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Subject: About the Re-themes rss

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Todd Rowland
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So there's been a lot of rethemes posted up here and i wanted to step in officially as the publisher and say...

They're pretty darn cool!

Now, that said, all we ask out of respect for the designer (and well, us) please don't post entire sets where it could be print and play. Show a few, maybe have some in piles or arranged where they can't all be read. Very much like most have been here.

Anyway, we are extremely thrilled everyone likes the game so much, and we're glad you enjoy it enough to have made a small hobby out of rethemeing it. Thanks!
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Houserule Jay
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A very professional and friendly response to a possible concerning issue for sure thumbsup

If only GW had an ounce of the class you exhibit here

Now about that 5 - 6 player expansion...
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Sam Cook
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Any advice for obtaining a legitimate copy? All my FLGS's seem to be sold out, and I haven't seen any in stock online.
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Edward Bolme
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We are reprinting it as fast as we can.

I will post updates on alderac.com/tempest.
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Nobuaki Takerube
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We just tried with 5 players and found no problem.
Let's Try.
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Marc D
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Just want to say what a great game this is. Fun and doesn't over-stay its welcome. Perfectly portable. It's always in my bag now ready to be taught. And it's probably cheaper to buy than to print and play anyway (especially if you assign a value to the time you spend printing, cutting, and pasting).

And, if I may say, it has been a hit at my workplace where we exchange $10ish gifts around this time of year.
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Jim McMahon
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splanchnic wrote:
And, if I may say, it has been a hit at my workplace where we exchange $10ish gifts around this time of year.
Of course, that requires being able to find a copy...
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Todd Rowland
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Donkler wrote:
Any advice for obtaining a legitimate copy? All my FLGS's seem to be sold out, and I haven't seen any in stock online.


As Edward said we are reprinting and trying to get it in stores as quickly as possible. Even we were taken aback by the rapid sellout and popularity of the game. And fear not, as soon as it's headed to stores you better believe I'll be on here to tell you.
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Edward Bolme
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AEGTodd wrote:
... you better believe I'll be on here to tell you.


I won't. I'll be waiting for my copy!

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Houserule Jay
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matador wrote:
We just tried with 5 players and found no problem.
Let's Try.


I've played with 5 and 6, and think its actually more fun than with 4 players. I added 4 cards for 5 players, and 7 total for 6 players (to try and stay as close to the original balance as possible).

The one little thing I found especially with 6 is you are VERY susceptible to a "Witch Hunt" and in particular with the #1 Guard Cards, where you can be attacked 4 or even 5 times in a row if cards are out there.

In the 4 player game you can be targeted 3 times at most, and I think its best that way so I imposed the rule that a person can only be targeted at most 3 times in one round.

Other than that it works great so far in my plays but note I also added a 9 value card (which is now equivalent to Princess) and made a couple of the cards more aggressive, so its kind of in between the Japon Brand and the AEG now as far as rules
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Claus Jensen
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AEGTodd wrote:
So there's been a lot of rethemes posted up here and i wanted to step in officially as the publisher and say...

They're pretty darn cool!

Now, that said, all we ask out of respect for the designer (and well, us) please don't post entire sets where it could be print and play. Show a few, maybe have some in piles or arranged where they can't all be read. Very much like most have been here.

Anyway, we are extremely thrilled everyone likes the game so much, and we're glad you enjoy it enough to have made a small hobby out of rethemeing it. Thanks!


Now, if the boardgaming community can remain as classy as this publisher, and not print and play the rethemes, we'll actually have a true win-win.

For myself, I just missed getting a copy at the FLGS, and I'm waiting on mine so I can make my own retheme incidentally
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Jonathan Powell
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AEGTodd wrote:
Donkler wrote:
Any advice for obtaining a legitimate copy? All my FLGS's seem to be sold out, and I haven't seen any in stock online.


As Edward said we are reprinting and trying to get it in stores as quickly as possible. Even we were taken aback by the rapid sellout and popularity of the game. And fear not, as soon as it's headed to stores you better believe I'll be on here to tell you.


How overwhelmed have you been by the response to this game? It seems to have struck a chord/filled a niche. This seems like a game that could sneek into bigger retailers and have broader appeal and acceptance.
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Todd Rowland
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Yeah we are, in a weird way.

I mean, any game that you commit to publish you think is going to be really good. You wouldn't spend the effort and cash to do it unless you really believed in it. So on one level we knew Love Letter was a great little game. Even at Gen Con, months before the release at Essen, we were still playing it every morning at breakfast at the hotel. Not out of any playtesting need but just because we liked it. So we knew it had legs.

But even then you never know what will happen when the game hits the real market. We've had games that we personally really liked that turned out to be stinkers. Then we've had some that took off, and Love Letter has really taken off. Both it and Smash Up have had a phenomenal few months.
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R T
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You know, I think your worries are misguided. You imagine that people are just going to go use print-and-play copies and your company will lose sales. I've got news for you:

1.) In the age of the internet, you can't stop this kind of thing from happening. Anyone intent on making their own copy is going to do so.

2.) Lots of people are going to make a print-and-play copy to see if they like the game. If you have a good product, this will actually increase your sales because people want to have good quality cards to play with--common printers just don't make something as nice. Moreover, more people will have access to the game, news of it will spread, and even if the original person doesn't buy it someone else will.

3.) Love Letter is not staple product like eggs or milk that everyone buys. Your sales are primarily going to be determined by how much attention you can get for the product. Re-themes and other creative efforts people are giving the game increase this attention and should be encouraged. (You were very nice in the way you phrased it, but still it is like putting a wet blanket on the enthusiasm, and these people probably do think some people will print-and-play their artwork which is not a bad thing--see #2.)

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mateenyweeny
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I think that the thought is that if someone is going to put in the effort to make their own copy, they're probably more likely to respect the publisher and designer and buy a copy. Someone who just has to download the file/picture and hit print might not.

Just my thought.
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Houserule Jay
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Clavaine wrote:
You know, I think your worries are misguided. You imagine that people are just going to go use print-and-play copies and your company will lose sales. I've got news for you:

1.) In the age of the internet, you can't stop this kind of thing from happening. Anyone intent on making their own copy is going to do so.

2.) Lots of people are going to make a print-and-play copy to see if they like the game. If you have a good product, this will actually increase your sales because people want to have good quality cards to play with--common printers just don't make something as nice. Moreover, more people will have access to the game, news of it will spread, and even if the original person doesn't buy it someone else will.

3.) Love Letter is not staple product like eggs or milk that everyone buys. Your sales are primarily going to be determined by how much attention you can get for the product. Re-themes and other creative efforts people are giving the game increase this attention and should be encouraged. (You were very nice in the way you phrased it, but still it is like putting a wet blanket on the enthusiasm, and these people probably do think some people will print-and-play their artwork which is not a bad thing--see #2.)



I don't care how much extra PR a re-theme might generate, especially in a time where money isn't growing on trees, its likely not going to compensate for all the lost sales due to the files being readable available on a PDF or the like and VERY easy for anyone to print out. (Its still a lot of work but having the files is like half of it done)

If I was a Publisher I would have hopefully handled it exactly as Todd did here.
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R T
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I've seen lots of publishers do things that are against their own interest. I've legally purchased video games that would not run because of copy protection. I've legally purchased music with DRM that didn't allow me to play it. In both cases I returned them and wouldn't buy from those publishers again! Moreover, I told all my friends and they likely stayed away too.

I stand by my implication that they will make more money letting it go. I also stand by my assertion that anybody who wants a print and play copy of Love Letter can find one. (Try a Google search for "love letter print and play" and you will find several others sites which openly advertise print and play versions of the game.)

It's a brand new world. Publishers need to rethink their strategies or they'll go the way of the dinosaur. (Heck, I'm behind the times on a lot of this stuff. Things are changing so fast.)
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Houserule Jay
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Clavaine wrote:
(Try a Google search for "love letter print and play" and you will find several others sites which openly advertise print and play versions of the game.)


That's not very cool, and likely a copyright infringement for sure. Its one thing to make your own copy for personal use, which stays in your home etc, its a WHOLE other ball of wax when you start sharing it with others.

When a game has been out of print 10 years, or is completely in a language most can't use these things happen and its fairly tolerated overall I think, but sharing P&P copies of a new game like this, no I don't think that is going to fly so well. Not our call anyway.
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Greg
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jayjonbeach wrote:
Clavaine wrote:
(Try a Google search for "love letter print and play" and you will find several others sites which openly advertise print and play versions of the game.)


That's not very cool, and likely a copyright infringement for sure. Its one thing to make your own copy for personal use, which stays in your home etc, its a WHOLE other ball of wax when you start sharing it with others.

When a game has been out of print 10 years, or is completely in a language most can't use these things happen and its fairly tolerated overall I think, but sharing P&P copies of a new game like this, no I don't think that is going to fly so well. Not our call anyway.


Right there with you Jay.
 
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R T
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Please understand I'm not saying I would do that. I like to purchase games and support publishers. I have hundreds of CDs and DVDs and Blurays, all legally purchased.

My point is that anyone who doesn't want to spend money on the game can easily find it. I did the Google search to verify my suspicion. (And it turns out my suspicion was well founded--I didn't have to look past the first page of Google results.)

You think it isn't cool? I do too, but the people who are going to print-and-play a game without supporting the publisher ARE GOING TO DO THAT SEARCH.

Now, some of them will find that they like the game so much that they purchase it so they have nicer cards. And they will tell their friends about the game and some of them will buy the game. Some people will print-and-play to find out if they like the game. Then you'll get more sales from the people who liked it.

20 years ago I would agree with everything everyone else has written here. That was before everything was widely available on the internet, and the internet is populated by all kinds of people some of whom do not share our sense of morality. We all have to adjust to this new reality, even if we don't like it or don't want to admit it.

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Greg
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Don't know what you are selling dude but we're not buying.
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Clyde W
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Hahma wrote:
Don't know what you are selling dude but we're not buying.
He's selling you the truth.

Signed,
A guy that has this game on pre-order and has only played it once at BGGCON (ie, who hasn't pirated it)
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Greg
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clydeiii wrote:
Hahma wrote:
Don't know what you are selling dude but we're not buying.
He's selling you the truth.

Signed,
A guy that has this game on pre-order and has only played it once at BGGCON (ie, who hasn't pirated it)


Well yeah, I know that people pirate stuff and that Love Letter is no exception. He just sounds too slick for some reason to me, that's all. Like a salesman with some kind of motivation.

I bought my copy from Miniature Market when they had them in stock. Even though I could have waited until my most recent purchase of over $100 for free shipping, I paid the shipping that was about as much as the cost of the game just to get it while it was available.

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R T
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Slick? Wow, I didn't expect to be judged on this forum, but there you have it.

I'm just a regular person who likes board games posting my opinion along with some supporting evidence.

But, think what you wish if you're that suspicious. Peace.
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Justin
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Clavaine wrote:
Slick? Wow, I didn't expect to be judged on this forum, but there you have it.

Maybe the OP didn't expect their polite post to "get news for them" that it's a worried and misguided wet blanket, which indicates they don't know how to run their own business in their own best interest, and that they're going the way of the dinosaur. As the game is selling off the shelves. The internet is a crazy place!
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