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Dominion: Guilds» Forums » News

Subject: Previews #5 - Herald rss

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Donald X.
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How about that medieval Poland? At last we come to the final day of previews. Herald is another overpay card. I could only fit so many themes into 13 cards.

Herald varies from "+1 card +1 action" to essentially "+2 cards +2 actions," depending on your action density. Aim high, that's my advice. When you buy Herald, you get to stack the deck for your next hand. No peeking into your discard pile first to see if you want to buy Herald or not; sorry, them's the rules. But if you overpay by $3, you'll get to look through your discard pile three times; that's value for money. And you can use the overpay to put Heralds on top of your deck, and then when you play those Heralds sometimes they will announce more Heralds. It's Heralds all the way down.

Guilds has 8 more cards, and before long you will have seen them all. It will probably be available at Origins and will come out later this month in any case. It will probably show up on Goko about when it shows up in stores; I have been playtesting it. And then once people can buy it I will post a Secret History.
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Hans Broersen
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Another beauty.
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John O'Brien
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I find Golem one of the most risky cards, because it plays actions without you knowing exactly WHICH action it's playing. This is the same. Very interesting, and properly aimed it could be very powerful, but it's the times that it fails and plays the one action you didn't want that will provide most entertainment.
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Kev Hadman
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play this with rats in hand and you reveal a throne room...
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Bimmy Jim
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Wow.. this is a fantastic card.. it has synergy with so many other cards (Golem, for example)..

and it's even good on its own! Put a platinum on top of your deck by spending a coin.. or just use it for the chance to play a free action!
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Carl Bussema
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yukonhorror wrote:
play this with rats in hand and you reveal a throne room...


Presumably you didn't buy the Rats without a plan to get rid of them (I suppose they could been gifted via Ambassador...). Alternatively I suggest that if you have rats in hand, throne room in deck, and nothing in hand you want to trash, you consider not playing the Herald.
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Matthew Saloff
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InfoCynic wrote:
Alternatively I suggest that if you have rats in hand, throne room in deck, and nothing in hand you want to trash, you consider not playing the Herald.


Screw that!

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Allan Rathbone
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strayjohno wrote:
I find Golem one of the most risky cards, because it plays actions without you knowing exactly WHICH action it's playing. This is the same. Very interesting, and properly aimed it could be very powerful, but it's the times that it fails and plays the one action you didn't want that will provide most entertainment.


When you buy your second Herald, put the first on top. Ideally with a nice action chain underneath it. Not inherently amazing, but I think it has some absurd potential.
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Him
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Eugene
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Yup, I still want this set...
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J
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Ravensir wrote:
strayjohno wrote:
I find Golem one of the most risky cards, because it plays actions without you knowing exactly WHICH action it's playing. This is the same. Very interesting, and properly aimed it could be very powerful, but it's the times that it fails and plays the one action you didn't want that will provide most entertainment.


When you buy your second Herald, put the first on top. Ideally with a nice action chain underneath it. Not inherently amazing, but I think it has some absurd potential.


After which your turn will end and you'll draw both the Herald and the action card you put under it into your hand. 10 coins could set up something nice but that is very expensive.
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Ron Laufer
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OK, so when the "when buy" effect kicks in, is the herald you just bought in the discard pile yet? Or would it have to be a "when gain" like Inn to do that? i.e., can you pay 5 to buy a herald and put it on top?
 
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Roger Horner
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Ravensir wrote:
strayjohno wrote:
I find Golem one of the most risky cards, because it plays actions without you knowing exactly WHICH action it's playing. This is the same. Very interesting, and properly aimed it could be very powerful, but it's the times that it fails and plays the one action you didn't want that will provide most entertainment.


When you buy your second Herald, put the first on top. Ideally with a nice action chain underneath it. Not inherently amazing, but I think it has some absurd potential.


The problem is you will be drawing your next hand when you get the Herald, so unless you overpay by 7 (5 card hand plus the +1 card plus the action you want to draw), you can't control what action you draw. What you really need is one of the actions that let you stack the top of your deck, just don't forget the action you play will be the second card.
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Chris Schumann
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gonzoron wrote:
OK, so when the "when buy" effect kicks in, is the herald you just bought in the discard pile yet? Or would it have to be a "when gain" like Inn to do that? i.e., can you pay 5 to buy a herald and put it on top?

My understanding of the parts of the buy phase:
- Cash in any Coin tokens
- Play any Treasure cards (in order, resolving effects)
(Choose a card to buy)
- When you would buy
(buy happens here)
- When you buy (when Herald has an effect)
- When you would gain
(gain happens here)
*A* does card go in discard pile here?
- When you gain
*B* or does card go in discard pile here?

In either case, I think you may put a Herald you just bought on your deck.

Overpaying by two would let you put the Herald an another Action on your deck, but yeah, the cards it draws are much further down.
 
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Chris Schumann
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My question for Herald is what happens to the revealed card. If it's not an Action, it's pretty clear that it goes back (otherwise it would say to discard it).

If that card is an Action, does it go back after it's played, or does it go "in play" to later be discarded during cleanup?
 
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Philip Eve
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Whizkid wrote:
My question for Herald is what happens to the revealed card. If it's not an Action, it's pretty clear that it goes back (otherwise it would say to discard it).

If that card is an Action, does it go back after it's played, or does it go "in play" to later be discarded during cleanup?


Throne Room says "Choose an action card in your hand; play it twice". It doesn't go back to your hand after being played, but the card doesn't have to tell you this. It's implicit that it goes in the play area. So this card is presumably the same.
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Ben Vögel
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I've been on this site for 10 years now, and I'm far from sick of games, but I think I am, to some degree, sick of learning too many new games. I'm also tired of playing 4+ hr multiplayer games, but I'll still happily play really long games 2 player.
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If I didn't have 7 sets previous to trust their playtesting and judgment, I would be convinced that this card is way overpowered and under-priced.
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Pawel Pawlak
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Whizkid wrote:
My question for Herald is what happens to the revealed card. If it's not an Action, it's pretty clear that it goes back (otherwise it would say to discard it).

If that card is an Action, does it go back after it's played, or does it go "in play" to later be discarded during cleanup?

Well, do non-Golem Action cards revealed by Golem go back after playing them, or do they rest in the play area waiting to be discarded during cleanup?
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Pawel Pawlak
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Whizkid wrote:
gonzoron wrote:
OK, so when the "when buy" effect kicks in, is the herald you just bought in the discard pile yet? Or would it have to be a "when gain" like Inn to do that? i.e., can you pay 5 to buy a herald and put it on top?

My understanding of the parts of the buy phase:
- Cash in any Coin tokens
- Play any Treasure cards (in order, resolving effects)
(Choose a card to buy)
- When you would buy
(buy happens here)
- When you buy (when Herald has an effect)
- When you would gain
(gain happens here)
*A* does card go in discard pile here?
- When you gain
*B* or does card go in discard pile here?

In either case, I think you may put a Herald you just bought on your deck.

I think not, because you must fully resolve "on buy" effect before proceeding to gaining the card you've just bought.

Per analogy, it was discussed in a thread about Ironworks and Trader, and Donald wrote:
Quote:
In fact any when-buy effects have already completely resolved before you even reveal Trader.
(As we know that Trader's "when-would-gain" happens after "when buy" and before "when gain".) So, the Herald you've just bought still sits on its supply pile when you look through your discard and topdeck a card. After that, you gain your Herald.
 
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Donald X.
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gonzoron wrote:
OK, so when the "when buy" effect kicks in, is the herald you just bought in the discard pile yet? Or would it have to be a "when gain" like Inn to do that? i.e., can you pay 5 to buy a herald and put it on top?

When-buy, which includes overpay, triggers before gaining, so you can't buy a Herald and use its overpay to put that very Herald on top of your deck.
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Donald X.
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Whizkid wrote:
My question for Herald is what happens to the revealed card. If it's not an Action, it's pretty clear that it goes back (otherwise it would say to discard it).

If that card is an Action, does it go back after it's played, or does it go "in play" to later be discarded during cleanup?

If the revealed card is an Action, it goes into play. If it's not an Action, it goes back on top of your deck.
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Clive J
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shaveandahaircut wrote:
If I didn't have 7 sets previous to trust their playtesting and judgment, I would be convinced that this card is way overpowered and under-priced.

On the one hand, someone with four Platinum and a +buy in their discard pile can spend nine to buy a Herald and topdeck them, then buy a Colony plus another overspent Herald every turn until the end of the game.

On the other hand, someone with four Platinum in their discard pile can do pretty much whatever they want, anyway. They could achieve much the same effect by trashing down to a small deck, by spending their $20 plus a couple more from somewhere on two Colonies, etc.

On the other other hand, it looks like a lovely hand for a variety of nifty combos. I mean, who wouldn't spend $6 on a Herald when they have two Treasure Maps in their discard pile, for example. (-8
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Todd Warnken
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clivej wrote:
On the other other hand, it looks like a lovely hand for a variety of nifty combos. I mean, who wouldn't spend $6 on a Herald when they have two Treasure Maps in their discard pile, for example. (-8


I really like that combo.
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Matt E
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donaldx wrote:
It will probably show up on Goko about when it shows up in stores; I have been playtesting it.


I'm assuming that they've finally had to fix their Buy/Gain issues? Otherwise you'll be able to hit your new Doctors and Heralds with their own overpay abilities.
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Donald X.
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LastFootnote wrote:
I'm assuming that they've finally had to fix their Buy/Gain issues? Otherwise you'll be able to hit your new Doctors and Heralds with their own overpay abilities.

They are both working fine on the secret version.
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Moosey
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Man, you need to continue coming out with Dominion expansions, not so that we can have the cards, but so that we can continue to read your preview card explanations before the expansions come out. King Casimir III would have wanted it that way.
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