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Glen More» Forums » Variants

Subject: Try one game without Lock Oich rss

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laudemar gonzalez
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Really. I've played the game about 20 times now, the last five WITHOUT Lock Oich. It's much, much more fun. Loch Oich is over-powered (read broken) in my opinion. I didn't realize how much it detracted from the game until I played without it. Perhaps you'll feel the same way?
 
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Huzonfirst
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Laudemar, have you seen this variant which I proposed?

Loch Oich Variant

Essentially, it says to ensure that Loch Oich is in the first half of the Phase 3 tiles. This eliminates near automatic decisions when Oich appears very late in the game (players almost always leap to the end and grab it) and also somewhat limits the power of the tile, since earlier displays don't have quite as many tiles to activate. You may want to try that out rather than remove the tile altogether.
 
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Tomo Sakata
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Port Coquitlam
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We've been putting Loch Oich in the 2nd deck all the time, as it's way too strong when appears in the late game, but you might be right, the game might be more interesting without it. I'll give it a try.
 
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laudemar gonzalez
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Yes, Larry, I did read your (excellent) post.

I just prefer to take it a step further as I believe the card to be too powerful irregardless of when it appears during the third round. The proof is in the fact that every single time it has come up in our games people have jumped to #1) get it for themselves and #2) Deny it to others who might benefit even more from getting it.

Of course, almost without exception in our close and tight games, he who gets it edges the others in points thanks to the boost in production/conversion/market sales and chief creation (from village activations) that the tile allows a player to perform.

It's just not the way I want this great game to be. I hope you try just one game without it. Cheers.
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Ben Bateson
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I'd say you guys are taking too many tiles.

A small tableau of <10 tiles will devalue Loch Oich, not just for yourself but in the context of the whole game. It will certainly rule out any abuse of the Markets.

Interestingly, we just played Glen More this afternoon, and I'd set up to take Loch Oich with the final turn of the game for ~16 points, but I couldn't muster the two resources to buy it!
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laudemar gonzalez
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I'd say you guys are taking too many tiles.

If you can get more than three points-worth of production from a tile you're not taking too many tiles. We typically end up with between 12 and 14 tiles (we've only played 2 and 3-player games, mind you).

The few times that the minimalist strategy was tried, it failed miserably because you just don't get enough activations and resources to convert into coins/whiskey/victory points. Granted, taking too many of the wrong (repeat/unexploitable) tiles is a losing strategy, but our last half-dozen games (before the last 5) were always close and we felt that Lock Oich spoiled all the hard work and tension.

It basically becomes a wait-and-hope ending. Not fun.
 
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Pasvik -
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Played always with it. But it never made - in my opinion - any change. It just showed up too late!!!
 
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Sonny Blount
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Had a 30 tile clan the other day and got loch oich. I won.

I'm not sure minimilism is all its cranked up to be.
 
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Ben Bateson
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Sonny Blount wrote:
Had a 30 tile clan the other day and got loch oich. I won.


You had some VERY generous and naive opponents, then.
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Maarten D. de Jong
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Or played according to a wrong rule. A 30 tile-clan...? How do you do that when taking into accout all the positioning rules: road, river, meeples...?
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Neil Christiansen
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It isn't possible.

There are only 72 tiles. 5 of them are home village tiles.

Even 2-player, you have the ghost die taking tiles.

Say the other human player skipped ahead the maximum possible. The ghost die still eats half the tiles.
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David desJardins
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chris1nd wrote:
Say the other human player skipped ahead the maximum possible. The ghost die still eats half the tiles.


The ghost die can move 3 (skipping your figure and 2 tiles). Then you can move 1, move 1, move 1 (skipping the ghost player). Then the ghost die moves 3. Then you move 1, move 1, move 1. Etc. You get (almost) 75% of the tiles. Of course you have to roll the maximum move a lot. With average rolls, you can only get 62% of the tiles.
 
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Sonny Blount
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3 players without the ghost die - we play sometimes with, sometimes without.

Actually I didn't get Loch Oich either, I took I think the 3 tam castle to finish.


I was trying to lose under the guise of trying 'a different strategy'. I won by 1 point. Been trying to make sure my gaming partners stick with this game so they need a few wins to maintain the enjoyment.
 
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Sonny Blount
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cymric wrote:
Or played according to a wrong rule. A 30 tile-clan...? How do you do that when taking into accout all the positioning rules: road, river, meeples...?


Positioning is pretty easy if you aren't chasing chieftan points hard at each scoring. With 1 meeple on a river and 1 on a road you can place any tile.
 
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Maarten D. de Jong
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Sonny Blount wrote:
I was trying to lose under the guise of trying 'a different strategy'. I won by 1 point. Been trying to make sure my gaming partners stick with this game so they need a few wins to maintain the enjoyment.

No, they need spanking for acting childish: losing is part of the game, and if the lose interest in a title because they lose they are clearly not old enough to play grown-up games to begin with. I recommend you switch to Candyland.

Sonny Blount wrote:
Positioning is pretty easy if you aren't chasing chieftan points hard at each scoring. With 1 meeple on a river and 1 on a road you can place any tile.

You are aware that you can only have 1 river and 1 road, right?
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Neil Christiansen
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DaviddesJ wrote:
chris1nd wrote:
Say the other human player skipped ahead the maximum possible. The ghost die still eats half the tiles.


The ghost die can move 3 (skipping your figure and 2 tiles). Then you can move 1, move 1, move 1 (skipping the ghost player). Then the ghost die moves 3. Then you move 1, move 1, move 1. Etc. You get (almost) 75% of the tiles. Of course you have to roll the maximum move a lot. With average rolls, you can only get 62% of the tiles.


But how many would the other player(s)have to take?

It would almost seem as if other player(s) would have to take sub-optimal moves just to jump ahead as far as possible (12).
 
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Ben Bateson
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Sonny Blount wrote:
3 players without the ghost die - we play sometimes with, sometimes without.


I rather think if you're not going to play by the rules in the rulebook, then you shouldn't come on here with an exposition of your high scores.

I scored 934 at Scrabble last week, but I wasn't making 'proper' words.
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Sonny Blount
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ousgg wrote:
Sonny Blount wrote:
3 players without the ghost die - we play sometimes with, sometimes without.


I rather think if you're not going to play by the rules in the rulebook, then you shouldn't come on here with an exposition of your high scores.

I scored 934 at Scrabble last week, but I wasn't making 'proper' words.


Sorry boss.

I never mentioned my score.
 
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Bruce Murphy
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You mentioned it was higher than everyone else's.

B>
 
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Neil Christiansen
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In fairness, we learned that one should not jump forward the maximum possible tiles without regard for what other players are doing or whether the tile is actually benificial.
 
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David desJardins
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chris1nd wrote:
In fairness, we learned that one should not jump forward the maximum possible tiles without regard for what other players are doing or whether the tile is actually benificial.


Sorry, that must be the best strategy, it forces your opponents to lose lots of points for all of the extra tiles they take.
 
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Bruce Murphy
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DaviddesJ wrote:
chris1nd wrote:
In fairness, we learned that one should not jump forward the maximum possible tiles without regard for what other players are doing or whether the tile is actually benificial. :p


Sorry, that must be the best strategy, it forces your opponents to lose lots of points for all of the extra tiles they take.


Well, why don't you give it a shot against someone with Loch Ness and a Tavern and let us know how it works for you.

B>
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Sonny Blount
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thepackrat wrote:
You mentioned it was higher than everyone else's.

B>


'everyone else' being 2 people in 1 game. 1 of them an 11yo. I laughed when it happened which is why I thought it amusing to relate.

Well thanks all for my first BGG interaction with jerks. I will get my future posts proofread to avoid any possible interpretation as an ego post in future.
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Ben Bateson
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Oh, man up a bit.

You've just come on here and posted something fairly extraordinary by the standards of the game but then admitted you weren't actually playing the rules a bit.

It's like saying: "I hit four sixes off Shane Bond the other week" and only later telling us "Mind you, he was blindfolded and bowling underarm off no run-up".
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Sonny Blount
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ousgg wrote:
Oh, man up a bit.

You've just come on here and posted something fairly extraordinary by the standards of the game but then admitted you weren't actually playing the rules a bit.

It's like saying: "I hit four sixes off Shane Bond the other week" and only later telling us "Mind you, he was blindfolded and bowling underarm off no run-up".


So?

I would certainly relate that story if it happened. It doesn't mean I am big noting. And the rule I was playing I picked up from here in a post from the designer.

If you've got an attitude about people relating unusual situations in boardgames on this forum you need to man up.

You were a jerk. It happens, we all do it from time to time.
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