-Wing.

That was my thinking anyway.
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Henry Small
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Eagerly awaiting the Defender. cool
 
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Sebastian Grawan
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I'd love to use the Missile Boat in my games, but which model to use for it...?
 
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Val Cassotta
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Liking these 2 new Upgrades.

For the Mag Pulse Torp, it comments that it ignores shields. So, you might want to add that in. It also is not supposed to do any damage, which could be worked in as well.

Alternatively, create a Magnetic Pulse token card, and have the rules spelled out for the effect there. Much like an Ion Token.

For the Proton Rocket, I tend to agree Ravncat that the range should be dropped down to 1 - because even the larger vessels would just shoot down the incoming rockets, which is why they had to get in close. Especially true with starfighter to starfighter.

You could also word it to say the 3 bonus agil dice only apply to small ships. Or, Small ships get +3 Agil to defend. Medium ships get +1 Agil to defend.

Just some ideas.
 
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Michael Ptak
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There's only so much room on the card...

I have never seen anyone except the pilot fly in close to use Heavy Rockets on a target. As I recall, when NPC ships are making Rocket attacks at enemy starships they were well out of laser cannon range. Concussion missile launchers would counter-attack them, but otherwise they fired when they were out of range of their targets.

So the rocket MUST have long range to enable the equipped starfighter to attack it's targets. Range 3 is a concession to the X-Wing rules and doesn't reflect how the weapon was best used, beyond engagement range.

Now if all of your arguments were for the Space Bombs I can agree with you. At maximum range it would take forever to reach their targets and all the noteworthy performance quirks of the space bombs demand their delivery close to target.
 
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Michael Ptak
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Alrighty, tried to make some revisions to the Missile Boat.


The boost icon is an extrapolation based on squinty-vision extrapolation from the ones on the A-Wing and TIE Interceptor. Not sure how it works yet obviously but it should represent SLAMs.

I also made a token for it.


Some might notice the upgrade icon in the lower bar. This is an equipment item upgrade, which I could see being used in a few places (Like cloaking devices for example). Here is the infamous tractor beam to get people started.




The fighter itself might not be worth much, but a fully loaded Missile Boat with tractor beam comes up to 39 points.
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Michael Ptak
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Not quite from TIE Fighter unless you count the Vorknkx...



Thinking this could be used for the TIE Phantom and Emperor's Shuttle.
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Michael Ptak
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Any thoughts, folks? My next move was going to be either the assault gunboat or the T-Wing.

The preview into the Millenium Falcon cards help... Since boost doesn't work as well for Slams as I would have thought, perhaps I could make up a modification card that has SLAMS. Should it be something general, or restricted only to the Missile Boat and K-Wing?
 
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Michael Ptak
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Well, here it is. The Assault Gunboat. Image Courtesy of Fractalsponge, one of the greatest CG artists for Starwars equipment.





While it has a turret it's really intended to mount the NK-3 version. There's an added incentive for using it with the gunboat, because the gunboat can take it for free. It also has greater range than the Ion turret.



I thought about trying to cram special ion cannon rules on the card to allow for permanent disabling, but then I figured why not amend the general ion cannon rules? Say, if you manage to land more ion hits than the ship has hull points, then the ship is permanently disabled? There has to be some way to enable capture-and-board in these scenarios, to make them more interesting.
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Michael Ptak
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So... any thoughts folks? Anyone want to see anything specific?

I could do the Defender next... I seem to have the urge to make it the counterpart of the B-Wing. Both are heavily armed starship-gunships... the difference being that the TIE/D is fast but the B-W is slow. Perhaps the TIE/D is more fragile compared to the B-W as compensation? Both have equipment item slots? B-W has higher missile complement?

I'm also still working on space stations and capital ship rules. They're nearly done, but before I release them I'd like to have the base playtest template for the XQ platform ready.
 
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Sebastian Grawan
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I think you should do a Lamda Shuttle first. That would be a ship people actually CAN field on the table.

I really do love all the work you put into the EU ships, but without having any suitable models to proxy them, I can't see to use them in my games soon.
 
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Michael Ptak
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Mmh, didn't think about that. On the other hand I also don't think it's impossible without proxies. I was thinking about putting a top-down view of the particular fighter over the token to have some kind of representation. Maybe I should do that...
 
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Michael Ptak
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Another thing I should probably consider are movement dials...

But I have an idea for a compromise. Borrowing, I guess, from Wings of war I thought about putting together small 1x1" cards with manuvers printed on the back that players could use as proxies in place of a dial. Players would still need to go and select their maneuvers and it might be more things to keep track of, but it would be easier to assemble than a dial.

I suppose I could also re-create a dial, but with the movement cards all I could do is include a reference chart and players could grab one deck of these movement cards to use.

At least until someone makes a template for the dials? *shrug*
 
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Sebastian Grawan
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I think your idea of using movement tokens is good.
 
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Michael Ptak
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I want to resurrect this thread because I have some goodies now to put in it!





I don't really believe in going out of my way to give one faction symbol to the neutrals, but I thought I'd run with the dual-coloring NPCs seen in TIE Fighter and the X-Wing games. So, I present one of the pirate NPCs in TIE Fighter.

The intent here is to give players a possible third faction NPC to use in scenarios, and to give Y-Wings a little more punch potential (With the HLC). Y-Wings in the flight sims didn't have turrets, so I think the cannon upgrade works just fine.

Moreover you can use this on the Y-Wings you have sitting around not pretending to be Dutch or Horton.
 
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Cat O\'Mighty
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Ooh, I like the Pirate Y-Wing with HLC for a solid gunboat.
 
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