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Subject: Can you/how to share factions ? rss

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Michael None
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We play (buy ) like this in Warhammer invasion that Damian has 2 factions, Bartek has only dwarfs and so on. We divide factions amongst players and everybody has its own cards. It works great, you spend a fraction of the money and you have all cards for you faction.

Can you do that in SW:LCG ? I mean as far as I read new faction(s?) are on its way. So is it possible (playable) with this game ?
Eg. smugglers can play against the dark side or Jedi against the good guys ?
Moreover is there really a problem about those objectives ? (they are neutrals?)
 
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Chris Nutt
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There aren't many, but there are a few neutral objective sets.

This game is purely Light Side Vs Dark Side, you can't do Jedi Vs. Rebels.

Smugglers and Spies and Scum and Villainy are in the core set and Hoth Cycle, but they don't have too many cards yet compared to the other 4 factions, but they will become viable once they get more Objective Sets in the upcoming Edge of Darkness expansion.

Smugglers are characters like Han Solo, they are a Light side faction and can only go up against Dark Side opponents.
Scum and Villainy are the Bounty Hunters and thus a Dark Side faction and can only go against Light side opponents.

Honestly, there are 4 Hoth cylce packs out and 1 core set, the cost isn't too great at the moment but if you want to split factions between a group then go ahead!
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Michael None
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Thanks for you explanation.

The fact that its only good guys vs bad guys complicates things a bit :surpriseshake It was like that in Star Wars ccg as well, but only in theory. We successfully played bad guys vs bad guys multiple times (only some cards were useless then).

So to sum up : we have 6 playable factions now

A : Jedi, Rebels, Smugglers
B : Sith, Empire Navy, Villains

Any faction A can play successfully against B and vice versa ? (of course on assumption that Smugglers and Villains get their big box expansion).
In that case the best solution is to divide it for 3 players, each one gets one A & one B faction. How about those objectives in such a situation ? Would there be a problem ?
 
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Chris Nutt
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Yeah.

The way tournament play works that you play one game as Faction A and one game as faction B.

The game is all about the Death Star dial and control of the force, so because of the game mechanics it gets really messy when you try and have two of factions A or B fighting against each other.

However, in an upcoming expansion, hopefully before Christmas, we should get the multiplayer expansion set which is 2 (or 3) light side vs 1 Dark side player.
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You don't seem to understand how factions work in this game. Rather than Game of Thrones houses, they're more like the colors in Magic. Yes you can build a straight green (Navy) deck or a straight black (Sith) deck, but you can also include both, and will usually be more successful if you do. Collecting the cards of only one faction would hamstring your deckbuiding choices horrendously. Not to mention, if you want to play in tourneys, you have to bring a deck for each side.

As for matching decks from the same side against each other, no, you really can't. The sides work too differently - light vs light would have no timer dial at all, and dark vs dark would have two!
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Michael None
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The Gas wrote:
You don't seem to understand how factions work in this game. Rather than Game of Thrones houses, they're more like the colors in Magic. Yes you can build a straight green (Navy) deck or a straight black (Sith) deck, but you can also include both, and will usually be more successful if you do. Collecting the cards of only one faction would hamstring your deckbuiding choices horrendously.



Hmm is it not because of limited cardpool ? How do you pay for card out of your faction, eg. Sith if your deck is mainly Empire ?
In WH:I there was a time when it was worth to mix factions, but when you have more cards you do not have a place in your deck for anything that is not related.
I imagine that it would be similar in SW with new expansions, you would have "lightsaber" or "walkers" deck with no or little place for other cards. But I do not know.

About MtG... heh I remember the good ol' times when monocolor decks were the way to go !
Now (I mean this century) those multicolor cards ruin it.
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Chris Nutt
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At the start of the game you bring out 3 objectives into play. Those 3 objectives will help with resource match as will your faction card. You need to use at least one Sith resource to pay for a Sith card and so on. Watch the FFG tutorial to find out how the game works and plays.
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Michael D'Amico
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shrimpgoblin wrote:
The Gas wrote:
You don't seem to understand how factions work in this game. Rather than Game of Thrones houses, they're more like the colors in Magic. Yes you can build a straight green (Navy) deck or a straight black (Sith) deck, but you can also include both, and will usually be more successful if you do. Collecting the cards of only one faction would hamstring your deckbuiding choices horrendously.



Hmm is it not because of limited cardpool ? How do you pay for card out of your faction, eg. Sith if your deck is mainly Empire ?
In WH:I there was a time when it was worth to mix factions, but when you have more cards you do not have a place in your deck for anything that is not related.
I imagine that it would be similar in SW with new expansions, you would have "lightsaber" or "walkers" deck with no or little place for other cards. But I do not know.

About MtG... heh I remember the good ol' times when monocolor decks were the way to go !
Now (I mean this century) those multicolor cards ruin it.

WH:I also has the benefit of years of expansion cycles. Maybe in a year or two, once Star Wars has some Force Cycles and deluxe expansions under its belt there will be more single-faction opportunities.
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Matt Lernout
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Dividing factions between three players will work perfectly fine. Each faction (well, after the first Deluxe Expansion arrives to round out the Smuggler and Scum factions) can play just fine on their own with their own pool of cards. They will not be the strongest possible decks, but they will play completely on-theme and be relatively balanced pools in a vacuum.

Neutral cards will be the only thing you will have to put thought into when divvying up the cards - just as the neutrals in Warhammer:Invasion were.

It will be a very similar experience to what you had with WH:I with the exception being that the game is specifically designed as Light Side VS Dark Side, even more so than previous Star Wars card games, since the winning conditions for both sides are not symmetrical and the cards are designed with this in mind.
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Michael None
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BakaMattSu wrote:


Neutral cards will be the only thing you will have to put thought into when divvying up the cards - just as the neutrals in Warhammer:Invasion were.



Hehehe that is where clever mechanics click. Who buys an expansion gets the neutrals. It encouraged people in my gaming group to buy.
 
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Owen Compton
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I'm not sure anyone in the thread's entirely suggested this exact breakdown.

So there are two of you? Why not just one of you collect all the Dark Side cards and one of you collect all the Light Side stuff? That way your match-ups are always legal AND you get the benefit of being able to use all three of the Dark Side factions in your deck. So if you take the Dark Side and play Sith primarily, but see this really awesome Imperial Navy objective set then you can take that and thus you've got access to the entire card pool for one side and still get to split the cost on buying things.

Just in case this hasn't already been made clear, Neutral cards are also split into Light Side and Dark Side, so you can't use Light Side Neutral objective sets in a Dark Side deck, therefore you won't even have that problem with collecting all of one side. So why are some cards considered "neutral" if they can't be used by both sides? It's not to do with who can use them, it's to do with the fact that Neutral cards don't require any specific faction in order to pay their deployment cost. To explain this further, if you want to play a Sith card then one of the resources you use to pay the cost with must be a Sith resource (the rest can be anything) if you don't have any Sith resources in play then you can't play that Sith card - with Neutral cards then you never have to provide a specific resource affiliation from anywhere in order to play them, hence "neutral".
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Michael None
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The Sacred Voice wrote:
I'm not sure anyone in the thread's entirely suggested this exact breakdown.

So there are two of you? Why not just one of you collect all the Dark Side cards and one of you collect all the Light Side stuff? That way your match-ups are always legal AND you get the benefit of being able to use all three of the Dark Side factions in your deck. So if you take the Dark Side and play Sith primarily, but see this really awesome Imperial Navy objective set then you can take that and thus you've got access to the entire card pool for one side and still get to split the cost on buying things.


At the moment it is only me But I will (hopefully) get two other guys involved in this.
About sharing it Light/Dark for 2 players. We have tried this with Android Netrunner. I had the runner cards and D had corporate. It did not work.
I was angry that I could not present this game to some other guy, "yes I bought 2x core sets and an expansion but we can not play it cause I have only 3 good guys factions and you must have a bad guy affiliation to play".
Btw I am the one who always has to take the good guys in games, because everybody else think they suck (in theme/fluff).
So there is no way I am going to resign from Storm Troopers this time.
 
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Pauli Vinni
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It may be interesting when the second deluxe expansion arrives. It may in theory allow four player game, where one Light side player plays pure Jedi deck (with neutrals), one plays Rebel deck (with neutrals) and third Smugler deck (with neutrals) against one "Dark" emperor with access to all dark side pods... I may be interesting :-) Just rotate the Dark emperor from time to time. This woud suite to your gaming group gaming style guite nicely!
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Brandon Hay
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You may have 3 players that want to play, but in actuality it will only be 2 players playing at one time correct? There is an easy way to handle this dilemma, our playing group does it like this.

1. Firstly, the design of this game lends itself to the fact that there really should be two matches played within a gaming session. Each player plays once as the Light Side and once as the Dark. This is because of the asynch style of the game, giving both players an opportunity to experience both.

2. Because of this the players need to build 2 decks each session, one LS and one DS... this can be a problem with a limited or shared supply of cards because those decks may overlap (the same issue I believe you are trying to overcome by assigning factions to individual players)

3. Another issue with assigning factions is it takes away the factor of surprise... you need to build a deck that can beat all factions, not build one that does well against a certain faction... flipping over the faction card at the beginning of the game should be the first time you KNOW what faction that player is going with.

So... how do you handle this dilemma? easy, www.cardgamedb.com . What a player does is build his 2 decks, ls and ds, in the deckbuilder program on the website (beautiful program, works FANTASTIC) he has at his disposal an entire list of all PODs available to the gaming group. After the deck is built you can save it as a text file and print it. Our players show up for the games with their printed deck lists, then you just pull the PODs you are using for that round and build your deck nice and quick. If you have a nice way of storing the cards for easy access this can take less than 5 minutes before the first game, and 5 minutes between the first and second game when you switch LS to DS or vise versa.

If you have 2 players you will need 2 x Core and 1 x Force Packs, if you have 4 players and are running two games side by side it's 4 x Core and 2 x FP to ensure no overlap and so on. This is an easy way to give all players access to all Factions and allows you to play the game the way it should be played with shared card resources.
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Michael None
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Hannibal_pjv wrote:
It may be interesting when the second deluxe expansion arrives. It may in theory allow four player game, where one Light side player plays pure Jedi deck (with neutrals), one plays Rebel deck (with neutrals) and third Smugler deck (with neutrals) against one "Dark" emperor with access to all dark side pods... I may be interesting :-) Just rotate the Dark emperor from time to time. This woud suite to your gaming group gaming style guite nicely!


! Sounds very good. They add multiplayer for Wh:inavasion as well.
So it seems only as a matter of time that we will see multiplayer version of Netrunner

drfaustus420 wrote:


So... how do you handle this dilemma? easy, www.cardgamedb.com . What a player does is build his 2 decks, ls and ds, in the deckbuilder program on the website (beautiful program, works FANTASTIC) he has at his disposal an entire list of all PODs available to the gaming group. After the deck is built you can save it as a text file and print it. Our players show up for the games with their printed deck lists, then you just pull the PODs you are using for that round and build your deck nice and quick. If you have a nice way of storing the cards for easy access this can take less than 5 minutes before the first game, and 5 minutes between the first and second game when you switch LS to DS or vise versa.




I nerver use army/deck builders and similiar programs.
I spend enough time in front of the screen already
But your gaming group is very disciplined to follow this pattern

But the second thing you write about may be a problem. In Wh:I any faction can play against any faction, and here ... there will be killer "sided" decks for particular opponent.
 
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Brandon Hay
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ok... well in that case I would say Yea, assign a faction to each person and enjoy 16.66% of the game available to you. I mean you can DO whatever you want, you own the game, but only using a single faction all the time, or never using a dual faction mixed deck takes a lot of the fun out of the game.
 
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Michael None
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drfaustus420 wrote:
ok... well in that case I would say Yea, assign a faction to each person and enjoy 16.66% of the game available to you. I mean you can DO whatever you want, you own the game, but only using a single faction all the time, or never using a dual faction mixed deck takes a lot of the fun out of the game.


Hmmm
So, is it better not to buy it at all than divide factions ?
Maybe I make too much assumptions based on Wh:I (which plays good even with only two factions). Maybe you are right, a serious disadvantage for me is this Light vs Dark only style of play.
 
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I'd say Brandon's overstating it just a bit when he says sticking to a single faction and never mixing will take most of the fun out of the game.

You can have a lot of fun sticking to one faction in very similar ways to how you would in WH:I. If you were fine with how each faction played there, you'll be fine here as well. In both games, each faction follows thematic trends and has their own strengths and weaknesses, such as Sith/Jedi excelling at the force struggle/control styles, Imperial Navy/Rebels very capable when it comes to outright nuking objectives, and Smugglers/Scum being the wildcard trickery factions.

You'll miss out on the different ways the game plays with each faction by sticking to one, but if that didn't bother you in WH:I, I don't see it bothering you in Star Wars, Game of Thrones, Magic: The Gathering, or just about any card game that involves card division in this way.
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Michael None
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BakaMattSu wrote:
In both games, each faction follows thematic trends and has their own strengths and weaknesses, such as Sith/Jedi excelling at the force struggle/control styles, Imperial Navy/Rebels very capable when it comes to outright nuking objectives, and Smugglers/Scum being the wildcard trickery factions.

You'll miss out on the different ways the game plays with each faction by sticking to one, but if that didn't bother you in WH:I,


At this point in WH:I (36 small expansions, 3-4 big boxes) it is not worth to mix factions. Chaos mixed with sth else makes combos but mixing (like eg. 40% of deck is faction A and 60% B) is imho not a good idea to win. Of course you can still include few cards from other faction if they are powerful. In GoT it is similar or even harder to mix. Guys from my gaming group still play it (hate the hype around tv series [at least in Poland] so sold this) and nobody mixes, you must use an agenda and it is not worth it.

Can you please describe me SW factions (decks they tend to make) in MtG archetypes ?
(aggro - rush etc.)
 
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Matt Lernout
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shrimpgoblin wrote:
Can you please describe me SW factions (decks they tend to make) in MtG archetypes ?


Here's my attempt, although not perfect. :p

Sith - Classic Control (mostly like Blue-Black). They have good card filtering options to dig for what you need, access to quite a chunk of direct removal, and are great at locking down the board, throwing up barriers and going for the kill once they've got the upper hand. They also have a small hand manipulation/discard subtheme. Defensive styled.

Imperial Navy - Aggro or Ramp/Stompy (mostly like Green-Red, but lacking in direct burn options). These guys are the best resource producers in the game, have the option of build swarm stlye overrun decks with TIEs/Troops or powering out heavy guns like Star Destroyers early to mid game. Where they lack Sith's ability to establish a full lockdown, they make up in pure by-the-numbers power and/or rush. Offensive styled.

Scum and Villany - Combo(?) From what's released and what previews we've been shown, these are the guys who are for the player who loves to pull off crazy stuff that might not be reliable all the time, but is jaw-dropping when it works. Many of their cards are designed to work conditionally off of other game states such as captured cards or specific card types, and they often shortcut or "break the rules". Wildcard styled.

Jedi - Control/Tempo (mostly like White-Blue). Like Sith, these guys work at establishing a lock on the board and then going for the win. However, they usually accomplish this more by protecting and enhancing their own guys to do the work than by using removal, although they do have a few soft options to temporarily slow opposition. They've got more counterspell-type options than any other faction, and decent draw options.

Rebel Alliance - Aggro (mostly Red). The Rebels are mostly weenie units with a few exceptions. For the most part their units are expendable and throwaway in order to push out damage and beat the clock, since they lack the heavy guns the Jedi have to maintain control of the force and slow the game. Since the game's resource mechanic differs from Magic, they don't exactly play like a traditional aggro deck would, but it's usually based on overwhelming by numbers or squeaking a win by with tactical play. They've got the most flexible direct burn card at the moment and can run as many as four copies (Rebel Assault).

Smugglers & Spies - Toolbox(?) Like Scum, we haven't felt the full flavor of these guys until the first Deluxe Expansion featuring both factions hits. And again, like Scum, these are the oddballs of the light side - the ones that bring complete game-changers to the table and force the opponent to entirely rethink what they're going to do. From what we've seen so far, they're quite flexible and bring a good array of effects not accesible to Jedi or Sith.


In overly generalized terms, Sith and Jedi would be Control, Rebels and Imperials are Aggro, and Scum and Smugglers are Combo.
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Michael Schwarz
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BakaMattSu wrote:
shrimpgoblin wrote:
Can you please describe me SW factions (decks they tend to make) in MtG archetypes ?


Here's my attempt, although not perfect.

Scum and Villany - Combo(?) From what's released and what previews we've been shown, these are the guys who are for the player who loves to pull off crazy stuff that might not be reliable all the time, but is jaw-dropping when it works. Many of their cards are designed to work conditionally off of other game states such as captured cards or specific card types, and they often shortcut or "break the rules". Wildcard styled.

Smugglers & Spies - Toolbox(?) Like Scum, we haven't felt the full flavor of these guys until the first Deluxe Expansion featuring both factions hits. And again, like Scum, these are the oddballs of the light side - the ones that bring complete game-changers to the table and force the opponent to entirely rethink what they're going to do. From what we've seen so far, they're quite flexible and bring a good array of effects not accesible to Jedi or Sith.


Scum almost appears to be a kind of Blue/White Exile mechanic so far.

Smugglers and Spies seems to be a kind of Red/Blue Control scheme, with some pumping mechanics, and a bit of direct damage.

I would argue that between Superlaser Blast and Orbital Bombardment, Navy actually has some very nice direct burn... but... *shrugs*
 
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Michael None
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BakaMattSu wrote:
shrimpgoblin wrote:
Can you please describe me SW factions (decks they tend to make) in MtG archetypes ?


Here's my attempt, although not perfect.


It looks great ! Many thanks (although I can give only one thumb up).
What do you mean with rebels and 4 cards ? They may have 4 copies of a particular card in a deck ?
 
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StarkeRealm wrote:
Scum almost appears to be a kind of Blue/White Exile mechanic so far.

Smugglers and Spies seems to be a kind of Red/Blue Control scheme, with some pumping mechanics, and a bit of direct damage.


As I tried to disclaimer, Scum and Smugglers aren't fully easy to define just yet because we've only had a small taste. Of my analyses, they're probably the two factions I'm least confident in drawing comparisons to archetypes. That said, I find capturing more comparable to a sort of tempo/bounce effect than exile, since the LS usually has the opportunity to get the captured cards back. If you're referring to white's suite of "temporary" exiles ala Journey to Nowhere or Oblivion Ring, I can see where you're coming from, but straight up exiling like Path to Exile and Swords to Plowshares aren't something I've seen Scum do yet.

Quote:
I would argue that between Superlaser Blast and Orbital Bombardment, Navy actually has some very nice direct burn... but... *shrugs*


I'd draw an easier comparison of Orbital Bombardment to Green's Overrun style cards than classify it as direct damage. Sure, it turns your units into wrecking balls, but you still have to have units and enter engagements to deal it out. When I think burn, it's more akin to tossing damage straight at something.

Superlaser Blast I'd agree is comparable to a direct burn.

shrimpgoblin wrote:
What do you mean with rebels and 4 cards ? They may have 4 copies of a particular card in a deck ?


Sorry for any confusion caused by that. All factions currently follow the same restrictions for deckbuilding.

Some cards appear in more than one objective set, so if you include all of those sets, you get all of them. "Rebel Assault", the event I was referring to that deals direct damage, is one such card.
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Michael Schwarz
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BakaMattSu wrote:
StarkeRealm wrote:
Scum almost appears to be a kind of Blue/White Exile mechanic so far.

Smugglers and Spies seems to be a kind of Red/Blue Control scheme, with some pumping mechanics, and a bit of direct damage.


As I tried to disclaimer, Scum and Smugglers aren't fully easy to define just yet because we've only had a small taste. Of my analyses, they're probably the two factions I'm least confident in drawing comparisons to archetypes. That said, I find capturing more comparable to a sort of tempo/bounce effect than exile, since the LS usually has the opportunity to get the captured cards back. If you're referring to white's suite of "temporary" exiles ala Journey to Nowhere or Oblivion Ring, I can see where you're coming from, but straight up exiling like Path to Exile and Swords to Plowshares aren't something I've seen Scum do yet.


Yeah, I honestly don't think we'll see true exiling in the game. That's a mechanic that can get out of hand pretty easily, and really isn't the kind of thing you want to build an entire faction around. But, the ability to recover captured cards means it's much harder to completely lockout a player, while still having an exile like ability set.

There's also stuff coming, like the Sarlac eating captives, suggesting, in the long term, captives will be an entirely different resource for Scum.

But, Exile's probably the easiest way to describe it at a glance.

EDIT: Sorry, I was just thinking of Orbital bombardment as doing two damage on it's own, for some reason, and forgot that it was an extra blast icon on everyone. Now I'm kinda wondering what card I was thinking of.
 
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Brandon Hay
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New FP has a S&V card, Cloud City Incinerator, that allows you to discard the captured units instead of capturing them at objectives, as long as the Balance is with the DS. Love the idea of taking your captured units down to the incinerator and making them disappear.
 
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